Syonyk

Pics tomorrow when it's less dark out.

My 88 SE, while my first '7 (this FB is the 4th '7 chassis I've owned), was increasingly useless to me. I used it as a daily driver for a while, rebuilt the motor, it sat for a while, I autocrossed it, it sat for a longer while, etc. I wasn't using it as a daily driver (I went back to grad school, and I live a quarter mile from class), it wasn't really doing it for an autocross/track day car (insert standard "But it doesn't have a turbo!" crack here), and I just generally didn't drive it much.

I wanted something a bit more raw... a bit less refined. Something well suited to weekend cruises, autocross/track days, whomping on much heavier cars with a lot more power at autocrosses, drifting, etc. And I'd come to appreciate the value of a very light car with my Daihatsu Charade (1850 lbs, with fuel).

Anyway, long story short, I have a 1983 FB now. Rebuilt 12A, 4 wheel disk, new suspension bits, some bushings replaced, clean body.

As always with a new variety of cars, I've got a few questions/comments/etc.

I've been reading up on FBs, and am considering a variety of options for the engine, but as per my other thread, am strongly leaning towards a bridgeported 12A, at least for now. It's amazingly quick with the stock 12A, though it does have the RB header and some other jazz attached.

I'm planning to do the 2nd gen coil swap this week (I kept a spare 2nd gen leading coil for this purpose), and probably an efan soon - enough people have said that the stock clutch fan draws a good bit of power out of the engine that it's worth removing. I'm also most likely going to swap my spare FC alternator on, once I find a dual pulley for it.

A few questions:

1. The steering is really, really heavy. Is this normal for the FBs? It's quite firm, and other than the wondersteer deadspot in the middle, feels quite tight - just heavy.

2. The hood release mechanism is messed up. The cable doesn't retract, and the hood doesn't pop up at all when you pull the handle - I'm assuming it's just missing some springs, right? Or is this normal as well?

3. How stable are FBs with the tail out? My FC with the dynamic rear steer stuff was really nasty to try and control if the tail stepped out at all - it'd grip pretty much until it snapped. I'm going to play in a parking lot a bit, but I know they have a reputation for being very, very tailhappy. How controllable is it/anything I should be aware of?

4. Tires - since this is going to be a summer car, and garaged in the winter, I'd like something sticky, but not "I can't take it on a road trip" sticky. Suggestions of things that will fit on the stock 14" wheels? 205/60/14 or so seems to be a good size that will fit, what else can be crammed in?

5. Anything else I should know, coming from a FC?

Thanks! I'll get some pictures up tomorrow when it's light out.

-=Russ=-

mxd

iTrader: (1)

you can still get speeding tickets!! its not so small its invisible or able to dodge a laser.
super gokart, like a kid in traffic
im not tailgating that geo metro, im drafting
imo, the fb is maybe more manageable once broken loose then the fc, i guess cause of the load on the independant suspension vs the solid rear axle, and the obvious weight difference when it comes to 4disc stop. just my experiences.
old guys without internet following you around talking your **** off cause they havent got it out of their system or need a 2nd guess on their engine problem. ever heard 'Poor mans Corvette?'
asking your passenger how much they weigh for launch reasons.
i premix my 12a, did not premix my 13b
affordable parts cars!!!!

Kentetsu

Lets see here:

1. If you have the stock front sway bar on, then remove the rear sway bar. If you have a heavy aftermarket sway on the front, then you can keep the stock rear. This will help with the "snap oversteer" issues.

2. You have gone from a nicely developed rack and pinion steering system to a clunky reciprocating ball steering. It will feel heavy, because it is. However, you can check or replace the oil in the gearbox, which sometimes helps. Check all of the front end pieces (tie rod ends, idler arm, etc.) to be sure that they are in good condition. They seem to wear out fairly quickly unless you use very high quality parts (Moog). Once that is done (and not before) then you can adjust the gear box to reduce the dead spot in the middle. Check my thread in the following link for instructions on how I did this. https://www.rx7club.com/showthread.p...steering+grind

That's about all I've got for you, although I will tell you that the 2nd gen ignition swap is worthwhile. Switching to an Efan will not produce more power, but it may feel a little more lively in 1st/2nd gear. Good luck, and welcome to the civilized section of this forum.

kenn_chan

1. does it have P/S? if not its normal, if it does, you might want to check to see if it has the same options as the GSL-SE (a speed sensitive proportioning valve) that could be bad...???

2. check for hood latch allighment,(not opening properly) and also grease it up (cable not returning)

3. snap oversteer when entering a tight corner on the track, caused by the suspension binding when going into hard corners, do not, do not use poly bushings on the rear... it makes the binding of the suspension worse. do a search on PB&J racing, they have a low cost suspension fix that helps immensley, or you can put in a tri link systme with a panhard bar vice the stock 4 link and Z bar

4. Tires - too much personal likes and dislikes involved in tire selection for me to help you there

5. yeah put a 12 bridg port, or peri port and while you will have some lag, its still lighter and a blast to drive compared to the heavy almost piggish like manners of the FC.

kenn

Kentetsu

Kenn

I've often heard that you shouldn't use poly bushings in the rear end, or that you should only use them in the lower arms. When I was installing mine (intending to do the lower arms only), Man in Black challenged me on this. I decided to give it a shot, and have not been dissapointed having full poly bushings in the rear. In fact, I had the snap oversteer issues before, and have not had them since.

However, it should be considered that I have the Racing Beat springs and Illumina shocks too. So, perhaps a stiffer rear suspension setup limits the movement of the suspension, keeping it from reaching the point of binding. On the other hand, maybe the poly bushings just move more freely than the rubber bushings, which tend to bond anyway which limits movement, and eliminate the binding issues that way. I don't know. But I do know that I don't regret doing the full install.

Note that this is my daily driver, and also my weekend racer. So this car is pushed to the limits (and sometimes beyond) on a regular basis. If the snap oversteer tendencies were still there, I'd know about it.

Syonyk

I'll see how bad it is when I get it out on a track. Until then, I plan to keep the hard corners to parking lots and areas with good runoff and no traffic, and just stay under the limits.

... civilized? You mean every other thread isn't "CAN U HELP ME TURBO MY FC?" or "HALP! EXPERT HELPS NEEDED!~"? That would be nice...

No PS, so I won't worry about it, then.

I may get a picture of the hood latch posted - it's not even *trying* to push the hood up from what I can tell. It should be obvious to those who know what they're looking at if something's missing.

And I'm really leaning towards the bridgeport, at least for now. That should be plenty of power for the car, at least for a while. It definitely handles lighter than the FC, and I'm thinking a bridgeport would be an absolute blast while still remaining somewhat civil.

-=Russ=-

Jeezus

iTrader: (4)

I would keep the rear sway bar in. Taking it out is great for drag strips but sucks for handling.

Rogue_Wulff

There's nothing the really "pushes" the hood up when you hit the release, other than the rubber bumpers and seals around the edge. If the latch is adjusted too high, the hood may not move. A liberal application of a light spray lube can also work wonders on the latch.
As for the handle not returning after pulling it out, fairly normal. I just make sure I push it back in after releasing the hood.

Jeff20B

iTrader: (13)

Welcome to the LIGHT side. 1st gens really are the lighter side to owning rotaries. Don't let any of the old codgers tell you it's the dark side, unless they've owned 2nd and 3rd gens and are real moschists who love more pain than pleasure.

I've worked on several old schools, several 1st gens, and only very few 2nd gens and one 3rd gen. I can tell you the later cars are the dark side. I saw Darth Maul driving an FD the other day.

There is supposed to be a little spring pressure in the levers of the hood latch that push the hood up. Some don't pop up. My white '83 pops up, but you have to manually push the handle back in because it rubs the stock speaker grill.

boyee

iTrader: (3)

pics!!!

Syonyk

Pics soon. Forgot my camera, and am at work.

Another question: How's the Racing Beat exhaust system? I have the Racing Beat header on it, and it's abnoxiously metallic, even through 2 mufflers. I was planning to get the Racing Beat presilencer, and possibly the catback system at some point. How does that sound/perform?

-=Russ=-

glewsRx

iTrader: (1)

Kinda wierd; Stock 14" wheels? The stockers were the 13" +'s. Do you have an LE? I think those came with 14s.

Syonyk

You're right, the ones on there are 13s. However, I have a set of 14" waffles that I'm planning to use for sticky stuff.

-=Russ=-

1badFB

iTrader: (1)

Take a look at the hood latch mechanism. It definately pops the hood up, the rubber seals around the edge dont do anything.
Mine used to be a bit sheisty to open, so I sprayed the heck out of the mechanism with some penetrating lubricant. About 20 opening and closings of the hood and it was smooth as butter again.

I like to keep my cable and latch mechanism in tip top shape so I dont put any unneeded extra stress on the hood cable, They suck to break!

drittens

I've read several times that on a stock 1st gen, the rear sway bar actually promotes the rear end sliding out...have you given it a try?

kenn_chan

However, it should be considered that I have the Racing Beat springs and Illumina shocks too. So, perhaps a stiffer rear suspension setup limits the movement of the suspension, keeping it from reaching the point of binding. On the other hand, maybe the poly bushings just move more freely than the rubber bushings, which tend to bond anyway which limits movement, and eliminate the binding issues that way. I don't know. But I do know that I don't regret doing the full install.

Kentetsu,

the stiffer springs and shocks do limit the overall travel of the suspension and this helps to stop the snap oversteer, however...... by limiting suspension travel also causes problems in its own right. which if you would get your dodgy, mangy backside out and really drive your car, you would know as I have discovered

seriously... coming onto the front side of Fuji speedway just as I start to accelerate out of the last turn, there is a wicked bump that I could not deal with it almost totaled my car twice I spoke with several of the "old school" Japanese racers and they told me it was a common failing of the 7 back in the day if you lowered and stiffened up the *** end too much, you lose so much travel that you bottom out and then the car litterally bounces off of its bump stops and goes airborne

kenn

BlackWorksInc

I think I noticed what you're talking about just toay when I whipped my 82' around a nice street corner. Though it might have been the road was uneven, I don't know exactly.

I'm running a Tokico setup as well, with front sways, springs/shocks, and a rear shock set-up. Maybe I just turned her to hard and nicked a bump in the road O.o?

Anyways, for the hood latch issue;

1.) Hood alignment (While I was and am adjusting my hood for gap, the alignment is critical for the thing to even line up let alone release properly.

2.) Check the cable for stretching, rubbing, or overall wear.

3.) There should be a return spring in the driver's footwheel area of the cable.

4.) Lube! She's likes it when its easy to slip it in and out ^.^

5.) Check for damage to the hood latch and mechanism.

gsterror

I was always taught that FB's need to be softer in the rear with the sway bar removed to counter the 'bottoming out' effect'

Kentetsu

Alright Kenn, you asked for it now!

Here's proof that my **** handles right. Check out the nice four wheel drift coming out of the left turn half way through this video (and I don't mean a gay showy drift either, but a fast "done right" kinda drift if you know what I mean). I've even raced her in the rain, with no trace of the dreaded "snap oversteer" that was present when I first got the car.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jB-JDdINMzU


Syonyk: Sorry to take this so far off track, but I've been called out man. Gotta show my credentials now dammit!

Syonyk

Just weighed it on a local truck scale (for a power plant). 2260lbs, give or take. Possibly up to 2350, the scale took a bit to stabilize, and I couldn't see the gauge from the exact middle where I like to be.

*grins*

-=Russ=-

Rogue_Wulff

I know the feeling of "Bumpstop madness". My car came with an older set of ST springs, and KYB GR2 struts/shocks. The rear would bottom out very easily, as the springs are settled a bit from their age. I took the rear bumpstops, and cut them down by about 1.25". What a difference. The car no longer bottoms out on a pebble (minor exageration, very minor) causing the rear to be very nervous and uneasy feeling.
I know I really *should* replace the springs and shocks/struts with something better, but it now handles so much better that I am satisfied (for now).

kenn_chan

Kentetsu,
I would love to see it but gotta wait till I get home damn government computers have utube blocked


kenn

Syonyk

A few more thoughts/questions:

1. The AC has been removed, but the coils in the cabin are still there. How heavy are they, and are they worth removing? I know on the FC, the car was more or less assembled around the heater core/AC coils, and they're a nightmare to remove.

2. A friend of mine has a Racing Beat presilencer he'll sell me for $40. From my experience on the FC, this gets rid of a LOT of the buzziness. There's currently a normal muffler under the car as a semi-presilencer, and then a Pacesetter muffler in the back. Does the Pacesetter sound OK with the RB presilencer (if it bolts up - need to check on that)? Or does anyone have a Racing Beat muffler for an '83 just laying around?

3. Energy Suspension bushings for the rear - somewhat easy to install? They came with the car. Is this a "Saturday" project, or a "Week long" project? I've not done much suspension work.

4. Damn, this thing is fun to drive. :-) Even with so many fewer HP than my FC, it's still darn quick, pulls hard, and corners fairly flat. I'm really looking forward to getting the half bridgeport ported/installed (winter or spring project) - it should be quite abusive on the track with some good rubber.

-=Russ=-

Black_Knight

I haven't done suspension before, but I know that the first time I do try it I won't be relying on having my car the next day. If you know what I mean...

With the steering, it is heavy, but because the car is relatively light once you get rolling you should be ok.

My bonnet release is like that too. Lube it up and it should hopefully fix up. I haven't got a chance to try that yet but that's my plan of attack.

Syonyk

*nods* Steering is fine once the car's moving, just very heavy compared to other cars I've driven (including a Daihatsu with a manual rack).

I'll lube things up & see how it does.

-=Russ=-