Emissions update (still failing, help?)
03-02-04, 01:10 AM
#26
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Originally posted by MaYnard5000
Its from my autotech book, theres about 60 pages in it devoted to how emissions work and emissions troubleshooting and repair.
Its from my autotech book, theres about 60 pages in it devoted to how emissions work and emissions troubleshooting and repair.
so i'm going on memory. which is why all my advice should be ignored. 
03-02-04, 01:12 AM
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I wuv my autotech book 
I'm lookin right now to see if theres anything else that could help.
I'm lookin right now to see if theres anything else that could help.
Last edited by MaYnard5000; 03-02-04 at 01:14 AM.
03-02-04, 01:14 AM
#28
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Originally posted by gsracer
why not try leaning out your idle with the safc?
why not try leaning out your idle with the safc?
03-02-04, 01:19 AM
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Originally posted by gsracer
why not try leaning out your idle with the safc?
why not try leaning out your idle with the safc?
read my first post, i did... i leaned 1000 rpm out to -16 and 2000 to 4000 rpms to -20
03-02-04, 01:21 AM
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Originally posted by casio
what does your car idle at anyways? i *think* you should be safe to adjust your idle a little leaner. like i said, it'd be nice to see the O2 readings (assuming your exhaust doesnt have any leaks).
what does your car idle at anyways? i *think* you should be safe to adjust your idle a little leaner. like i said, it'd be nice to see the O2 readings (assuming your exhaust doesnt have any leaks).
normally it idles at 700-800, but when it was leaned out like i said in my first post, my test idle was 510... the O2% for idle was 0.38
03-02-04, 01:22 AM
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Less premix means you'll have a little less (insert relevent chemical name here) in your exhaust.
The common approach is to run your tank right down to near empty. You'll have to forgive me (and do your own conversions) as I'm a metric guy.
I let my tank run down to about 5 liters, then dumped in 2 liters of methyl hydrate. Halfway to the emissions testing center, I noticed the effect.
The car was barely idling. Now, be warned: they're supposed to refuse to test it when it's like that. But these guys didn't (bunch of kids.)
This was my 2nd try - the same shop had failed me on test #1. My curb idle HC was 5 times the limit. Everything else passed. I had a hi-flow cat on, btw. All other emissions equip was on (but I didn't know that the EGR was totally clogged and inoperative.)
2nd try - all curb idle readings passed with flying colours. My 'road' portion was a little different. HC ppm was right at the limit - 125.
Bottom line: the methyl hydrate brought my HC from 506 down to 125ppm for the 'road' portion. My idle HC went from 190 to 71ppm.
My CO% went from 5.37 to 0.07% for the 'road' portion and from 0.03 to 0.02ppm for the idle portion.
So this **** works.
Now, the concentration that I had the methyl hydrate at was pretty damn steep. If you're on the verge of passing, and it sound like you are, go for a leaner mix. The kids at the shop I went to (an oil changing shack) didn't know any better, and never even opened the hood to check if the emissions equipment was intact. But in case you go somewhere that does know better... it would help if your 7 wasn't struggling to idle.
The common approach is to run your tank right down to near empty. You'll have to forgive me (and do your own conversions) as I'm a metric guy.
I let my tank run down to about 5 liters, then dumped in 2 liters of methyl hydrate. Halfway to the emissions testing center, I noticed the effect.
The car was barely idling. Now, be warned: they're supposed to refuse to test it when it's like that. But these guys didn't (bunch of kids.)
This was my 2nd try - the same shop had failed me on test #1. My curb idle HC was 5 times the limit. Everything else passed. I had a hi-flow cat on, btw. All other emissions equip was on (but I didn't know that the EGR was totally clogged and inoperative.)
2nd try - all curb idle readings passed with flying colours. My 'road' portion was a little different. HC ppm was right at the limit - 125.
Bottom line: the methyl hydrate brought my HC from 506 down to 125ppm for the 'road' portion. My idle HC went from 190 to 71ppm.
My CO% went from 5.37 to 0.07% for the 'road' portion and from 0.03 to 0.02ppm for the idle portion.
So this **** works.
Now, the concentration that I had the methyl hydrate at was pretty damn steep. If you're on the verge of passing, and it sound like you are, go for a leaner mix. The kids at the shop I went to (an oil changing shack) didn't know any better, and never even opened the hood to check if the emissions equipment was intact. But in case you go somewhere that does know better... it would help if your 7 wasn't struggling to idle.
03-02-04, 01:25 AM
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could you lean it out more. if you're running rich, you're running rich. if this isnt the problem, than i of course would not say to lean it out more. i wish i knew all the other diagnostic measurements to take. for instance, your air/fuel ratio may be fine, but your spark could suck or your compression could be low. i think an egt measurement would also help, though i dont know ideal temps versus danger zones and everything inbetween.
03-02-04, 01:28 AM
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so if i was to do the alcohol then i'd probably not have to or want to lean it out with the s-afc right? i mean if it idles that bad with the alcohol the s-afc leaning might cause my car to die.. i ran it at -16 but at -19/-20 it sounded like it wanted to die, ive taken it to -25 before however and it didnt die, though it started to shake pretty bad
03-02-04, 01:32 AM
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Originally posted by casio
could you lean it out more. if you're running rich, you're running rich. if this isnt the problem, than i of course would not say to lean it out more. i wish i knew all the other diagnostic measurements to take. for instance, your air/fuel ratio may be fine, but your spark could suck or your compression could be low. i think an egt measurement would also help, though i dont know ideal temps versus danger zones and everything inbetween.
could you lean it out more. if you're running rich, you're running rich. if this isnt the problem, than i of course would not say to lean it out more. i wish i knew all the other diagnostic measurements to take. for instance, your air/fuel ratio may be fine, but your spark could suck or your compression could be low. i think an egt measurement would also help, though i dont know ideal temps versus danger zones and everything inbetween.
well, if i drove there with it leaned at -16 again, i suppose i could run it at -19 once i arrived and hope my car stays within the acceptable idle range, cuz at -16 i had to hold in the clutch to get it to idle within the acceptable range, and i was idling at 510, i think you had to be at least 480 or something like that... now here's the weird part, i have a a/f ratio gauge, and even though it was leaned out so much the a/f ratio gauge seemed to be reading the same as before, of course this is on narrow band so that might be why
03-02-04, 01:33 AM
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I can't comment on the S-AFC. I don't know enough about it. Alcohol/methyl hydrate burns incredibly cleanly. If you run with a leaner mixture of methyl hydrate than I did, and she idles poorly, how about increasing the fuel on the S-AFC a smidge and seeing if that corrects it?
03-02-04, 01:38 AM
#36
Re: Emissions update (still failing, help?)
Originally posted by dDuB
Anyways, i took that off and plugged 2 vac nipples that would (i was told) cause air to be pumped into the cat constantly rather than just at cruise.
Anyways, i took that off and plugged 2 vac nipples that would (i was told) cause air to be pumped into the cat constantly rather than just at cruise.
you remove the FRONT vacuum line and cap the line and nipple. NOT BOTH!
Jarrett
03-02-04, 01:38 AM
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it'd be nice to sit in your car and "tune" while on the machine as all the numbers i would think are in "real time."
i dont know about the alcohol burning "cleaner." it may be a chemical that doesnt show up or shows up less (say some chemicals that read and others which dont). i wouldnt know. all i can say is good luck!
and how's your compression? seems it may be a tad low; a possibility at least.
i dont know about the alcohol burning "cleaner." it may be a chemical that doesnt show up or shows up less (say some chemicals that read and others which dont). i wouldnt know. all i can say is good luck!
and how's your compression? seems it may be a tad low; a possibility at least.
03-02-04, 01:43 AM
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Re: Re: Emissions update (still failing, help?)
Originally posted by J-Rat
Anyone else catch this besides me?
Anyone else catch this besides me?
Saw it, but didn't know what line he was talking about...
03-02-04, 01:47 AM
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Re: Re: Emissions update (still failing, help?)
Originally posted by J-Rat
Anyone else catch this besides me?
you remove the FRONT vacuum line and cap the line and nipple. NOT BOTH!
Jarrett
Anyone else catch this besides me?
you remove the FRONT vacuum line and cap the line and nipple. NOT BOTH!
Jarrett
By "capped the 2 vac nipples" he meant the front one on the ACV, and the solid line that the tube from the front nipple connects to.
Last edited by MaYnard5000; 03-02-04 at 02:06 AM.
03-02-04, 01:49 AM
#40
J-rats Recipe for cheating emissions if its ABSOLUTELY necessary:
1. Turn variable resistor to full lean, or as lean as you can get and still run.
2. Trick ACV into pumping air to the cat all the time by removing the FORWARD UPPER vac hose, and capping it.
3. Run 87 octane
4. Run your tank down till your almost empty.
5. 2-3 bottles of alcohol in the tank. Drive VERY GINGERLY to the emissions station.
6. Once you pass go, DIRECTLY to a gas station and fill up with regular unleaded.
1. Turn variable resistor to full lean, or as lean as you can get and still run.
2. Trick ACV into pumping air to the cat all the time by removing the FORWARD UPPER vac hose, and capping it.
3. Run 87 octane
4. Run your tank down till your almost empty.
5. 2-3 bottles of alcohol in the tank. Drive VERY GINGERLY to the emissions station.
6. Once you pass go, DIRECTLY to a gas station and fill up with regular unleaded.
03-02-04, 01:51 AM
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Woah, which front one?
The topmost one goes to the OMP injectors - do not cap (except he's running premix, so I assume that the OMP et al is removed.)
The middle one goes to the primary injectors - again, do not cap!
The bottom one interconnects with the FPR and the rat's nest - not sure about capping that one...
The topmost one goes to the OMP injectors - do not cap (except he's running premix, so I assume that the OMP et al is removed.)
The middle one goes to the primary injectors - again, do not cap!
The bottom one interconnects with the FPR and the rat's nest - not sure about capping that one...
03-02-04, 01:55 AM
#43
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Hes talkin about the nipples down by the intake runners, kinda right in the middle of the runners, 2 small vacuum hoses coming the metal lines from under the rear of the intake mani.
Last edited by MaYnard5000; 03-02-04 at 02:00 AM.
03-02-04, 02:02 AM
#45
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Originally posted by J-Rat
DO NOT DOG THE HELL OUT OF IT WITH ALCOHOL IN THE SYSTEM!!!!!! YOU WILL PING YOUR SEALS AND KILL YOUR CAR!!
Amur_ Your in the wrong area! These nipples are on the intake in the ACV area... Let me see if I have a pic of them...
DO NOT DOG THE HELL OUT OF IT WITH ALCOHOL IN THE SYSTEM!!!!!! YOU WILL PING YOUR SEALS AND KILL YOUR CAR!!
Amur_ Your in the wrong area! These nipples are on the intake in the ACV area... Let me see if I have a pic of them...
Chill. I gotcha now. Maynard said Intake Manifold - wtf am I supposed to think?
03-02-04, 02:43 AM
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Originally posted by MaYnard5000
Hey you have 3500 posts you have no excuse to not know what we were talking about.
Hey you have 3500 posts you have no excuse to not know what we were talking about.
How could I know about that trick with that line if the ACV is no longer on my car?
