vipernicus42

iTrader: (4)

Now how does the fuel get injected? Can you set it up so that the fuel and the NOS get mixed and sprayed in together? Do you use one nozzle for the fuel and one for NOS?

What exactly is a "fogger"?

Jon

PS: Edit, I must thank you guys, I haven't asked this many questions about a topic since I was a 1st-year n00b! It's kinda fun to learn new things again.

81gsl12a

iTrader: (1)

this is a fogger



it explanes all your questions

perfect_circle

why wouldnt i be able to run reg 87 pump gas, if i was only doing like a 50 or 75 shot, and the just watch the a/f's and up the fuel jet if need be?

81gsl12a

iTrader: (1)

caz of pre-detanation .... the rotarty gets super hot as we already know. when the nitrous/ fule mix get shot in to the HOT chamber it ignites... need better fule or race gas... you dont have the problem with piston motors caz they are not as hot in the chamber... good fule is what you need to be safe... you may be able to run a 50 shot everyday off of 89 but its not as safe.. the biggest thing is watch your A/f.....and hope its not to late better to start out to rich

perfect_circle

oh well of course its better to start off rich, i was sorta just implementing the idea. i just dont want to go through the hassle of a secondary fuel source. my friends dad sells race gas and races. so i could get 110. but i dont really know if i want to go through the hassle. where would i mount it??

81gsl12a

iTrader: (1)

you can do it in the windshield washer resovoir? use it as a tank and hook a fule pump and set that up as a 2nd fule system...just watch the fule level you dont want to run out

vxturboxv

iTrader: (2)

I agree and disagree with alot in this thread. First off How much N20 are you wanting to "spray" perfect_circle and vipernicus42.

If your only going with a 50 shot. 91-93 octane is just fine as long as you swap you retard your timing a few degrees and get a set of colder range plugs.

The reason I like the idea of methanol is you can run pump gas all over town (just make sure your methanol tank is full when you fill your bottle. less than 2 dollars a gallon). The methanol will take care of the detonation so you don't have to run colder plugs or change timing. So your normal daily driving performance is not changed.

Going 75-125+ is a different story. I'd be locking my distributer at no more than 14 degrees. Running 2 ranges colder plugs if possible. And Removing the trailing plug wires.

Stepping the jet size down accordingly and bumping the line pressure on the alcohol up to 120 or so will provide awesome atomization. And the extremely cool burning alcohol will prevent detonation and pre-ignition as good as or better than race fuel at less than half the cost.

Also I would use some sort of octane booster. That is why my idea of using a cheapo shur flow pump setup and methanol seems the most effective.

perfect_circle

i wasnt aware hte shur flow pump was cheap, i will see if i would be able to source methenol anywhere around here.

vxturboxv

iTrader: (2)

Any race track will have it. Or you can use denatured alcohol. Or possibly e85.

http://cgi.ebay.com/SHURFLO-PUMP-2-8...em110091878258

http://cgi.ebay.com/SHURFLO-3-GPM-20...em180083475702

1.8 GPM is more than enough. But having more won't hurt.

vipernicus42

iTrader: (4)

Aha!

That most certainly does explain everything.

So a distribution block would allow me to run two foggers, one for rotor 1 and one for rotor 2. Drill and tap spots in the secondary runners of the intake mani for them.

If I was running methanol in my supply tank, would I be able to run 87 pump gas in my gas tank ? would the injection of the high-octane methanol be enough to balance it out, or should I run 91 anyway just to be on the safe side?

Jon

Edit: between when I started writing this post, and when I finished like an hour later, my question was answered.

This definitely sounds like the way to go. I'm thinking just a 50-shot, methanol in a separate reservoir with its own pump.

Now how do you control the pump? If you set up a separate switch to "prime" it, what releases when you want it to go?

81gsl12a

iTrader: (1)

i have a arming switch that turns everything on then 1 button that opens the solenoid's(sprays nitrous/fule)

also something to remember about methanol is it is ever hard on everything... it eats thru rubber. it is vilent when it ignights and it is every illegal in the streets. it causes cancer lol the list goes on and on....

race teams that use it clean everything at the end of the day. they dont let it set in the tank. they clean injectors and lines but it makes lots and lots of power... also the jetting changes when you are dealing with methanol

vxturboxv

iTrader: (2)

Heres my 2 blocks setup with 4 fogger nozzles...



The foggers are nice because you can adjust your mixtures with the "pill " sizes. I'd suggest 2.

vipernicus42

iTrader: (4)

Where is the solenoid placed? in the fuel line?

I'm just trying to understand what's between the bottle and the fogger, and what's between the fuel pump and the fogger which allow you to fill the lines, but acts like a button-activated valve to open them when you want it.

Hmm.... is there something else high-octane that I can use in my resivoir that isn't as crazy? I just want to fill the resivoir, top off the bottle, and leave it until the day I'm ready to use it. On that day, flip the prime switch, get to WOT then press the button.


Wouldn't jetting of the carb only change if I was running methanol *though* the carb? I plan on running pump gas on a normal everyday basis, but have something in the reservoir that can offset the danger of NOS and up the octane for the duration of the NOS burst.

Jon

vxturboxv

iTrader: (2)

Jetting changes in a way... General rule of thumb is double it. But if your running twice the rated fuel pressures i.e. a .22 jet @ 60psi would be the same as a .44 jet at 30psi. Anyway thats something I'd run across the N20 techs at holley.com. Tell them the type of fuel, fuel pressure, type of engine and desired HP and they will give you jet sizes. They usually get back to you in less than 24 hours.

As far as the dangers of methanol... well yea duh. But it's no more flammable that regular gasoline. Shurflo pump diaphrams are made to withstand it (had mine kicking for over 3 years) and I use stainless steel lines and have never had a problem. As long as it isn't sitting on alum parts for a long period of time and you don't try to use it as mouth wash....

I think your in the clear.

Your not running it through your injectors and your not using it as a primary fuel. I would suggest after just spraying your car with it to drive it around a few minutes to clear out the system. But I doubt many people make a n20 pass and shut the car down to pull it in the driveway.

But you still bing up alot of good points. Fact is us buick guys have been using it for 20 years. As long as you maintain it, it works great. You can also use 91%+ isopropyl. Or ethanol...

You can always go this route and just buy a kit ready to go as well...

http://www.alcohol-injection.com/dod...tion-p-22.html

Siraniko

iTrader: (13)

One of my install with 4 foggers. Did get to clean it up as we ran out of time.

perfect_circle

what would be a suitable container to keep the methenol in? would it eat through a plastic container? because i like jon would like to just fill up and then have it for when i want it. so would 110 be safe enought to do like methenol or not?

vipernicus42

iTrader: (4)

... I don't understand what you mean by "a .22 jet @ 60psi".... my carb runs on 3.5psi, and all the holleys I know run max 6psi...

Jon

vxturboxv

iTrader: (2)

I'm talking about the pressure put out by the shurflow pump. not the carb fuel pump. And I'm talking about N20 jets not carb jets.

Methanol won't eat through plastic. A windshield tank is fine. Good Windshield washer fluid is almost all methanol anyway.

NO fuel would not be as safe at the alcohol. And the shurflo pump mightr not stand up to it.

81gsl12a

iTrader: (1)

anywhere you like it motor/fire wall/ custom bracket

the fule like is run to the fule solenid the a line is run to the fogger

a line runs from the bottle to the nitrous solenoid, then a line is run to the fogger



yes you can use VP race fuel, turo blue, rocket race fule, ect ect




the jets we are talking about are in the foggers.. they determin how big of a shot you run...


anything else?

perfect_circle

so what exacty of the dangers of methanol. and what are some other alternatives, and what are the pros/cons of them?

vipernicus42

iTrader: (4)

Nice... so both NOS line and FUEL line have a solenoid, and both of those solenoids are triggered by my "GO!!!" switch. Prime switch just makes sure there's fuel and pressure behind the fuel solenoid, and as long as the bottle has gas, there'll be pressure behind the NOS solenoid.

This is starting to sound awesome.

Jon

perfect_circle

im thinking there is going to be two bitchin write ups about this hear soon. lol.

81gsl12a

iTrader: (1)

lol i can take pics of my set up at the end of the week if yous want.... there are also other tihngs you can get like bottle warmers to keep the psi the same so you are never lean or rich


cha ching viper i think you are starting to get it

perfect_circle

i would love to see some pictures of your setup.... i dont understand why the NOS kits are so elaborate, all you really need is a bottle, lines, jets, solenoids, and foggers. right?