jayroc

Drifting is cool, I likes drifting. heh
So far as definitions go, I dunno what to tell you. The understeer\oversteer thing is good from a technical standpoint, but the bottom line is that it is fun as hell. Watch some videos to see what it`s about. search for driftworks 1, 2 and 3. They are my favorite drift vids, especially 2. suprnova had a d-bible torrent, so if you want to be a cheapass you can go download it.
Actually though, popular or not, I would still be into drifting. I just like it, can`t explain why.
Anyone who says it is a waste of time or tires simply does not understand. But, hey if it`s not your thing, that`s cool. Just don`t give me **** about wasting my tires when I drift, and I won`t give you **** about wasting your gas when you drive. :P
I went to d1 at Irwindale last year, it was really cool. I also plan on going to Ebisu later this month for round 6. Should be very cool as well.

Rousuke91t

Wow that's a gerat definition it really sounds like you know what your talking about!!!

Kentetsu

Drifting Shmifting.....That's nothing but Michigan winter driving! If you're not sideways, you're doing it wrong!

Lotus00

Michigan, Minnesota... its all the same. Knowing how to controll my car (even when its sideways) has saved my *** umpteen million times.

DriveFast7

iTrader: (1)

Drifting is taking off. 2 weekends ago I was at Willow Springs Raceway to spectate the road racing onthe big track. About 30 drifter guys rented out the parking lot behind the Budweiser Balcony (turn 4) and were sliding around up there. Having a good time off the street. I had some saftey concerns, some people almost made contact, no k-wall to separate track and paddock; just some cones, and they didn't have any corner workers but overall it looked like a lot of fun. Saw some tires that were very chewed up and delaminating. I'll see if I can post some pics.

sweetege

Yea there's nothing like having somebody else in the car with you at like 50 and sliding around the corner. HOLY ^&*% #$%^ DUDE WHAT THE #$%@ @%*& %(&^* #$(*%*^. and so on and so on.....LOL Then after you're done HOLY #$%^ DUDE THAT WAS $%^@($ AWESOME. Nothin like it LOLOL

PureSephiroth

absolutely wrong. If you have ever been to an autcross and paid any attention to the times you would know that this guy is going incredibly slow. If you drift on perfectly dry and flat pavement you are going slow. That guy was slow. He was incredibly good, but very slow.

Drifting is faster than traditional driving in only a few situations which explain its roots well.

Dirt: that's why rally primarily uses a drifting technique
Rain: Limited traction almost requires a controlled slide during the rain
Snow: see above but +1
Downhill: Because most of the weight is on the front the traction in the rear is limited. This is why drifting is so popular in japan. They race on anything BUT flat courses.

sweetege

whoa whoa hold up i agree with what you said but it is also true that on SOME corners if you have a good drifter and a good gripper exact same car and tires on some flat corners the drifter will exceed because he can keep the speed up throughout the corner without braking, but this only works on perfect angle corners.

Rousuke91t

Fiirst. What's wrong with not flat surfaces.
Touge, up and down.Drifting originally was used to prevent passing on the touge.

I feel this is the best reprisentaton of drifting in all styles I've ever seen-[URL=http://www.racingflix.com/getvideo.asp?v=488&p=19]

Rousuke91t

http://www.racingflix.com/downloadvideo.asp?v=488http://www.racingflix.com/downloadvideo.asp?v=488

PureSephiroth

i'm noy saying there's anything wrong with it, i'm just saying that in the vid you posted, the guy was going slow because he was drifting. Unless the course meets certain criteria, drifting just scrubs off speed. That autocross did not meet any criteria that would make you need/want to drift. Face it, in most cases, drifting is slow. and i did mention going downhill as a criteria for drifting, like on a mountain course. I said that in my last post. Try READING.

and stop saying drifting was "originally used" to prevent passing on the touge. Drifting was originally used in the formula cars from many years ago because they used inner tube spoke strung radials that had next to no grip.

TurboIIGuy

Some of my buddies are chinese and Japanese, anyway they got uncles that sya the drift goes back to the early and mid 80's. That's when I heard it started to be like the street races are out here, where the guys would meetup on hill sides and stuff. It only started getting mainstrem in the 90's. but I'm sure there is a lot about the early days of drifting we will never be completely sure of.

PureSephiroth

no, we're definately sure of the early days of drifting. It was covered in magazines and seen by thousands of people. It was called Grand Prix cars! F1! come on people. it did not originate in japan.

82transam

iTrader: (18)

obviously the act of drifting a car didn't start in Japan, but making a sport out of *just* drifting is definatly Japanese. Why do threads regarding drifting always turn into huge arguments, it really ruins the fun constantly having to argue about it, just go slide your car and have fun, who really cares about the rest.

TurboIIGuy

Hello.....We're talking about the downhill drift bnot flat land stuff like the novices out here do. It started in Japan, you know, where the big mountains are that have roads in them. Hardly anyone here in the states, if anyone at all, went to the mountains to drift. In Japan it was dozens of cars that met up to do it kind of like the ricers that meet up out here for the cheesey street races.

PureSephiroth

are you calling the f1 racers of yesteryears novices? how is their drifting different? last i checked all of these drifter wannabe ricers threw on shitty back tires to drift. sounds kinda like the shitty tires on old grand prix cars to me. and as far as elevation changes go... ever heard of Manaco?

MosesX605

Drifting a sport for 32 years?

Bullshit.

If what you're trying to say is that in some situations, drift can be faster than grip and has therefore been used in motorsports, you would be correct. However, drifting in it's current incarnation, with all the lame ***, hanging out of the car while driving, style point giving fairy *** bullshit is just emerging here in North America and isn't that old elsewhere.

I am aware of what heel/toe is, and it has NOTHING to do with drifting being classified as a sport. Drifting is only faster than grip driving in a few select circumstances, like PureSephiroth said. Not only that, but there are 'style' marks in drifting competitions, a completely subjective determination. In the examples you used to try and justify your mad tyte dorifto skillz, drifting was used in conjunction with grip driving to POST THE FASTEST TIMES, not to look good while doing it.

Trust me, I'm been autocrossing for three years. That's a very short time and I still have a lot to learn, but what I have learned is that 'drifting' all by itself is dog *** slow and will not win you any real medals.

Though you may get a 5.0 in the Artistic Program.

Rousuke91t

First just because "The Everlovn' Sports Bureau" has'nt deemed something a sport does'nt meen its not. And ,If your gonna say it is faster on mountain roads why are you using the figure skating analogy . Why not compare it to
fighting styles? A Thai kickboxing technique is not going to work in a small area(bus,bathroom) just like how you would'nt use wrestling to take on multiple attakers.
You know, its that whole "right tool for the job"thing. They have mountains everywhere around Japan, just like how we have flat land.Do you think top speed was a concern before the appearance of the Wangan Express Way???

Oh yeah, and if Keiichi Tsuchiya is 47 now and he's been drifting since he was 14...And I seriously doubt he was the first or oldest out on that mountain.

"hanging out of the car while driving"-Come on guy Even you should equate this with Dale E. Jr. doing burnouts at the end of a race.

"I still have a lot to learn, but what I have learned is that 'drifting' all by itself is dog *** slow and will not win you any real medals."

You can't run faster than a dog. Why bring dogs into this?

"I mean, look at motorsports in general. The basic premise is to get from point 'A' to point 'B' in the fastest time possible."
Wrong Motorsports means what it says ,Sports involving motors.

TurboIIGuy

F1 racers are amongst the most advanced drivers in the world for their precision and ability. I am don't putting them down for sure. As for tires on a drift car real drifters or anyone that knows what's up doesn't use crappy tires. How the hell can you drift safely if you can't regain traction. Most people that are into the sport use good tires, I run on Advans and let me tell you they are hard to get and take long to order but they are better than most of the crap on the D.O.T. us market.

PureSephiroth

but most of the ametuers do it by throwing crappy tires on the rear, you have to admit that.

82transam

iTrader: (18)

Everyone seems to make a valid point here. While its true the majority of drifters in this country saw Fast and the Furious one too many times and think that big wing will make them drift better, a true drifter uses good tires, sometimes even bigger tires on the back to drift.
As for moses's comments, it just seems like you hate drifting man. The north American style of drifting, out in a parking lot with cones, is obviously just for show, but elsewhere, in more mountainous countries its a valid technique for racing. I don't really agree with your comment about motorsports being all about getting from A to B fastest. Most forms are like taht, but what about Moto X and so on, where the idea is to get style points for jumping etc on your dirt bike. Thats a motorized sport, yet involves a point system.
The other thing that kinda bugs me, is that everytime someone thinks of drifting they think of a huge 70 degree drift angle, smoke everywhere, engines screaming, etc. If you watch the drift bible, or any of the best motoring Touge battles, you'll see that they use a very slight drift angle in order to negotiate the turns, thats true drifting IMO, takes much more control and actually has a purpose.
As you might be able to tell I'm not a big fan of American drifting. I went to an amatuer event at Englishtown this summer and was bored out of my mind, I fail to see the appeal of sliding around in a parking lot, any one with a Trans Am in high school can do that (yes me )
Anyway, thats my $.02...

SPOOLIN84GSLSE

i discovered drifting when i finished building my turbo fb. took it to some autox events with new $15 hialeah tires and i had no traction with 210 at the wheels. So I just decided to drive my hardest smoking tires on every corner. some people said it looked cool. I needed new tires after 2 events.

Rousuke91t

1. Enter a turn at a speed too high for the vehicle to handle (if you do not drift, your vehicle should experience understeer at this speed).

2. Turn your wheels into the turn and stay on the throttle.

3. At this speed, your vehicle should start to experience understeer. When this happens or right before this happens, clutch in, but stay on the throttle.

4. By clutching in and staying on the throttle, your engine will now rev up to high rpms. As soon as this happens, dump the clutch, causing your rear wheels to break traction.

5. When you feel the vehicle’s rear end kicking out, immediately countersteer the wheels to face straight with the road. Your vehicle will pull in the direction of the front wheels, as long as the wheels are still moving. Keep on the throttle. If you press the brakes or let off the throttle because your vehicle is in an extremely oversteered condition, you will spin out or leave the road.

6. When you wish to straighten out your car, after completing the drift, let off the throttle smoothly and straighten out the wheels as your vehicle kicks in line behind the front tires. [IMG]http://www.ziptied.com/media/Ebisu%20Circuit%20-%

202003/images/fd3sdrift1.jpg[/IMG]

TurboIIGuy

/\ /\ /\ /\ /\ /\
that's how you start to learn the concept of drift but actual drifting once you have a feel for it invloves getting the car side way before entering the turn and also plays very closely with weight transfer. Brakes are a big part of drifting, it's not just all throttle. The way described in the last post up here is what you wouldcall apexing a turn with minimum traction, it's the easiest way to introduce yourself to drifting and the feeling of your car understeering and how to get a feel for countersteering. After that then your ready for some actual drifts.

Junia

I used to up shift into a drift back when I used to do it. Back when I used to do it I would take off in first and shift into second without letting off the throttle. I think the easiest way to learn how to control oversteer is to just sit in a place and do 360's and do figure 8's.