eugenius

whats the cheapest/most logical way to get my daily driven 91 N/A into the 13s. is it possible to do without a TII swap? whats the fastest i can get my N/A in a reasonable budget? itd be really sweet if someone could dumb it down with ball park numbers like 14s=$***, 13=$**** ect ect. yea, im a newb...

rotorforce

Welcome..

I hate to say this but the following two words never relate to each other:

RX-7 & Cheap

Especially when your speaking in terms of an N/A. Stock N/A's run 16 - 17's on the 1/4 and to lower that to a 14 or 13 is verrry expensive.

Better off buying a TII

iSP33D-for-J3SUS

Every car is different. Every driver is different. There are too many factors to consider here. Everyone will soon find this thread and yell, "TURBO!! TURBO!!" and rightly so. A Turbocharger would get you into the 13's no doubt. If you want to stay N/A then I suggest you read, THIS THREAD:
How to Make a Beefy N/A Thread

Hope that helps you out, and in the future, please search to avoid the inevitable flaming that is coming this thread's way.

iSP33D-for-J3SUS

Aaron Cake

iTrader: (1)

Massive weight reduction, rear end gear swap and nitrous.

Jager

iTrader: (10)

Talk to Kahren and get a streetport, and a LSD.

SAFC and the accompanying mods to tune it.

You're done.

snowball

im an advocate of the 4 rotor swap. you just need a bit more money.

Whizbang

i consider the use of nitrous similiar to turbo as it is a power adder. that and i will never use the stuff because i like my car running.

already said but read that Beefy thread. expect porting and tuning...

First gen man

iTrader: (24)

acually, we got my friend's 91 coupe to run a 15.4 on street tires, with nothing more than emissions removal and some manifold porting.

eugenius

finished reading that thread. looks like its way easier to hit 13s with a turbo. im digging the drive ability of the NA they keep mentioning since i drive mine to and from work. on the other hand, i really dont wanna loose to civics... i wanna go trubo. but the draw back to that is im very impaient. id have to wait a while to save up 2k or more to do the swap, i can start buying the small stuff and modding my NA now... i have money, just not 2 grand on me... right now im still really weighing my options. if i go full na and in a year or so when im done i get smoked by a 16 yr old in bone stock scion im gonna cry. my fear is paying the cost to not be a newb any more, and not going big enough to beat the posers who still are newbs... im trolling the froums now for a lil more insight and guidance

snowball

Turbo's can be daily driven theirs members who daily drive 400+whp cars, i daily drive mine all year round even in snow.

Dom_C

werrd, daily driven t2

rotorforce

No exhaust or intake upgrades? Were they stock rims sporting basic tires?

Jager

iTrader: (10)

To me a Kahren port with some weight removal can easily hit 13's. **** I've hit a 15.3 with just bolt ons and no tune (stock ports).

Anything faster needs a major power adders (turbo, nitrous oxide, and so on).

Tournapart

iTrader: (4)

whats your mods??

autocrash

...damn, i guess even the civics are bigger in texas....

...you do realize that most guys who tell you their civics do 13's are talking out of their ***, right?

Besides, its much more fun to lose 'em in the turns, rather than showing off how "mAd quIck" you shift....

88rxn/a

iTrader: (6)

o the civic.......everyone wants to beat the civic...there bitches talking smack because they own a family car and not a real car !!! 7's pwn!!!

Jager

iTrader: (10)

Have you done it before? It's not ALL that expensive. Unless you already have a TII it's not worth it to swap (as you stated).

It's just a streetport and a good tune away from 13's or 4.88+ gears + bolt ons (at his has been done). A 4.88 gear set costs about the same as a FMIC. I just can't wait to prove this wrong (alot of people with streetports don't run them at the track !). But I was assured that I could hit 13's and it's entirely possible.

Jager

iTrader: (10)

Check sig.

rotorforce

Please note: I am not gonna get into Turbo vs. N/A debate I am trying to answer the question and I would like imput and $$ figures from anyone who says there are cheap ways to this task without NOS. I've heard yeses but know figures dollar wise.

Ok hitting 13's with an N/A without nos to me seems to be a very costly challenge.
If the gears cost as much as an FMIC then your talking 1200-1500 right there (providing you buy a direct fit fmic), then porting the engine. They have to pull the motor apart to port so my guess is another 1200 or more depending if all the seals can be reused (not recommended). Better tires for traction, intake, exhaust, etc. etc.

This all equals $$$$$
BYW just curious if any N/A guys who daily drive the car have hit 13's no NOS? Time slips? Note this is not a challenge I am simply curious because it seems like a pretty cool accomplishment.

Jager

iTrader: (10)

First off, stop with the NOS thing. It's nitrous, not NOS. You sound like a ricer when you refer to nitrous as NOS. NOS is a product made by Holley. If anything refer it to as N2O.

Cheap way's without nitrous? Yes getting 13's out of TII is cheaper, but alot of people have NA's and don't exactly have the money to do the swap all at once OR don't care too and view building a beefy NA as a stepping stone. Not everyone has access to a TII or the TII components or can risk putting in an engine that isn't **** or with a car that isn't **** OR has gremlins. My NA is in mint condition and I intend to keep it that way, doing a swap would just **** up alot of the little things (like new harness, clutch, starter, water pump, new engine ) making all of those pointless. They just want to do with what they can.

Anyhow now onto my point.

4.88 gears + bolt ons has seen 13's. Nitrous is bashed alot on this forum and isn't accepted because everyone says it pops engines (which OMG so do turbo's and shitty tuning). 4.88 gears is about $800, bolt ons and grippy tires are like 1,500 or so. A TII's full exhaust and bolt ons to run properly may be around that same cost. A streetport can cost about the same and make the 13's possible with a efficient port and tune. Kahren's port's do this. I trust his opniion on this because he actually works with NA's and has tuned them, he also hangs out alot at the track.

Hitting 13's for an NA isn't all too hard, just because you were told that it's costly doesn't mean it's anyworse then a properly functioning TII with mods. Alot of guys here with turbos have full exhausts, intakes, FCD, chip, upgraded fuel, clutch, tires, and they run 14's all day in their TII's (which they shouldn't idealy).

Run a search for 4.88 gears + 1/4 mile times, I beleive the car ran high 13's on stock ports. Wait for Kahren to run in the track this summer and watch for 13's with stock ports. The cost isn't much more then modifying a TII. FMIC for a TII = $899 (for the Greddy unit). 4.88 gears are 800. Full exhausts are simular in price, CAI are simular in price, grippy tires can be put on stock wheels (5-star S5's or BBS vert's) and both would need a SAFC for tuning. But I do admit the TII should ideally run faster times (due to the torque/powerband).
TII's can be fast for little money and if done properly, but alot of people have done it and may wanna see what they can do with their NA's for a simular price.

Since I can't stand scrolling up and re-reading what I said, I do know went in circles. I do admit a TII is easier to make it happen (Rtek, intake + full exhaust, injectors, pump, clutch). But an NA isn't that mindboggling either, nor too expensive (as everyone says).

Don't bother replying to this thread (which I know you will) because I know what will happen with me being bashed for spending money on a "pointless" NA.

I'm done here.

rotorforce

Thought to myself: "Never use the word NOS again it's appearently ricey"

Thank you for your honest answer nostradamus. Boy that was clever you knew I would reply! Anyway point taken and for the record, I have never said spending money on an N/A is pointless and I will not bash anyone who wants to make it to the 13's with an N/A. I think is pretty damn cool to be able to do that. You have to agree that it is costly without the use of n2o. My point was there is no such thing as a CHEAP way to do it. But what's the point of me replying? Your done here anyway...

SonicRaT

iTrader: (6)

N/a sucks, period.

Sure, some 4.88 gears, a massive port (bye bye torque!), and etc will get you a 13.999999999, but who cares, it's still slow.

Dom_C

werrd, n/a's are fun to play with but at the end of the day a turbo will be faster. BUT a n/a can make it into the 13's. .

DemonicPupil

Currently turbo'n my NA. If your patient, you can stumble across the parts insanely cheap. ALOT of parts were given to me because people just flat out didn't feel like going thru the hassle of selling/shipping. Some people just want to get rid of as much crap as possible in one shot.

A kind soul from this site hooked me up with the manifolds, fuel rails, regulator, 4-550 injectors, etc. and threw in the turbo as well because it was in "unknown" condition for 120 bucks. He just wanted to clean out his shed.

Patience is the true key though. I REALLY want to get this done, but I'm having to be patient and peice it together. Port matching the lower manifold is a bitch too. Time consuming.

I'm down to finishing up the port job, buying an oil pedestal, buying some oil/coolant lines, and installing it all.

Price wise:

LIM, UIM, injectors, fuel rails, turbo mani, turbo, etc.
120

BOV, intermediate pipe, and AFM to turbo adapters
60

DP, TMIC, rubber hosing, TB, etc.
FREE

exhaust and TII hood:
swap with my 86 NA

A/F guage & SAFC
120


Total: 300

Costs left:

Oil Pedestal
40-60

Lines/adhesives/gaskets/clamps
40-60



Total cost of the entire project is under $500.

I expect to run 6-8psi of boost on a 35-40k factory reman NA motor. That leaves me alot of extra $$$ to take it for a dyno tune. As long as I don't lose anything on the lower end (my favorite part of the NA, good off the line compared to a TII), I expect to quite easily break into 13's.

Hope this helps... key thing is to have PATIENCE =)

Whizbang

where the hell do you people find gear changes for the FC!?!?!

or the Fb for that matter?!?