MountainScreamer

So, I'm rebuilding my 84 gsl 12a w/162000mi. just bought the car off a guy who said an apex seal was bad. it has terrible compression, so I'm thinkin thats what it is.

So, I looked at Atkins and their "B" kit is 923 bucks!! that seems a little ridiculous
Surely this stuff can be had for less, right?

I would like to replace everything internally, (apex seals+springs, side seals, corner seals...). I don't want to risk other stuff failing due to age.
So what are all the necessary things to get it running again?
Thanks, anything would be much appreciated!!

Merry Christmas

Rx-7Doctor

iTrader: (13)

Have you tried the ATF treatment yet? What were the compression numbers?

Latin270

Yep thats about right! Some guys on a buget will replace only what needs to be replaced but thats up to you.

MountainScreamer

(sigh)...I hate the money part of workin on cars...
I will probably replace most internals just to be safe. sadly, safe is expensive.

But, I have not tried the ATF treatment. I actually drove the car up on a ramp to haul it home. I say it has bad compression because it would barely move. I had to have some friends push it from behind. It also smoked a little... dont know if thats from a bad apex seal. The guy who owned it before said after the seal went, it wouldn't drive over 40 at all.

I hope its not royally screwed. I'm kinda worried that if it is an apex seal, then it was scraped all over the housings.
I guess there's nothin nut to crack it open and see.

Rx-7Doctor

iTrader: (13)

Your looking at in a negative fashion. How much does it cost for a "New" vehicle? When you compare that to the cost of a rebuild, then?

MountainScreamer

Yeah, good call.

I guess I'll open it up and really see for myself, eh?

I'm just worried the housings might be bad and all that you know? that really starts to add up.

nick812

I was gonna do a rebuild and have most of the parts still if you need them.

MountainScreamer

So, what all is necessary for a rebuild?

What is the bare minimum, and the most that can be replaced without getting a whole new engine?

MountainScreamer

Nick, what all do you have?

Jeezus

iTrader: (4)

I am interested as well. I have a rebuilt motor with about 18k on it, but I am going to port it. the bare minimum kit is I believe 300$ for me.

NC represent :p

nick812

Pm me.

nick812

True min. whould be just a gasket kit wich you can get for around 100 shipped. I would get all new springs with 3rd gen corner seal springs. With springs but with out apex seals should be less than 300.

Jeezus

iTrader: (4)

woah woah, news to me! any links?

nick812

www.mazdatrix.com www.atkinsrotary.com

atkins kit A would work good for you.

Jeezus

iTrader: (4)

so kit A, side seal springs, apex seal springs, and 93-95 Corner Seal Spring Set?

trochoid

iTrader: (6)

1st, try the atf treatment. If that doesn't help, then tear the engine down to see what needs replacing. In general, if the housings and irons are in spec, a gasket kit, rotor kit, solid corner seals and 3rd corner seal springs will suffice. All springs should be replaced, side seals rarely need replaced. If they show signs of uneven wear and are in spec, flip them to use the other face.

zaridar

iTrader: (3)

Bringing this back... im looking at rebuilding my engine that i blew an apex seal in. looking at getting RA seals. Everything else should be new because the motor was rebuilt a couple years ago... would Atkins Kit A with Ra seals and springs be everything i need? i think so... i was thinking i was going to have to spend 1000 bucks or more this looks very nice round 600... thanks

cfamilyfix

iTrader: (15)

If a "budget" is truely important to you, then do ALL the free stuff you can. First do your own proper compression test. It's not always an apex seal that will give you bad compression. If after the compression test you still feel curious about the apex seals, you can pull off the exhaust manifold/ headers and inspect the seals. Check them for movement and insure they are smooth along the sealing edges. Any roughness felt or non movement would then comfirm your apex seal worries. Then if it is determined that you need a rebuild, dont buy anything until you pull the motor apart and inspect and clean everything. This will save you a couple of bucks on repeated shipping as well as some time if it is determined that you need more than a "base rebuild kit" Keep in mind too that parts for 12a engines are quickly becoming obsolete and that pretty soon your only options for a clean set of rotor housings will be from the members of this forum or another like it. It might be cheaper to find a 13b in the long run. Don't give up hope, anything you do or money you spend will be worth it once you hear it run. Hope this helps. Good luck with the project!

j9fd3s

iTrader: (3)

least expensive is to pull it apart, and measure everything. that way you replace what you actually need only.

its cheaper, you end up with a better engine (you will KNOW everything is in spec).

however it does take longer.

-xlr8planet-

iTrader: (3)

I agree

Man_in_black49464

iTrader: (1)

just wait till you tare it apart and find out you need new housings....hehehe

might as well port it while your in there small street port would do you good, and best part is you can buy some carbon apex seals wich are cheaper but they only last 20,000 miles so save your money until then and do a full rebuild with new parts

zaridar

iTrader: (3)

I Know its an apex seal.... already did a compression test, pulled the motor/turbo manifold saw the broken seal. It is already street ported. Pretty sure i will need a new housing but have two used ones in back of the garage. I would like to replace everything with new that actually would be best replaced. I will be running 15-20 psi so i want good stuff in there... I have heard that side seals are usually pretty tough and are usually reusable with great results. Is this true or false in most's opinions?

84stock

iTrader: (5)

gonna be tough to find new 12a housings!

j9fd3s

iTrader: (3)

you are asking the wrong question. its very easy to measure the side seal clearance and then you will know if they are good or not.

and actually @20 psi maybe you should be replacing ALL of the seals anyways, would you reuse a 30 year old piston ring?

DriveFast7

iTrader: (1)

When an apex seal goes it'll sometimes grenade the rotor too. Or wear it's groove in the rotor wider like a V shape instead of U.

If the side seals are within clearance and if the apex seal shrapnel didn't chew em then why not? They're also cheap.