RX7Club.com


Go Back   RX7Club.com > Tech and Performance > Engine Management Forum > Megasquirt Forum
Sign in using an external account
Register Forgot Password?
Register Photos FAQ Members Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read VendorsUsed Cars TSB & Recalls Garage
Welcome to RX7Club.com

Reply
 
 
 
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 09-15-12, 06:33 PM   #1
Rotisserie Engine
5 Year Member
 
driftxsequence's Avatar
 
Trader Score: (6)

Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Wilmington, DE
Posts: 1,219
cranking, no RPM signal?

Hoping someone could give me a hand...Finally buttoned up my 6 port turbo build. Megasquirt built and wired per Aaron cake guild. Cranked, and got nothing. I am not sure if I should have an RPM signal while cranking or if it only picks it up once it starts to start. I had no movement of the RPMs and "fuel load" was at 100%. I am not sure if that is normal or not. I've attached a video clip in hopes it will help.

GOPR0387.mp4 video by xninjararacerx - Photobucket

Where do I start?
driftxsequence is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-12, 07:22 PM   #2
Warheads on foreheads!
10 Year Member
 
MIDNFauciUSN's Avatar
 
Trader Score: (8)

Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Salinas, CA
Posts: 1,691
Send a message via AIM to MIDNFauciUSN
Quote:
Originally Posted by driftxsequence View Post
Hoping someone could give me a hand...Finally buttoned up my 6 port turbo build. Megasquirt built and wired per Aaron cake guild. Cranked, and got nothing. I am not sure if I should have an RPM signal while cranking or if it only picks it up once it starts to start. I had no movement of the RPMs and "fuel load" was at 100%. I am not sure if that is normal or not. I've attached a video clip in hopes it will help.

GOPR0387.mp4 video by xninjararacerx - Photobucket

Where do I start?
Start where I did... check for continuity between the db37 pins and the harness at the CAS.

After that, check the VR circuitry.

You should see an RPM signal while cranking.
__________________
"aerodynamics are for people that can't build engines..."
MIDNFauciUSN is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-16-12, 10:25 AM   #3
Engine, Not Motor
10 Year Member
5 Year Member
 
Aaron Cake's Avatar
 
Trader Score: (1)

Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: London, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 27,952
Send a message via ICQ to Aaron Cake Send a message via Yahoo to Aaron Cake
What version of the Megasquirt?

First check software settings. If they are alright, then you'll need to do some electrical troubleshooting on the VR circuit. At this point, it really helps to have a scope so you can follow the CAS signals through the circuit.
Aaron Cake is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-16-12, 01:49 PM   #4
Rotisserie Engine
5 Year Member
 
driftxsequence's Avatar
 
Trader Score: (6)

Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Wilmington, DE
Posts: 1,219
It is an MS2 with the zeal daughterboard.

When I plug it into the stim, is that supposed to start up? like if i adjust the RPMs that changes and stuff.

I might be able to get a spare CAS from a friend to test with instead of pulling mine out. good idea?
driftxsequence is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-16-12, 03:25 PM   #5
Warheads on foreheads!
10 Year Member
 
MIDNFauciUSN's Avatar
 
Trader Score: (8)

Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Salinas, CA
Posts: 1,691
Send a message via AIM to MIDNFauciUSN
I'm only saying to check the continuity of the wires because of my personal experience... that and its free, and only takes a few minutes... and because thats what my issue was :/
__________________
"aerodynamics are for people that can't build engines..."
MIDNFauciUSN is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-17-12, 12:59 PM   #6
Rotisserie Engine
5 Year Member
 
driftxsequence's Avatar
 
Trader Score: (6)

Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Wilmington, DE
Posts: 1,219
Now that I think about it, When I wired up my CAS wire, I soldered that bare silver wire which I assume is the ground to one of the other black wires. Was I supposed to attach the other end of the silver wire somewhere?

Also, now that I think about it I do have 1 or 2 spare black leads in the engine bay that are not attached....I highly doubt that is the problem but I will ground them at the battery temporarily to see if that is the problem.
driftxsequence is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-17-12, 01:31 PM   #7
Warheads on foreheads!
10 Year Member
 
MIDNFauciUSN's Avatar
 
Trader Score: (8)

Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Salinas, CA
Posts: 1,691
Send a message via AIM to MIDNFauciUSN
When I wired my CAS, I did a few things...

1) Removed the insulated wire that came on the DIY harness, and de-pinned the connector.
2) Purchased a roll of 2 wire RF insulated cable from radio shack and ran 2 cables to the CAS.
3) Properly crimped 5 female connectors onto those wires at the DB37 end, and inserted them into the connector. The 5 wires are the 4 for the CAS signals, plus the insulator one - this goes to one of the ground pins - I think I used pin 1 or 2 or something that didnt have a wire in it already.
4) Wired up the CAS/rest of the car.
5) Attempted to start... No rpm signal, no start. Just cranking.
6) Checked continuity through the holes on the DB37... missing on two wires.
7) De-pinned all 5, clamped down on the "vagina" of the pin, and soldered the already crimped wires.
8) reassembled, and cranked. Poof! I have a RPM signal, and a starting vehicle!

Dont connect the insulation to anything at the CAS end.
__________________
"aerodynamics are for people that can't build engines..."
MIDNFauciUSN is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-21-12, 04:49 PM   #8
Rotisserie Engine
5 Year Member
 
driftxsequence's Avatar
 
Trader Score: (6)

Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Wilmington, DE
Posts: 1,219
Okay so I finally have some time to sit down and write up the current situation.

First off, I screwed up by following part of the DIYAutoTune guide, and part of Aarons. I wired up the ECU per DIY, and the harness per Aaron. SO since the harness has already been cut ETC I'd prefer to modify the ECU to get everything running.

As of now, I am using the zeal board, and I think it is wired up properly.
I am getting power to the board per DIY instructions - S2, SG, proto ground.
idle in goes to the left side of r19 if you are reading its text, since it is sideways.
idleout goes to banded end of d8.
i cant tell which one is vr2 + and - because they arent labeled. the pin closest to VR2 is going to SPR1
the pin above that goes to SPR2
VR2 out goes to js10
I have not jumpered the ground thing next to the lm1815 chip.

luckily the shielded CAS wire I picked up had the same 4 colors that aaron used, making wiring that up easy. so white is pin 2, green is pin 3, black is pin 4, red pin 24.

My pots are spun all the way CCW, they never clicked for me.. I am tempted to replace them to see if I can find ones that do.

I am going to replace the pins on the db37 connector since the solder job was pretty shitty for pins 2,3,4,24.

I have not found anyone with an oscilloscope, but will continue to keep trying to find one.

ALSO! just tried cranking while watching the ECU LEDs. all 3 light up when turning the car power on. when I start cranking, the d14 blinks once, then d15 blinks as it cranks. almost 1 blink per second.
driftxsequence is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-21-12, 05:24 PM   #9
Spankin' the Wank
5 Year Member
 
highnitro12187's Avatar
 
Trader Score: (18)

Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Vancouver, WA
Posts: 468
i had this same problem and just had to adjust my voltage cutoff on the 2nd vr and it sync'd up just fine.
__________________
My New 85 re-do Here

My Old FB T2 Rebuild/swap thead Here

Keep on Rotating
highnitro12187 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-21-12, 05:44 PM   #10
Rotisserie Engine
5 Year Member
 
driftxsequence's Avatar
 
Trader Score: (6)

Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Wilmington, DE
Posts: 1,219
It turns out I must have a loose wire somewhere. The ECU is out of its box, I plugged it in after jotting down whats going where - plugged it in and now it is cranking. It is seeing 230-235 RPM when cranking. it says synced up in the bottom corner of TS. Now I assume its just the tune is off...I have 1000CC ID injectors. where should my VE table and spark table be set to? I grabbed the stuff from aaron's page...do I half my VE table since stock injectors are 550cc?
driftxsequence is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-22-12, 11:14 AM   #11
Rotisserie Engine
5 Year Member
 
driftxsequence's Avatar
 
Trader Score: (6)

Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Wilmington, DE
Posts: 1,219
Attached is a log file...maybe someone can decipher whats going on now that it has a cas signal.
Engine is:

rebuilt NA 6 port
hybrid turbo
4 1000cc ID injectors
modified top mount for 2.5in piping
synapse BOV

I dont think my cas is at a factory setting...i'm going to look up how to set timing back to stock, that may help.
Attached Files
File Type: zip 2012-09-22_12.01.08.zip (8.9 KB, 21 views)
driftxsequence is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-22-12, 12:36 PM   #12
Rotisserie Engine
5 Year Member
 
driftxsequence's Avatar
 
Trader Score: (6)

Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Wilmington, DE
Posts: 1,219
More progress, I pulled off the spark plug wires and verified its sparking. Pulled off the UIM, plugged lower injector wires into upper injectors to verify it was fueling - negative. I pulled off the fuel rails and they are bone dry - however the fuel pump is priming and pushing fuel up the hose. I took the hose off the fuel rail and it came flying out. Why wouldnt it go through the fuel rail??
driftxsequence is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-22-12, 02:16 PM   #13
Warheads on foreheads!
10 Year Member
 
MIDNFauciUSN's Avatar
 
Trader Score: (8)

Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Salinas, CA
Posts: 1,691
Send a message via AIM to MIDNFauciUSN
hoses could be reversed, causing it to hit the back side of the fuel pressure regulator.
__________________
"aerodynamics are for people that can't build engines..."
MIDNFauciUSN is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-22-12, 07:50 PM   #14
Rotisserie Engine
5 Year Member
 
driftxsequence's Avatar
 
Trader Score: (6)

Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Wilmington, DE
Posts: 1,219
Yup thats exactly what it was. I did a little bit of reading after I posted my previous post and found that out. My one hose was too short so I had to buy a new one. I did a bit of cranking and it turned over! Figured I'd post a video. this is running an open downpipe, i'm waiting to get my presilencer fixed.

GOPR0388_zpsee0fc113.mp4 video by xninjararacerx - Photobucket
driftxsequence is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-23-12, 02:14 PM   #15
Rotisserie Engine
5 Year Member
 
driftxsequence's Avatar
 
Trader Score: (6)

Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Wilmington, DE
Posts: 1,219
So I'm afraid to keep trying to start it. It keeps backfiring really loud. I'm not sure if I wired my coils backwards or something. I assume they are fine if it is trying to start. Here is a video showing what its doing...it happens at 5 seconds. you can hear it echo.

GOPR0389_zps3c4b7795.mp4 video by xninjararacerx - Photobucket

any help would be great!
driftxsequence is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-24-12, 09:04 AM   #16
Rotisserie Engine
5 Year Member
 
driftxsequence's Avatar
 
Trader Score: (6)

Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Wilmington, DE
Posts: 1,219
Well, I got it to idle, I kept upping the REQ_FUEL because my wideband said I was idling at 18-19 AFR. I managed to get the AFR down to 13 by turning the REQ_FUEL up to 22.0. I'm thinking I may have mistaken these for high impedance injectors. I will get out my multimeter tonight and verify their resistance.

regardless, it feels good to have the engine idling, even if its at 2500 RPM...haha! now to figure out how to lower the idle!
driftxsequence is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-24-12, 10:05 AM   #17
Warheads on foreheads!
10 Year Member
 
MIDNFauciUSN's Avatar
 
Trader Score: (8)

Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Salinas, CA
Posts: 1,691
Send a message via AIM to MIDNFauciUSN
I cant figure out how to get my idle about 11... the fumes are killing me!
__________________
"aerodynamics are for people that can't build engines..."
MIDNFauciUSN is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-24-12, 12:15 PM   #18
MegaSquirt Mod
5 Year Member
 
muythaibxr's Avatar
 
Trader Score: (0)

Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Maryland
Posts: 4,590
If you have to be that rich to idle, double check your timing. You should be able to get it up to at least 13:1 with the timing at 5 ATDC (though it'll get slightly rougher the higher you get above 12:1).
muythaibxr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-24-12, 12:47 PM   #19
Warheads on foreheads!
10 Year Member
 
MIDNFauciUSN's Avatar
 
Trader Score: (8)

Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Salinas, CA
Posts: 1,691
Send a message via AIM to MIDNFauciUSN
i meant to say "above"
__________________
"aerodynamics are for people that can't build engines..."
MIDNFauciUSN is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-24-12, 07:09 PM   #20
Rotisserie Engine
5 Year Member
 
driftxsequence's Avatar
 
Trader Score: (6)

Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Wilmington, DE
Posts: 1,219
i'm a dumby. I had like 4 or 5 nipples on the intake manifold wide open...that would probably explain the excess amount of fuel and super high idle... it's too late now to start it up with a wide open exhaust. I hope I can try tomorrow to see what it does.
driftxsequence is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-28-12, 09:58 PM   #21
Rotisserie Engine
5 Year Member
 
driftxsequence's Avatar
 
Trader Score: (6)

Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Wilmington, DE
Posts: 1,219
Well, the idle is decent. Now my issue is basically low rpm driving. I literally have to floor it to have enough power to get going. to go with this, since I have it floored...it begins to build boost (literally around 2500 rpm). I have taken a timing light and set my timing to the mark on the pulley. I did not have a yellow line, I had two marks, and both were blue. I set it to the one more right. So when the timing light was in use, the second mark was to the LEFT of the mark on the engine.

Did I wire my coils backwards possibly? I literally have to floor it to get it to 3000RPM, and its a very slow climb to get to 4000.

I am using 1000cc primaries and secondaries. ID 1000s to be specific. I did not measure the resistance, but according to ID they are high impedance, so they are set to 25.4ms etc etc as opposed to 1.0ms.

P.S someone from the msextra forums mentioned my TPS looked very erratic. I currently have the throttle wire mounted to the chassis instead of the engine(S4 na, turbo swap) so I believe it is bouncing around so much from the engine rocking back and forth. I am working on fixing this.

Last edited by driftxsequence; 09-28-12 at 10:04 PM. Reason: attachment too large.
driftxsequence is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-29-12, 10:38 AM   #22
Engine, Not Motor
10 Year Member
5 Year Member
 
Aaron Cake's Avatar
 
Trader Score: (1)

Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: London, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 27,952
Send a message via ICQ to Aaron Cake Send a message via Yahoo to Aaron Cake
You could be triggering AE with that TPS.

What are your injector PWs while you are flooring it?

You'll need to confirm base timing before you go any further though, that's critical. Are they stock pulleys? If it is a stock pulley and matching hub (they must MATCH, different series used different bolt patterns) then the first mark on the right when looking at the front of the engine is leading. That should line up with the pointer when the timing is locked at -5. If you have to move the CAS extreme amounts, then something is wrong. If at about 4000 RPM the timing shifts wildly, then the G VR sensor is backwards.
Aaron Cake is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-29-12, 02:18 PM   #23
Rotisserie Engine
5 Year Member
 
driftxsequence's Avatar
 
Trader Score: (6)

Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Wilmington, DE
Posts: 1,219
I will look at AE once the car cools back down.. I believe i have a problematic throttle body. When cold its fine, but once it gets up to temp it wont drop back down to idle. if i manually move it, it drops back down though.

I believe my PW goes up to 100%. I will verify once i start it back up.

I am not sure if they are stock pulleys. The PO had the engine rebuilt by rotary resurrection.

I will take a video to show you the sound it makes. I am still learning this whole tuning aspect.
driftxsequence is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-29-12, 08:36 PM   #24
Rotisserie Engine
5 Year Member
 
driftxsequence's Avatar
 
Trader Score: (6)

Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Wilmington, DE
Posts: 1,219
Someone over at the msextra forums squared things away. It is running great now! I had my ignition set up wrong, as well as my req_fuel. The car sounds insane under slight boost. I cant wait to get this tuned properly!
driftxsequence is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-30-12, 10:15 AM   #25
Engine, Not Motor
10 Year Member
5 Year Member
 
Aaron Cake's Avatar
 
Trader Score: (1)

Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: London, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 27,952
Send a message via ICQ to Aaron Cake Send a message via Yahoo to Aaron Cake
Good to hear. Yep, an insanely high REQ_FUEL value will flood the engine under throttle.

Make sure to lubricate that throttle body though otherwise it will drive you crazy. Lube it, free it all up, then remove the lube with brake cleaner. They are designed to run dry and any oil will just draw in more gunk to clog it up. Seen a lot of sticking FC throttle bodies lately.
Aaron Cake is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-30-12, 10:15 AM
RX7Club
Mazda RX7




Paid Advertisement


 
 
 
Reply

Tags
car, cranking, ecu, engine, flooded, manual, megasquirt, microsquirt, norpm, reading, rpm, rpms, rx7club, shows, signal

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 11:56 PM.
All content Copyright 2007 by Internet Brands, Inc.

Contacts

SEO by vBSEO ©2010, Crawlability, Inc.