Red95FD

iTrader: (3)

I found a low miles 79 gs with under 15K miles. The seats have always been covered. I have not seen it in person yet. The pics are sweet though. The owner is a collector but he's not up on rotaries and he has let the car sit for around 20 years. Garaged it's entire life.

I've read that I would need to drain the fuel tank to see what that's like. The owner wants to try to start the car but I'm thinking that might not be a good idea. I would think the seals would to be lubed up somehow.
Anyone have an idea what the best procedure is for getting a 12A running without damaging anything?

Red95FD

iTrader: (3)

Oops Wrong section for this.

erick31876

iTrader: (8)

squirt some oil into each rotor housing and turn it over by hand to get everything lubed up,drain the gas tank blow out the lines change the filter change the oil and filtermake sure the carburetor is not seized,put fresh gas in and give it a shot

Banzai

iTrader: (13)

Seems like you just want to determine if it starts and fires up before buying? Did it run when put away? If it only has 15K miles, chances are it did and will run again. The first step it to see if it turns over by hand. You can squirt some marvel mystery oil in the plug holes before hand cranking to help spread it around. 79 tanks don't have a drain plug, so draining the tank would require dropping it. Might be a good idea to rig up a small container of fresh fuel and gravity feed it to the carb, by passing the fuel line. (plug off the regular line so that it doesn't pump fuel out all over)

I'd just see if it starts, then shut it down without running too much. Just a thought, you might be able to buy it cheaper without starting it first.

j9fd3s

iTrader: (3)

drop a little oil down the carb, and spin the engine by hand.

if it has been stored 100% properly, it should be completely fine, however it would be a good idea to look in the radiator, and smell the gas. bad gas is a very distinct smell. the radiator should be full and it should be green. if its brown in the radiator, plan on boiling it out before you really drive it.

7aull

iTrader: (2)

Don't be too dismayed if it does not fire up and run right off the Bat. That is a l-o-o-o-ong time to be sitting. Unless the Owner took some very specific steps to put it into hibernation, then the potential for things (as mentioned) like very bad gas, plugged carb jets (see: Bad Gas), gummed up fuel tanks and their outlets, long-corroded battery cables or connections (which reduce the juice-output of the battery to the ignition - and rotaries need a good, STRONG battery to fire up), the fuel-filter (under the car in front of the rear driver tire) will be past its due-date and could stop you cold, and finally, the apex seals at the rotor tips (which are spring-loaded) may be gummed up with carbon, thus low-compression = no start. (a day or 2 with Seafoam in the combustion chambers can free this up).
FIRST thing I would do before trying to start it is make sure it can be HAND-cranked. If the engine is CARBON-LOCKED (piece of cooked carbon wedged into the chamber, or sticking the apex seals springs so that the deal will not press correctly against the Housing to create compression), then there is a risk of damaging the internal housing surface as the starter grinds away trying to spin it up. A failure of this test would be a sign of trouble to come if you proceed.
So. I would be VERY specific with the Owner that the car NOT BE STARTED before your appointment!! (Just say there are some specific things you need to confirm that can only be done on a cold engine - which is true). Why? because you (owner) can still get a technically-dead (failed engine seals) rotary started and run. And once warmed up, a lot of the failure issues "go away" until the engine cools down again. Heat-soaked, the seals "magically" swell up and seal potential leak issues. Issues you get to discover on your first cold start of your new Baby at home. So stick your hand on the block when you arrive. If its warm, then a lot of what you are trying to determine will be untestable...
Anyway - as some suggest here, the lack of it's starting could = a hefty discount ("gee the engine might need a rebuild") from the owner. If you are willing to risk it.
RUST:
Make sure you eye-ball the chassis - esp underneath. Years of poor storage (outside? in a moist garage?) can make 15K miles meaningless. Check around/under lower HATCH seal rim to be sure metal is solid. Likewise lift up SUNROOF seal to be sure its solid under there.
Presume tires and shocks will be shot, no matter how good they Look (tires).
Factor in a re-furb of the fuel system, which, as said, is a gas-tank-out procedure in the 79 and 80 SAs. (tho you can drain most of the fuel out via the fuel-sender port on the inside of the driver rear wheel well. But a proper flush would be best).
Hope you post some pics and details if you Do the Deed. Sounds like an interesting Buy.

Stu Aull
80GS
Alaska

j9fd3s

iTrader: (3)

i agree with stu!

once its running its going to need all the fluids, and filters. its also going to need tires, and probably the brake and clutch hydraulics too. if you're lucky the fuel system is ok, but there is also a chance that the gas turned back into dinosaurs. if the coolant is ok, then you may be ok, if its not, then you will need to flush out the engine, and rod out the radiator, and change ALL of the hoses and cross your fingers the engine is ok.

the oil system is ok, because oil can't rust.

and then you get to find out why the guy parked it in the first place!

Red95FD

iTrader: (3)

Thanks guys. You gave me great info. I'm trying to get the seller to not start it and have explained some of the things mentioned here. Talking to him makes me think he has sense but he does want to start it. Last communication I ask if I could help him with the process. Have not heard back from a week ago. I'm going to call him. Like I said, I have not seen the car in person but from the pics and the history the owner gave me over the phone, this thing is as sweet as it gets but we shall see. The cool thing is the owner has not renewed the ad and is giving me first shot at it. here are some of the pics.

7aull

iTrader: (2)

Pretty car, Red. Lack of a sunroof would kill the "perfect" moniker for me, but that is a personal choice.
Some thoughts:
-puzzled one of his photos does NOT show the speedo?! With the claimed mileage, THAT would be a huge selling point. (but then, some people are _clueless_ about selling stuff too, so…)
-check around mud guard mount points for rust. They will have been screwed on. Unfortunately.
-you have not mentioned a price. Any reason why not?
-ask if he has the OE wheels, would be nice to have
-make sure P. Antenna is working
-ask to see the service records, any paperwork he has on it.
-check the title doc and make sure his name is on it. Not illegal if not, but could confirm he is the original owner, FWIW.
-don't wait to hear back if you know where the car is - go knock on the door!
-take a camera with you and photograph _everything_. That way you have a detailed doc of the car and something to look at more closely back home and review before you make an offer.

Again- there are LOTS of SAs that come up for sale, so don't panic if this does not pan out. Don't get seduced by the mileage! I would _happily_ buy a nicely maintained SA with 4x the mileage and get the Right One. (In fact, I did: had 64k mi on her…). Time is your friend in this game.

Stu Aull
80GS
Alaska

Red95FD

iTrader: (3)

Yea I'm not seduced by the mileage. I drove 200 miles one way to see a 83 gsl with 5000 miles. Talked to the guy and he told me it was like showroom new looking. I wanted to choke this ahole when I got there. Most of the car look good the interior looked new but thats where it ended. So yea most cars are never what the owners say. But I have noticed the older the seller, the closer the car is to the description. This gentleman is 63 I think he said and he has a handful or more cars he picked up over the years thinking they would go up in price. He has to sell 3 of his cars so to buy a new Chevy truck or something. He's asking $8k for the car. I offer 3400 and that is not set in stone. I will go check it out first of course. Then if things work out I might get it. If I don't get it for whatever reason and it's pretty nice, I'll share the details.
I'm looking for something to clean up, maybe have whatever needs repairing, then enter it in a Concours d'Elegance car show. There is a great 2nd tier Cd'E here in Cinci at Ault Park that has an Asian Collector category. I actually won Best of class there with an 88 AE in 2009. Thought I'd try again.

Yea it's not the mileage that matters, it how it is taken care of. If this car has bad paint or interior in any way, I'm out.

j9fd3s

iTrader: (3)

the red is nice because its a single stage paint, so it'll clean up and look new until you get down to primer!

here is a short list of things to look for in an SA/FB.

underhood.

1. all of the hose clamps are a gold cad plated wire type using a 6mm bolt. if you see a worm clamp, someone has had the thing apart. if you get really white glove the clamps are all faced specifically at the factory, to allow access.
2. the radiator has a small 1/2"x2" silver sticker on the top where the upper hose is. if the sticker is missing, or painted over the radiator has been replaced/rodded out.
3. the original spark plug wires are black, the trailing (i think) have blue ends, the leading are black. upon closer inspection, they will say Yazaki and have a date on them. the date should be the same as the car, or earlier. the wires are clipped into a single 4 wire clip.
4. the radiator or heater hoses can be fabric covered.
5. the alternator belt has a big blue patch, and the air pump a white one, i forget the brands (i'd have to look at my belt collection), if they are original belts, expect them to be really loose!
6. this may go without saying, but the engine should not be painted, and there should be no stamps in the front rotor housing. painted irons = rebuild. the Mazda remans used to have a date stamp on the front rotor housing, it'll have a date and a serial type number.
7. the 79 engines have cream colored pulleys, and they turn black at some point during the 1980 model year. not sure when, but if the car was an early 79 with black pulleys, it would be odd, ditto the late 1980 car with cream pulleys.
8. the under tray is black in 79, at some point its a natural silver color

body/chassis.

1. the car was painted at the factory with the fenders on, so the bolts holding the fenders on should be painted.
2. there is a bead of seam sealer between the fender and the body, under the hood. its done by hand so it varies, but there is always something in the back corners. if the sealer is broken, its been apart.
3. there is a bead of sealer between the body and headlight assembly, again by hand, but if its broken, its been apart.
4. the undercoating was applied when the body was assembled, so the undercoating seam should be crisp and it should match all the way around the car. often a paint shop will use this line as a masking line, or paint over the whole thing, so it looses its crisp edge (it can be pretty thick, FD is similar). the texture is not as smooth as the FD.
5. the body is painted after its assembled, but nothing else was on it, so there should be no overspray on anything that isn't sheet metal.
6. the original headlights are Koito brand.
7. the early 79's had a window trim that is almost a dark metallic grey, vs the later black. we could look in the parts catalog to see which you car should have based on the vin, but all the trim should match. it should all be either dark grey, or black, if its mixed something happened.

interior.
1. you're basically looking for condition here.
2. the vinyl seats with perforated seating surfaces had a red liner under the vinyl, so the perforations appear red if the seat hasn't been sat in.

Banzai

iTrader: (13)

Is this an "S" or "GS" model?

7aull

iTrader: (2)

Think the shift **** makes it a GS, Banzai.

Some nice OE details there j9. Will certainly help nailing down mileage claim! Have to say I have never seen any SAs with cloth-wrapped hoses myself, even in the early RX literature… but yes, on the Oil cooler Lines.

$3400 is in the ballpark as an offer, Red. Certainly you would find a LOT of nicer SAs at his ask.

Stu Aull
80GS
Alaska

Banzai

iTrader: (13)

Good point Stu. A 4sp would (should) have the rounder ****. Not sure how far away this car is for Red, but if serious, he needs to make the trip to actually see it with some cash in his pocket.

j9fd3s

iTrader: (3)

when i bought my SA in 2007, it had the original coolant hoses on it (!), so i ordered all of them, they are still available new, and in replacing them i found that the original hoses were actually still fine (!), and that the heater hoses had a fiber wrap, similar to the oil cooler hoses.

there were also specific placement of the clamps, i found that they were placed so that they were all accessible without moving, or removing anything else.

in fact compared to the GSL-SE's i'm more used to, it was neat to work on the SA. there were several things, like the trans mount that were much easier to get to on the SA

7aull

iTrader: (2)

j9 it prob helps that they made so many more SAs than SEs?
No argument from me tho - I love working on mine, and I am NO mechanic!

RED - have you seen the SA yet (to get us back on topic…)??

Stu Aull
80GS
Alaska

j9fd3s

iTrader: (3)

i think its more that they added stuff to get a GSL-SE, so its not quite as simple as the SA is for the most part.

Red95FD

iTrader: (3)

[QUOTE=7aull;11851722]j9 it prob helps that they made so many more SAs than SEs?
No argument from me tho - I love working on mine, and I am NO mechanic!

RED - have you seen the SA yet (to get us back on topic…)??

Stu Aull
80GS
Alaska

Great info I'm getting here. I appreciate it.

But no I haven't seen the car yet. I relayed some of the info realizing he might raise the price or even keep the car but that's ok, I just want to see it running again without damage to the original engine.
He told me he put some MM oil in the plug holes and turned the engine over by hand the next day. Then he did the oil again. He removed the fuel line hoses from the carb in the car. I think he's going to put fuel in the line to try and start it. But that's where it ended, He's got got other things going on. My wife just got a knee replacement so I'm her slave for awhile. anyway

OK, So I believe this is a 4 speed. I thought the seller made a mistake in the ad. I didn't know there were 4 speeds. What's the story there?

One of the things I'm not feeling good about is there is rust in the engine bay he sent me a pic. Looks like the under tray has rust on the top. And the alternator looks like it's on a car that's been sitting outside for some time. I hope I'm wrong but I will know when I do finally get over there to see the car.
The vin is SA22C-527557. One odd thing, the wind shield trim looks to be black and in great shape except for the bottom piece. It is faded to the point I can see metal. Maybe a bad sign idk.
Some of the pics are failing to upload. I'll work on that.

7aull

iTrader: (2)

Hmmm - out-of-focus shift **** sez "5-speed" but if it IS a 4speed then its a base-model "S", which, in my book, is about as undesirable an SA as there is short of (sorry Banzai) an automatic. Would account of the aftermarket rims if he (owner) was not taken with the steel rims these came with. Generally the "S" model came sans black body moldings too, tho the selling dealer did install them as well. These "S" are missing a host of nice bits the"regular" GS models came with, such as interval wipers, electric rear hatch release, the 5-speed of course…
This would, for me, reset the offered price as well, since you will never get the interest or return on this model (in spite the mileage) as you will on a GS… his ask is beyond fantasy if this is an "S".

Your observation of the window trim fade is a bit disturbing too.

Stu Aull
80GS
Alaska

j9fd3s

iTrader: (3)

[QUOTE=Red95FD;11852210]the SA models are quite a bit different than the later models, in some ways.

the S model is the basic model. it came with a 4 speed manual, 2 spoke steering wheel, no rear sway bar, steel wheels.

the GS adds the 5th gear, rear sway bar, 4 spoke steering wheel, and some little interior lights and things. also the exterior moldings.

the a/t, sunroof a/c and alloy wheels were stand alone options.

Red95FD

iTrader: (3)

His ad said GS model and 4 speed so I'll have to ask a few questions. He has a story of how the car lived it's first 12k miles and the po was a maniac about taking care of the car.

There doesn't seem to be any sun damage anywhere in the pics except the bottom trim. It is weird. At this point I'm leaning towards not getting it but I still want to see it .

Banzai

iTrader: (13)

S models came standard with 4 speeds. GS models came standard with either a 5 speed or the 3 sp auto as a GS only option. You could not get either: a GS w/a 4sp or an S w/a 5sp or auto from the factory, period. The surface rust under the hood is something that sometimes happens if stored indoors in a damp location. Could just be condensation from the floor. The window trim is notorious for fading and wearing off. In 79 the trim was a metallic grey color, same with the plastic mirrors. In 1980 they went to a more solid black color.

Stu is right, the picture is of a 5 sp style **** even though the emblem is out of focus. If it has a 4 speed, then the **** should be different. It could be an original GS model which had a 4 speed installed at some point for some reason. And yes, if it is a "S" model, it could account for the aftermarket rims. Waffels were standard on the GS but an option on the S, so a lot of S models got aftermarket wheels installed as some point as an upgrade, where as most of the waffel equipped cars kept their factory wheels.

As Stu noted, ask if it has intermittent wipers. S's didn't have that option and isn't something commonly upgraded by subsequent owners.

Red95FD

iTrader: (3)

Talked to the owner and he said he put 4 speed with GS in the title to see if the person inquiring knew rx7s. I never said anything to him because I thought he just made a mistake plus I didn't know until now they had 4 speeds in any rx7s. He has the original sticker, tires, wheels, plus full RB exhaust and 2 sets of aftermarket wheels.

RotaryBobby

iTrader: (4)

those wheels
any idea what wheels those are unless they're stockers, and even then there badass

twalke81

If you make the purchase and decide to do an aftermarket radio, I would be interested in the clarion and the center panel