Megasquirt Need HELP please!...MSII V3.0 EMS does not detect tach signal
Thread Starter
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 393
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From: Sioux Falls, SD
Need HELP please!...MSII V3.0 EMS does not detect tach signal
HELP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
A friend of mine (electrical engineering major and works at Dakota Digital) helped me get the MSII V3.0 correct firmware/ect loaded into the EMS (we used his laptop and devices). We got all the parameters filled in (we used aaroncakes web page for the walk through), reflashed and was ready to go. The EMS detected all the signals (air fuel ratio, lambda, 02 %, water temp, TPS, exhaust temp, time, etc) except for the tachometer (engine speed/rpm). My friend checked all of the wiring (made sure everything was where it was supposed to be) and he also took in the EMS to his job where he checked the EMS internals/grounds/solder points/etc. Also the tach in the dash does receive power and will light up, so I know that is correctly wired up.
My question is:
What are the possible bugs that could cause the EMS not to sense RPM signal? Is it in the firmware, possible parameter missing, etc.
My car is done as far as mechanical and is ready to come alive again.
Since my friend and I used his computer (he is always busy), I was wondering if anyone could lead me to the right direction as to which firmware to use/ what program/ which files to use. That would be very helpful, I am not electrically inclined but I would like to learn more on the MSII V3.0. Thanks
I currently have Megatune 2.25 downloaded from these sites:
http://www.aaroncake.net/rx-7/megasquirt/ProgramMS2.asp
http://www.megamanual.com/megatune.htm#install
That very same friend is going to street tune my rx7 when the weather is good, but first I want to get it to at least idle.
This is what I have (some of these listed are not necessary to finding the bugs in the programs but I like to state what I have because its a habit):
J-Spec S5 1989 13B TII (stock ports, stock internals)
6-AN braided fuel lines
Sump pan welded to fuel tank
Aeromotive A1000 fuel pump
1000cc primaries, 1200cc secondaries
Master power T70 turbo (70mm)
Powerdex AFX
EGT sensor
Running E85 for fuel premixed with 2 cycle oil
unknown electronic boost controller
stock N/A coils (re-wired and soldered to meet MS requirements)
3" exhaust from turbo to magnaflow exhaust
Throttle knifed and polished
3 row FMIC (2.5" tubing)
Emissions removal (air pump, BAC, etc)
OMP delete, no p/s, no a/c
custom idle control valve system (generic GM model to work with EMS)
Sard FPR
stock oil cooler
5 speed TII trans and drivetrain (rear end, axles, etc)
1988 Black FC RX7
Thanks in advance to whomever and whatever is said in the benefit of having another rx7 alive.
I thank you all
A friend of mine (electrical engineering major and works at Dakota Digital) helped me get the MSII V3.0 correct firmware/ect loaded into the EMS (we used his laptop and devices). We got all the parameters filled in (we used aaroncakes web page for the walk through), reflashed and was ready to go. The EMS detected all the signals (air fuel ratio, lambda, 02 %, water temp, TPS, exhaust temp, time, etc) except for the tachometer (engine speed/rpm). My friend checked all of the wiring (made sure everything was where it was supposed to be) and he also took in the EMS to his job where he checked the EMS internals/grounds/solder points/etc. Also the tach in the dash does receive power and will light up, so I know that is correctly wired up.
My question is:
What are the possible bugs that could cause the EMS not to sense RPM signal? Is it in the firmware, possible parameter missing, etc.
My car is done as far as mechanical and is ready to come alive again.
Since my friend and I used his computer (he is always busy), I was wondering if anyone could lead me to the right direction as to which firmware to use/ what program/ which files to use. That would be very helpful, I am not electrically inclined but I would like to learn more on the MSII V3.0. Thanks
I currently have Megatune 2.25 downloaded from these sites:
http://www.aaroncake.net/rx-7/megasquirt/ProgramMS2.asp
http://www.megamanual.com/megatune.htm#install
That very same friend is going to street tune my rx7 when the weather is good, but first I want to get it to at least idle.
This is what I have (some of these listed are not necessary to finding the bugs in the programs but I like to state what I have because its a habit):
J-Spec S5 1989 13B TII (stock ports, stock internals)
6-AN braided fuel lines
Sump pan welded to fuel tank
Aeromotive A1000 fuel pump
1000cc primaries, 1200cc secondaries
Master power T70 turbo (70mm)
Powerdex AFX
EGT sensor
Running E85 for fuel premixed with 2 cycle oil
unknown electronic boost controller
stock N/A coils (re-wired and soldered to meet MS requirements)
3" exhaust from turbo to magnaflow exhaust
Throttle knifed and polished
3 row FMIC (2.5" tubing)
Emissions removal (air pump, BAC, etc)
OMP delete, no p/s, no a/c
custom idle control valve system (generic GM model to work with EMS)
Sard FPR
stock oil cooler
5 speed TII trans and drivetrain (rear end, axles, etc)
1988 Black FC RX7
Thanks in advance to whomever and whatever is said in the benefit of having another rx7 alive.
I thank you all
Thread Starter
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 393
Likes: 0
From: Sioux Falls, SD
On another note:
I forgot to mention that my friend did all of the parameters in the MSII V3.0 and he said it should at least start and idle. But when I do turn it over it doesn't even pop.
AND...
3 out of my 4 spark plugs ignite...I checked the spark plugs and they were good, I checked the spark plug wires and they were all good too. I'm guessing that it is my coil, L1/L2/T1 work just fine but T2 doesn't.
Where and what is my problem here?
I forgot to mention that my friend did all of the parameters in the MSII V3.0 and he said it should at least start and idle. But when I do turn it over it doesn't even pop.
AND...
3 out of my 4 spark plugs ignite...I checked the spark plugs and they were good, I checked the spark plug wires and they were all good too. I'm guessing that it is my coil, L1/L2/T1 work just fine but T2 doesn't.
Where and what is my problem here?
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 29,798
Likes: 128
From: London, Ontario, Canada
The settings on my page for MSII are for a very old firmware version, 1.something I think. While most of them are the same, some are not and you should use the settings as per the sticky link to my website at the top of the page. For modern MSII firmwares, use the DIY AutoTune settings as found in that sticky. I've been meaning to update my site, but I don't have an MSII so....
But there could be MANY causes as to why there is no RPM signal. Can you run a continuity test on the CAS connector back to the Megasquirt board to make sure those connections are correct?
But there could be MANY causes as to why there is no RPM signal. Can you run a continuity test on the CAS connector back to the Megasquirt board to make sure those connections are correct?
Thread Starter
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 393
Likes: 0
From: Sioux Falls, SD
For those using ms2/extra, the latest stable firmware (2.1.0d) is here:
http://www.msextra.com/forums/viewto...?f=101&t=34755
the actual folder/zip file link:
http://www.msextra.com/doc/ms2extra/...e_20100123.zip
In order for me to pull up the msq files I would need my friends laptop since his laptop was the one to setup my EMS. If I have the right software on my laptop, I could pull the msq and save it on my laptop. I tried this before but I used a usb connection that didn't quite work. My friend has a different connector that would work since he has used it before for the same application
The settings on my page for MSII are for a very old firmware version, 1.something I think. While most of them are the same, some are not and you should use the settings as per the sticky link to my website at the top of the page. For modern MSII firmwares, use the DIY AutoTune settings as found in that sticky. I've been meaning to update my site, but I don't have an MSII so....
But there could be MANY causes as to why there is no RPM signal. Can you run a continuity test on the CAS connector back to the Megasquirt board to make sure those connections are correct?
But there could be MANY causes as to why there is no RPM signal. Can you run a continuity test on the CAS connector back to the Megasquirt board to make sure those connections are correct?
I don't know how new the MS2-Extra instructions are, but if there is a better way please point me in the right direction.
as for the continuity test...my friend used a multimeter and checked all connections in the engine bay. He also checked the harness on the EMS to see if it was receiving adequate electric power and current. As for the boards solder-points and wiring, my friend put this EMS together at his work where they have specific tools to test and debug (multipurpose current surge tester, etc).
I could ask my friend again to take in the Megasquirt and check it, but he has done this many times before (multiple times after finish putting the EMS together and another time when we were working on the Megasquirt when we found out it sending a tach signal).
After the first time finding out that the EMS didn't detect a tach signal, my friend took the EMS with him and worked on it at his place. He then found out by chance through trial and error what seemed to be the problem and then the Megasquirt could detect a tach signal. But as soon as he brought it to my house and plugged in the EMS, it still didn't detect a signal. He then thought it was a loose wire and checked all the wires and found no problems, after that he checks the current again with a multimeter.
What are my other possible problems?
On a side note:
How many volts are necessary for the EMS to function properly?
Cause when I start the car the volts drop from 12.1 to 11.1-10.6
MegaSquirt Mod
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 4,721
Likes: 1
From: Maryland
The voltage drop when cranking should not be an issue.
The number 1 causes of no tach signal are:
- Bad wiring (not just no continuity, but wires going to the wrong places)
- Bad/dirty grounds, or grounding the MS using too few wires or grounding to the chassis instead of the engine.
- Not having the .01 uF cap across g+ and g- where they go into the lm1815 circuit
- Not having pin 14 of the lm1815 grounded
- Incorrect settings (we need to see an msq)
Ken
The number 1 causes of no tach signal are:
- Bad wiring (not just no continuity, but wires going to the wrong places)
- Bad/dirty grounds, or grounding the MS using too few wires or grounding to the chassis instead of the engine.
- Not having the .01 uF cap across g+ and g- where they go into the lm1815 circuit
- Not having pin 14 of the lm1815 grounded
- Incorrect settings (we need to see an msq)
Ken
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Thread Starter
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 393
Likes: 0
From: Sioux Falls, SD
I finally found a few bugs to work out. my msq was uploaded through symtechlabs. Page #4 at the very bottom of the list with the 1988 Mazda Rx7
http://www.symtechlabs.com/support/m...pmode=0&page=4
my msq should be under this help page as a downloadable file.
Any help will be very much so appreciated.
thanks
http://www.symtechlabs.com/support/m...pmode=0&page=4
my msq should be under this help page as a downloadable file.
Any help will be very much so appreciated.
thanks
Senior Member
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 286
Likes: 0
From: Wandering the USA in my Winnebago
A couple things jump out at me:
1) Your Ignition Input Capture may be the wrong edge. MS2 instructions suggest Rising Edge, but it depends on how its wired and which jumper(s) you used inside the MS. This is probably not keeping it from starting.
2) More importantly, you're configured for both missing teeth and a second trigger. That's probably wrong. I don't know if it can work with that arrangement or not.
If that doesn't solve it, post a log of a start attempt.
1) Your Ignition Input Capture may be the wrong edge. MS2 instructions suggest Rising Edge, but it depends on how its wired and which jumper(s) you used inside the MS. This is probably not keeping it from starting.
2) More importantly, you're configured for both missing teeth and a second trigger. That's probably wrong. I don't know if it can work with that arrangement or not.
If that doesn't solve it, post a log of a start attempt.
Thread Starter
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 393
Likes: 0
From: Sioux Falls, SD
A couple things jump out at me:
1) Your Ignition Input Capture may be the wrong edge. MS2 instructions suggest Rising Edge, but it depends on how its wired and which jumper(s) you used inside the MS. This is probably not keeping it from starting.
2) More importantly, you're configured for both missing teeth and a second trigger. That's probably wrong. I don't know if it can work with that arrangement or not.
If that doesn't solve it, post a log of a start attempt.
1) Your Ignition Input Capture may be the wrong edge. MS2 instructions suggest Rising Edge, but it depends on how its wired and which jumper(s) you used inside the MS. This is probably not keeping it from starting.
2) More importantly, you're configured for both missing teeth and a second trigger. That's probably wrong. I don't know if it can work with that arrangement or not.
If that doesn't solve it, post a log of a start attempt.
http://www.youtube.com/user/snaple07
Senior Member
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 286
Likes: 0
From: Wandering the USA in my Winnebago
I watched your video. You are almost certainly getting sync loss due to your incorrect wheel configuration. You do NOT want dual wheel. Configure it for single wheel with missing tooth - 12 teeth at crank speed.
Next, you've GOT to take advantage of the info that MS provides. Log a start attempt. Study the log looking for things that don't seem right. A log with your current msq should show lots of sync loss events. RPM probably spikes down to zero with the sync loss.
Fix the msq, log a start attempt, and if you need more help, post them both here.
Once you get it running, check to see if your timing drifts with RPM change, because your edge configuration might be backwards.
Next, you've GOT to take advantage of the info that MS provides. Log a start attempt. Study the log looking for things that don't seem right. A log with your current msq should show lots of sync loss events. RPM probably spikes down to zero with the sync loss.
Fix the msq, log a start attempt, and if you need more help, post them both here.
Once you get it running, check to see if your timing drifts with RPM change, because your edge configuration might be backwards.
MegaSquirt Mod
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 4,721
Likes: 1
From: Maryland
If he has cut 2 teeth out of the CAS and is set up for 12-1, having the polarity backwards will also cause trouble getting sync. My recommendation is to take a composite log while cranking that we can look at. That'll help us determine if the polarity is correct.
Ken
Ken
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