E85 Pre-Mix Test
05-19-11, 07:47 PM
#1
E85 Pre-Mix Test
I decided to test out how well a few of the premix's I have used stayed in suspension with E85. A total of 4 2 cycle mixes were tested Generic TCW-3 mix, Klotz Techniplate, Klotz Super Techniplate, and Klotz Benol. All were mixed in quart jars at 1/100 ratio. After sealing the lid to the jar shook the solution twice. E85 used was a newly mixed blend of E85 and not E70 at the pumping station.
I allowed the solutions to sit for 2 weeks now to determine if any separation would occur. Only the Super Techniplate and Benol were compatible with alcohol/ethanol.
Left to right in the pictures you have the Techniplate, generic TCW-3, Super Techniplate, and Benol.
Results were that the Generic TCW-3 and Techniplate almost immediately separated out at the bottom of the jars. Color of separated fluid also yellowed over time. Another note the TCW-3 also turned the Ethanol that did not separate slightly cloudy.
Where as the Super Techniplate and Benol stayed in solution for the entire 2 weeks.
Conclusion in my mind if you are thinking of using a non alcohol/ethanol compatible premix, DON'T. I know not all lubes are the same but based on seeing the instant separation I doubt any non alcohol/ethanol compatible lube is providing any lubrication to your engine.
I allowed the solutions to sit for 2 weeks now to determine if any separation would occur. Only the Super Techniplate and Benol were compatible with alcohol/ethanol.
Left to right in the pictures you have the Techniplate, generic TCW-3, Super Techniplate, and Benol.
Results were that the Generic TCW-3 and Techniplate almost immediately separated out at the bottom of the jars. Color of separated fluid also yellowed over time. Another note the TCW-3 also turned the Ethanol that did not separate slightly cloudy.
Where as the Super Techniplate and Benol stayed in solution for the entire 2 weeks.
Conclusion in my mind if you are thinking of using a non alcohol/ethanol compatible premix, DON'T. I know not all lubes are the same but based on seeing the instant separation I doubt any non alcohol/ethanol compatible lube is providing any lubrication to your engine.
Last edited by fritts; 05-19-11 at 08:06 PM.
05-20-11, 05:36 AM
#3
Corn-to-Noise Converter
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Very cool and thanks. For what it's worth, I spoke to one of the Klotz spokesman at PRI last year and he mentioned that only the Benol was compatible with corn juice. Your test would seem to indicate that he was half right. ;-)
05-20-11, 06:09 AM
#5
Stay tuned...
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Anthony
05-20-11, 06:51 AM
#6
what do you guys think if tcw-3 is injected into the motor through a adapter?
I am about to go E85 and already have 3 gallons of Benol, but for the occasional cold weather driving I can also inject it into the motor, car has the ability to run on 2 maps very easily but it obviously sits over the winter in unheated storage.
I am about to go E85 and already have 3 gallons of Benol, but for the occasional cold weather driving I can also inject it into the motor, car has the ability to run on 2 maps very easily but it obviously sits over the winter in unheated storage.
05-20-11, 07:24 AM
#7
That is excellent fritts!
Now all we need to figure out is how much to mix.
I usually go pretty liberal on the Benol. Around 1.5 Oz. to 1 Gal.
BTW.... I accidently went lean last night (13.5:1 gas AFR) at 23 PSI and it didn't even hiccup! Amazing stuff!
Now all we need to figure out is how much to mix.
I usually go pretty liberal on the Benol. Around 1.5 Oz. to 1 Gal.
BTW.... I accidently went lean last night (13.5:1 gas AFR) at 23 PSI and it didn't even hiccup! Amazing stuff!
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05-20-11, 08:08 AM
#8
Racing Rotary Since 1983
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thanks for sharing the info.
"went lean last night (13.5:1 gas AFR) at 23 PSI and it didn't even hiccup!"
i had a similar experience while on the dyno a couple of years ago. i was running 93 pump and 1400 CC/Min of pure methanol. the MAP hose blew off during a 4th gear pull and the motor as evidenced by the logs went to 12.8 AFR at around 7000+ (around the 500 hp range). by the time Luke got out of it (almost instantaneously, thanks Luke) we were at just about 13 AFR and lots of timing.
interesting the logs showed NO knock.
it was all because of the alcohol. magic stuff.
howard
"went lean last night (13.5:1 gas AFR) at 23 PSI and it didn't even hiccup!"
i had a similar experience while on the dyno a couple of years ago. i was running 93 pump and 1400 CC/Min of pure methanol. the MAP hose blew off during a 4th gear pull and the motor as evidenced by the logs went to 12.8 AFR at around 7000+ (around the 500 hp range). by the time Luke got out of it (almost instantaneously, thanks Luke) we were at just about 13 AFR and lots of timing.
interesting the logs showed NO knock.
it was all because of the alcohol. magic stuff.
howard
05-20-11, 08:03 PM
#11
I was trying to find something other than Benol initially. The Benol has a fairly powerful scent with it being mainly castor oil. The Super Techniplate is much less smelly if you are someone not wanting to smell like an RC car before going into work, but still want an ethanol compatible mix. 
08-10-11, 12:51 PM
#12
Never Enough Turns
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I have been using Evinrude / Johnson outboard oil with e-85 for appx a year now. I also performed the same type of test and found that the XD-50 oil mixed and stays mixed the best. XD-30 and XD-100 mixed, but did not remain entirely mixed after 3 days of sitting. I have had no issues thus far. Also, the XD-50 has an additive called carbon guard :-) I will never run another premix oil / fuel type after seeing how clean my rotors and internal engine components were. Just my 2 cents
08-11-11, 07:33 AM
#13
everything will be okay
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i also tested this with idimitsu, and supertech/walmart stuff.
for a control, i used regular 93.
so, 4 jars in total.
both oils were fine in the 93,
unfortunately, both also separated in the e85. i was a bit disappointed that idimitsu isnt compatible with e85. but at least i learned something.
for a control, i used regular 93.
so, 4 jars in total.
both oils were fine in the 93,
unfortunately, both also separated in the e85. i was a bit disappointed that idimitsu isnt compatible with e85. but at least i learned something.
02-21-12, 10:38 AM
#21
Doing the Ricky Bobby
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Ah, I've heard both ways on it and have seen test that show both. I had the oil metering pump taken out during my current build and am right at fist start-up this weekend and am looking for the best premix to keep the new engine in good shape.
