A/C from R12 to R134a what should be replaced?
Originally posted by asherwood
Matt, this "glaciergold(r12a)", is it available in Canada? Do you use that same amount as R12?
AS for the o-rings, I was only going to replace the lines that I needed to open up when removing the engine.
Matt, this "glaciergold(r12a)", is it available in Canada? Do you use that same amount as R12?
AS for the o-rings, I was only going to replace the lines that I needed to open up when removing the engine.
you use less r12a than r12 .
as for removing the engine you dont need to open any
lines to remove the motor...
matt
Originally posted by rx7-rage
j-rat, how would one go about attaining a license to purchase freeze 12? i am very interested in finding out how.
j-rat, how would one go about attaining a license to purchase freeze 12? i am very interested in finding out how.
Originally posted by importboi22
hey wanna send me some of that glacier gold and orings from the dealer? i can pay you with paypal... also what recharge kit do i need? like the lines and stuff
hey wanna send me some of that glacier gold and orings from the dealer? i can pay you with paypal... also what recharge kit do i need? like the lines and stuff
across the line,,, not sure though.
matt
I'm a boost creep...
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 15,608
Likes: 8
From: Auckland, New Zealand
Originally posted by asherwood
So can I ask the A/C shop use R406A for the re-assembled system?
So can I ask the A/C shop use R406A for the re-assembled system?
hIGGI, mentioned 401A
And where can I get a set of o-rings?
Thread Starter
Rotary Enthusiast
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 959
Likes: 0
From: Victoria, BC, Canada
Originally posted by now
glaciergold as far as i know is only available in canada.
you use less r12a than r12 .
as for removing the engine you dont need to open any
lines to remove the motor...
matt
glaciergold as far as i know is only available in canada.
you use less r12a than r12 .
as for removing the engine you dont need to open any
lines to remove the motor...
matt
The a/c system was already discharged due to a leak in the crossover pipe, so rather then trying to fight the lines drapped all over the place, I removed everything.
So now I'm on the hunt for refridgerant, o-rings and a crossover tube. The receiver/dryer is on it's way.
If glaciergold is better for the compressor and systems then R134a I'd much rather go that way...
Full Member
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 237
Likes: 0
From: Elk Grove, Cali
Everyone has told me that Freeze 12 can explode and not to use it.. are you sure it's safe?
Can you just add Freeze 12 to your system with the r12 that's already in there or do you need to flush?
Can you just add Freeze 12 to your system with the r12 that's already in there or do you need to flush?
Last edited by jsotelo; Aug 5, 2003 at 01:35 PM.
Senior Member
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 318
Likes: 38
From: Tempe, AZ
Do not I repeat do not go to the hardware store for O-rings on an A/C system they are not the same.
Go to any Automotive parts store for A/C o-rings
they come in many different sizes, I belive our systems use no 8 and no 10 O-rings. but it is best to match them up as all systems are different.
This being said the only place that will have exact part numbers for an A/C O-ring will be the dealer no parts store has a listing for O-rings specific for each vehicles A/C system.
Go to any Automotive parts store for A/C o-rings
they come in many different sizes, I belive our systems use no 8 and no 10 O-rings. but it is best to match them up as all systems are different.
This being said the only place that will have exact part numbers for an A/C O-ring will be the dealer no parts store has a listing for O-rings specific for each vehicles A/C system.
Originally posted by jsotelo
Everyone has told me that Freeze 12 can explode and not to use it.. are you sure it's safe?
Everyone has told me that Freeze 12 can explode and not to use it.. are you sure it's safe?
http://autorefrigerants.com/freeze12faq.htm
FREEZE 12™ is non-flammable and contains no CFC'S.
This is from this link...
http://www.sherco-auto.com/fr4012.htm
So where is everyone getting this freeze 12 is flammable stuff?
I need proof!!!
Jarrett
Lava Surfer
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 2,354
Likes: 0
From: Kailua, HI
www.duracoolusa.com
direct drop in r12 replacement. requires no other system modifications. this was recommended to me by a rather knowledgable friend. as of now i have yet to try it. i will be sure to post when i do though.
also, i hear r134 does not cool near as well as other products, and often can cause damage to older r12 systems. i can't list specifics off the top of my head, but if you search around the internet you will find problems people have had with it.
direct drop in r12 replacement. requires no other system modifications. this was recommended to me by a rather knowledgable friend. as of now i have yet to try it. i will be sure to post when i do though.
also, i hear r134 does not cool near as well as other products, and often can cause damage to older r12 systems. i can't list specifics off the top of my head, but if you search around the internet you will find problems people have had with it.
Last edited by bingoboy; Aug 13, 2003 at 06:56 AM.
hambre y sueño
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 300
Likes: 1
From: 80* >
Originally posted by JPA
What a great topic. I just bought my 88 vert and on the way home the cool (not cold) A/C started blowing hot, having blown a fuse (clock and mirrors were out as well). I stopped off at the dealer, and they said it was supposed to blow the fuse when it is low on freon (not true). They said I needed a conversion and recharge, and I bit. $280 later it was fine (for a week) then the car would not idle, dying at stops. I took it to another dealer, on the way home, and as I pulled in the A/C started blowing hot again, same blown fuse scenario, but all of a sudden idled fine.
These characters said that they repaired a short at the fuse box and set the TPS.
When I picked up the car, it was idling in the service drive, and POW! and WHOOSH! and hot A/C again.
I left it, and they called me the next day and said a hose blew (not true, it was the high pressure plug at the back of the comp) and take it back to the first dealer that did the conversion the week before as it was related.
I did. They said it needed an A/C hose (not true) and that they could not get them, take it away.
I took it to Cartek (Stephan you are great) and low and behold it needed a compressor.
The fuse was blowing because the compressor was locking up or working too hard.
Related to the conversion?
American Express thinks so, and credited me both lousy dealers charges.
What a great topic. I just bought my 88 vert and on the way home the cool (not cold) A/C started blowing hot, having blown a fuse (clock and mirrors were out as well). I stopped off at the dealer, and they said it was supposed to blow the fuse when it is low on freon (not true). They said I needed a conversion and recharge, and I bit. $280 later it was fine (for a week) then the car would not idle, dying at stops. I took it to another dealer, on the way home, and as I pulled in the A/C started blowing hot again, same blown fuse scenario, but all of a sudden idled fine.
These characters said that they repaired a short at the fuse box and set the TPS.
When I picked up the car, it was idling in the service drive, and POW! and WHOOSH! and hot A/C again.
I left it, and they called me the next day and said a hose blew (not true, it was the high pressure plug at the back of the comp) and take it back to the first dealer that did the conversion the week before as it was related.
I did. They said it needed an A/C hose (not true) and that they could not get them, take it away.
I took it to Cartek (Stephan you are great) and low and behold it needed a compressor.
The fuse was blowing because the compressor was locking up or working too hard.
Related to the conversion?
American Express thinks so, and credited me both lousy dealers charges.
thanks
Full Member
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 237
Likes: 0
From: Elk Grove, Cali
Originally posted by bingoboy
www.duracoolusa.com
direct drop in r12 replacement. requires no other system modifications. this was recommended to me by a rather knowledgable friend. as of now i have yet to try it. i will be sure to post when i do though.
also, i hear r134 does not cool near as well as other products, and often can cause damage to older r12 systems. i can't list specifics off the top of my head, but if you search around the internet you will find problems people have had with it.
www.duracoolusa.com
direct drop in r12 replacement. requires no other system modifications. this was recommended to me by a rather knowledgable friend. as of now i have yet to try it. i will be sure to post when i do though.
also, i hear r134 does not cool near as well as other products, and often can cause damage to older r12 systems. i can't list specifics off the top of my head, but if you search around the internet you will find problems people have had with it.
DURACOOL® products are safe to use, as directed. Like all hydrocarbons, DURACOOL® products are flammable, but there is an enormous difference between "flammability" issues and "safety" issues. We all utilize flammable products every day of our lives. Such products include gasoline, natural gas, hair spray, barbecue lighter fluid, cigarette lighters, and numerous household aerosol cleaners, disinfectants, and insect repellents. Proper adherence to directions and common sense eliminate the dangers associated with improper or negligent use of those materials.
I wonder how much money I would save.. I have been quoted at 100.00 to recharge my R12 system.. if I do the Freeze 12 I woudl have to pay to have the R12 drained out.. and then buy the kit.. I don't have any pressure gagues or anything and it looks like I should probably have some...
On a side note.. it looks like the biggest disavantage to using Freeze 12 is that once you use it nobody wants to touch your AC system.. all the shops want to use is R134 and R12..
Full Member
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 237
Likes: 0
From: Elk Grove, Cali
Not to beat a dead horse too bad.. I'm studing for the test right now and in the material it says specifily twice that Duracool 12a is illegal for use in cars, is flamable and that it's safety is unknown..
I don't know if this test is old or what because Duracool says it's legal to use on the website.. I just did some more research and it says that Duracool is illigal in 18 states but it doesn't list what ones.. other than that it seems pretty decent.. hehe
the Freeze 12 is a 134a based blend that is 20% 142b and 80% 134a.. with the 142 in there it's safe to use the old oil.. One cool thing about Duracool is that it compresses at a lower PSI than R12 or R134a so it means your engine makes more power...
Here is some more info I found..
There are only three types of r12 substitutes sold under various names.
R22 blends like Hotshot and Autofrost
+ Does not require flushing
+ Blended to perform like r12
+ low ODP and GWP, similar to r134a
+ Reasonable cost
- Requires barrier hoses
- Requires 690 cert to buy it
- System must be leak free
R134a blends like Freeze12 or FR12
+ Does not require flushing
- 134a requires a dessicant change which requires a drier/accumulator change
- Primary gas is 134a, runs a higher pressure than r12
- System must be leak free
- Performance the same as r134a
Hydrocarbons like Duracool, Envirosafe, red tek12a, and HC-12a
+ Uses less energy than HCFC and HFC refrigerants
+ Do not contribute to either ODP or GWP
+ Compatible with ALL MVAC materials, and oils
+ Cheap if you buy from the right source
- Flamability issue that confuses would be buyers
- System must be leak free
To sumarize with the r22 blends you need barrier hoses and a certification to buy it otherwise r22 blends work great. The 134a blends were designed to overcome the flushing requirement, some users say it is colder then 134a. I personally do not prefer r134a blends myself but there are some happy customers out there. HC's are a great refrigerant but definately not the magic bullet the manufacturers claim. Other than the flamibility issue HC's are a great alternatitive. You will notice that in all three categories I mentioned the system must be leak free, this is very important with blends as their properties change in a leaky system causing poor cooling or worse.
I don't know if this test is old or what because Duracool says it's legal to use on the website.. I just did some more research and it says that Duracool is illigal in 18 states but it doesn't list what ones.. other than that it seems pretty decent.. hehe
the Freeze 12 is a 134a based blend that is 20% 142b and 80% 134a.. with the 142 in there it's safe to use the old oil.. One cool thing about Duracool is that it compresses at a lower PSI than R12 or R134a so it means your engine makes more power...
Here is some more info I found..
There are only three types of r12 substitutes sold under various names.
R22 blends like Hotshot and Autofrost
+ Does not require flushing
+ Blended to perform like r12
+ low ODP and GWP, similar to r134a
+ Reasonable cost
- Requires barrier hoses
- Requires 690 cert to buy it
- System must be leak free
R134a blends like Freeze12 or FR12
+ Does not require flushing
- 134a requires a dessicant change which requires a drier/accumulator change
- Primary gas is 134a, runs a higher pressure than r12
- System must be leak free
- Performance the same as r134a
Hydrocarbons like Duracool, Envirosafe, red tek12a, and HC-12a
+ Uses less energy than HCFC and HFC refrigerants
+ Do not contribute to either ODP or GWP
+ Compatible with ALL MVAC materials, and oils
+ Cheap if you buy from the right source
- Flamability issue that confuses would be buyers
- System must be leak free
To sumarize with the r22 blends you need barrier hoses and a certification to buy it otherwise r22 blends work great. The 134a blends were designed to overcome the flushing requirement, some users say it is colder then 134a. I personally do not prefer r134a blends myself but there are some happy customers out there. HC's are a great refrigerant but definately not the magic bullet the manufacturers claim. Other than the flamibility issue HC's are a great alternatitive. You will notice that in all three categories I mentioned the system must be leak free, this is very important with blends as their properties change in a leaky system causing poor cooling or worse.
Last edited by jsotelo; Aug 14, 2003 at 12:10 AM.
