Dtss??????
 

This is in reference to thread:
https://www.rx7club.com/showthread.p...73#post5835773


And I must ask, DTSS? Rear steer???? I've never heard of it on these cars, and I'm surprised I haven't if I have it on my car. I've taken a good look at my rear suspension, didn't see anything that looked like a steering arm. Maybe I'm just stupid and blind, but yeah.... did all FCs come with this? How can I tell if I have it, what do I actually look for?

And on malfuctioning.... how does it malfunction? What should I look out for?

It's not like Nissans' HICAS, it's not a "Steering" mechanisim really. They are just soft rubber bushings with metal inserts in them that allow the rear hubs to move a little in a certain way under hard cornering.

In my opninion it makes the rear end feel like jelly. I do not like the way it feels at all.

How does it malfunction? The rear toe changes, but doesn't change back, the bushings wear out and it will make toe changes without actually loading the bushings with cornering forces.

I'm in the process of removing it myself after I started racing my FC. The bushings were pretty shot and it's much cheaper to just eliminate the system all together.

There are those that'll say it's awesome and should always be kept stock, but I prefer to know exactly what my rear-end is doing. :D

Yeah, I always heard about how the rear end likes to just snap on you. I found out myself, fortunately never crashing. It would just happen out of nowhere, and I'd be spinning. I mean, I'm all stock still, and could use a strut bar and better tires, and perhaps a suspension upgrade, but as it goes, can I possibly blame this on DTSS?

Hard to say. With mine the bushings had been so worn and one of the POs tried removing one by drilling through one side (which I only found out after pushing it out and two broken bits came out with it) that my rear-end would just feel real "squishy" towards the limit. It would be find until you cornered hard enough to slide the sleeve on the metal plate and it would squish until the rear-end let loose.

I don't know anyone who can tell you how to test the DTSS for failure. Think about this. Yesterday, you didn't know you had it. Today, you wonder if it doesn't work, and everyone is telling you to take it out. What to do, what to do?

Read this:

https://www.rx7club.com/2nd-generation-specific-1986-1992-17/dtss-bushing-replacement-535854/

and this (some bs on the first page)

https://www.rx7club.com/showthread.p...9&page=1&pp=15

Clarification and explanations.

https://www.rx7club.com/showthread.p...9&page=2&pp=15

If you didn't know you had them, you don't know enough to take them out. Lots of stuff gets repeated over and over on the forum like folklore and becomes accepted as fact but is actually bs.

Most of us can use some fast driving training. Those of us who have had some, need more.

If you are spinning your car, you need to learn to drive. The DTSS will not make you spin. Read the above threads completely. Try to sort out what is stated based on fact and what is just repeated.

Good luck.

They look like this

It's actually very easy to tell if it's working or not. You just have to know a few things.

A: How and Why it works.
B: Driven a car in which the system works properly.
C: Driven a car in which the system does NOT work properly.

In my first s4 they were shot. I could trigger the DTSS bushings at a low speed left hand turn from a stop it was so sloppy. Now in my s5 they worked great to start, then I started having the same problem with the toe on the rear wheels going out and staying out. I thought at first it was DTSS, but it turns out it was a combination of the rear LCA bushings and the the toe-adjust cams/bushings.

Well ive had three 7's. Only on my second were they shot. Ill tell you what, set up a small slalom in a parking lot. Go through it a few times. If youve driven rear wheel drive before you know what hard cornering should feel like. Well on to the next step, Start off slow get a feel for it. Afterwards grip another run. You should feel the back end slightly lean into the turn. At a moderate speed to high seeds youll feel it engage and whip your carback. If you feel like the car is swinging and you might loose control, then yeah there shot. Depending on whether you want to grip or drift should determine whether to replace or eliminate. Ill make it simple iF YOU WANT TO DRIFT ELIMINATE, plus invest in a welded diff for drifting.

Question bout that, i went to get a alignment done came to find out my Right Rear Lateral link wuz bent to shit. Now i've been doing lots of work to the suspension and never noticed this. The shop wouldn't do my alignment because of this.
Do u guys think it wuz because of my DTS on the right rear being Bad.
Reason for alignment wuz changed my tie rods, tie rod ends, and all my front bushings with
energy supensions.

i hate it when your car is in the middle of a drift or just spinning the wheels sideways and have to let off the gas.... SNAP..shoots ya right back!! throws ya for a ride

Lateral links are not expensive. You can pick them up for 143 bucks brand new per side. If it's bent you won't be able to align it, however I'd check it first just to make sure the alignment shop wasn't smoking any crack that day.

There is a measurement you can perform on the rear end to check if the lateral link is bent.

Measure the Distance from the center of the subrame rubber mount to the center of the lateral link balljoint (at the trailing arm) on both sides of the car. As long as it's within 5mm (.02in) you are in good shape, and nothing is bent. Take your car to a different shop with a better alignment rack.
FSM Section 13 - Suspension page R-8

In theory the DTSS bushings are a great idea... Toe out the rear wheels at low cornering G's to make the car more nimble, but when the lateral acceleration excedes a certain point, toe them back in to stabilize the car. This is a part of what makes the FC better for grip than a non-HICAS 240... these bushings are working to keep the rear wheels stuck. By the same token, this is what makes it worse for drifting. Like all other rubber parts tho, they wear out, get loose, and make the rear end feel sloppy. Its hard to tell whether thats the cause of spins tho. Rear toe-out will certainly help you to spin, but it could have been traction issues (patch of oily concrete), or driver inexperience, or a number of other things.

hey man I know what the rear end of my car is doing in the turns.

wagging around it's ass all the time like a little prostitute just not doing the squealing that comes when those tires break loose

I'm currently using the Delrin bushing rear steer eliminator, which I bought from MazdaTrix. I've never seen the other type of rear steer eliminator bushing as you show in the photo on the right. Where can I get a set of those bushings?

Thanks,
Hot_Dog
90 RX7 GXL

Yeah i checked myself as soon as i left there office. I took a look under my FC and saw the bow the lateral link had
Thanks Alot dude

The one's on the right R from www.secretelement.com
the site is under construction but they have an email to contact them

They also carry angle spacers for Drifters

Ouch :( Sorry to hear that.

You mistake my question a bit.

And I entirely understand what it's supposed to do now, I was just a bit ignorant to it's existance.

And as for the spinning, I have intentionally driven 'spiritedly' on manyoccasions, why the hell else would I have this car? And I've felt the difference at different speeds. To me it seemed like, yeah... plenty of traction around that corner, nice, push it some more and plenty of traction.... and then SNAP none..... and I spin and spin. I know I'm no experienced driver, I do it for fun, I'm not gonna lie to my self and try to believe I'll be some master driver.

I know knowledge and feel for your car is a major factor. My question was whether or not the DTSS might possibly have anything to do with this 'sudden thresh hold' of traction that i've been experiencing.

Thanks for the information. Have you used these all steel bushings? If you have used them, than can you provide any feedback.

Thanks again,
Hot_Dog
90 RX7 GXL

A few more questions...
 

OK, so I have a few questions about this, myself:

1. Is this the same DTSS as in, "DTSS Eliminators..."?
2. If so... what does it "eliminate"?
3. What does DTSS mean / stand for?
4. Can I find these any cheaper than $40 (Mazdatrix)? :-P

Thanks,
iSP33D-for-J3SUS :bigthumb:

1. Yes
2. It elminates a rubber/metal bushing in the rear control arm (See : http://www.mazdatrix.com/faq/rrsteer.htm for detailed pictures of the bushings and how to remove them)
3. Dynamically Tracking Suspension System, I've also heard it called DTTS for Dynamically tuned tracking suspension.
4. Wow, you're cheap :P 40 bucks isn't a bad price. You can get them for 38 here: http://mmr-direct.com/

Probably not... probably more crappy tires, out of adjustment alignment, or worn out or incorrect other parts (such as struts or bushings).

DTSS does not snap even when worn. It is a very progressive change, and if anything would increase the traction in a corner, rather than give suddenly.

if you do quick s-curve turns it almost feels like it is snappy on the baqck end.

but never looses grip.


weirdest feel ever.

I'm an FC owner, of course I'm cheap - because I'm broke!

But thanks for the link, because they sell the "complete bushings kit" that mazdatrix sells for 250 bucks for just 195. :)

iSP33D-for-J3SUS :bigthumb: