13b into a B2600i
 

I really dont know where to post on this and if u guys would even want to help me, but i really want to put a 13b or some rotary into my mazda b2600i 2wd pickup.

if anyone has any ideas of what exactly i would need to make it work in my bay it would be greatly appreciated.

customization is not a problem for this truck has already been chopped and airbagged and i wanted a TT powerplant under the hood so i can run a stock hood without running itb's on the stock engine.

i am just throing the idea around right now since i am redoing my firewall and figured if im going to do the swap right now would be the best time if it is doable(which im sure it is somehow).

any input is greatly appreciated! and please no negative comments or saying its dumb to do. if u dont agree or have input to help, please dont post.

thank you!

The B2600i uses a Mazda Model "R" or Type 3 transmission dependent on whom you get your info from.

This is an easy swap, as it's VERY similar to the transmission found in Turbo RX-7s as well as V6 powered Mazdas such as the MPV minivan and the 929. (The B2600 counts for the beefier transmission as the 2.6 has a very long stroke and generates more torque than the 2.2 and smaller 4 bangers...)

Simply get the bell housing from the donor vehicle... Or since yours is a 2wd, get the whole tranny from the RX-7.

Weld in the proper crossmember for the RX-7 engine. (I suggest converting to 1st gen or 2nd gen mounting... I'm not sure how FDs mount the engine.)

I had a B2600i 4x4... :p:

ok, i kinda figured i was gonna need the crossmember, all the wiring and a new tranny.
what are the chances of the shifter holes matching up and will my stock driveline need to be modified?

i guess im just looking for any suprises that i might be able to recognize ahead of time..

thank u for the info, it is greatly appreciated!

I'm saying you might not even need a new tranny. It might just need the bell housing.

People put rotaries in the B2000/2200s all the time. The B2600i shouldn't be that much different.

oh, ok, i see what u are saying now...
i was kinda interested in maybe doing the irs on my truck also, but if i can keep my transmission i wont even worry about it.

so if i get the crossmember with the engine and get all of the wiring thats all i should really have to do right?

what do i need to do to the engine before i install it?
i know that rotaries need lots of attention but have never owned one(you always hear horror stories).

do u have any write ups on people puttin the 13b into a b series truck by chance?

anyone else wanna throw some info my way?

so im getting mixed responses.

and what years bell housing do i need and i guess there is a couple different transmission options?

ttt

The bell housing comes from the RX-7. Any year's will do, just match the bell housing to the engine.

There shouldn't be any other options on the transmission. Where else are you getting information?

i have just been looking for answers and getting different opinions on select other forums.
like i said i just want to know exaclty what im getting myself into.

i have done several other swaps, but i am mainly a honda guy so this is stepping outside my safe zone quite a bit and i dont want to run into a whole lot of extra expense from the amount i alotted myslef for this swap..

ok, i got my engine out last night and am going to start putting in a new firewall or atleast fabbing one up.
im guessing i just need to put something in that is similar to stock because im a not seeing any problems with fitment there right?

Firewall shouldn't need much changing. The 2.6L 4Cyl is much larger than the Rotary.

ok.
well there is a guy who says he can fab up mounts for the 13b into a stock frame for my truck but i will have to get a different turbo mani.

would i be better of welding in the rx7 crossmember or will i have to move the trubo mani and the turbos for this also?

Make a new manifold. You can put in your own provisions for an aftermarket wastegate or move the turbo so that you don't get heat soak on the intake...

For me, I think the hardest part would be getting the engine (Just the bare keg) in the truck, then you route plumbing around it.

alright so u suggest just dropping in the block(dunno if that whats u call a rotary lol) in with no turbos or manifold or anything and ten figure out what else i need to do to make it fit?

this is y i wanted to kind of have an idea and to see if anyone else had personal experience or if there were any write ups because i want to get this truck back on the road as fast as possible once i get the engine in my possession plus i want to know which engine will be best to swap in with the least amount of headaches(i hear there can be a lot of vacuum issues).

with that said, any other info?

I'd suggest short block (Also called Keg in rotary circles) with no manifolds or plumbing... You can always engineer that kind of stuff later on.

If you want a fast swap, use a custom cross member.

I think the second gen mounting will provide the simplest and most balanced way to put the engine in since it mounts to the center housing and the stock 2nd gen mounts are simple doughnuts with one bolt through them.

ok, im not looking for a screamer. and i have a feeling that going the keg way it would end up costing me more piecing it together?
the 2nd gen that u r referring to is out of an fd or is that 3rd gen?

is the 2nd gen the turbo II?
i was really hoping on going for the 3 rotor fd engine if at all possible..

FB = 1st Gen (Also SA22C)
FC = 2nd Gen
FD = 3rd Gen

Basic premise is that first, second, and third gens mount to the Front, Middle, and Rear iron plates of the engine respectively.

1st gen will require a special bracket for that engine. 3rd, I'm not sure how it mounts...

But the second fits right into a cradle with two bolts and looks to be a very simple mounting structure.

alright, so now i have to decide which engine i want...
great lol

Go with what's available... Another reason I suggested to bolt just the keg in.

FC engine is pretty common in the scrapyards. You can adapt the FD turbo setup on it if you want to later on...

Just get the engine in is the main part.

ya. i see where ur going with that whole "keg" thing.

i have an opportunity to pick up a couple b2200's for very cheap and one has a rotary swap in it, but i am not sure if i want to pick up someone elses headache since the engine is not running yet.

i am pretty deadset on the fd engine and im pretty sure this other truck has a 12b in it? (atleast thats what the guy said) i havent heard of a 12b and havent researched it yet. I do think if im going to do it, i want to do it right and just go with the 13bTT right off the bat but figured i could atleast maybe use the crossmember or whatever.

would i be better off going with just getting the tranny and everything?
i was just kinda trying to think about measurements and what i would have to do to my driveline and such to make it fit.

does anyone have measurements of the engine and tranny from the front of the block to the end of the tranny for comparison.

im just trying to think if i would be better off just doing the rx7 tranny also as a package deal or trying to mate the rotary to my stock tranny with the bell housing from the rx7?

i"m going to look at the trucks for sale this weekend and i guess will weigh the pros and cons based on the quality of the swap and things like that.

i really appreciate all of your help Pele and im sorry if im driving u nuts with my redundant questions, but i want to make sure i have a pretty good idea of what is going on before i make a purchase. i hope u understand.

thanks again for the great advice...

Thing is the B2000/2200 have small 2.0 or 2.2 Liter 4 cylinders in it. It's got the Model "M" or Type 2 Transmission... It will not hold up to high power. It's similar to all the other small 4cyl or NA rotary transmissions.

The B2600 has the 2.6L 4 cylinder which was coupled to the Model "R" or Type 3 transmission. It's the same one they use in the MPV minivan (Has the same 2.6L I4 or a 3.0L V6, the 929 (Has 3.0 V6), and all Turbo rotaries. It will hold up to higher power.

Additionally, the rear end of the B2600 will hold up to higher power.

I would build with the B2600 if you want to go forced induction, otherwise, I suggest investing in lots of spare transmissions... If you're 2WD, you're probably into the Mini Truck scene and probably want wide low profile tires. One good hard launch will trash drivetrain components.


I'm betting those trucks have the 12A. (Not 12B.) The 12A came with a carburetor, so the fuel pump in that truck will not support a Fuel Injected setup.


My suggested setup would be a fuel tank and fuel pump assembly out of a B2600i. (Fuel injected.) The pump assembly is IDENTICAL to the RX-7's so you can put a Walbro or other performance pump on there.

If you want the FD engine, I think you can use the FC oil pan... Not sure though.

I'd use the FC keg with the FD externals. There's LOTS of people who ditch their stock twins on here when they upgrade to a HUGE single.

FC keg is easy to find at the scrap yard. Used twins... This keeps the cost down.

You do not want the headache of running twin turbos on your rotary swap. I would honestly just pick the FC(2nd gen) turbo engine which runs a single turbo and save yourself a lot of extra complications down the road.

ok, well im glad u got the minitruck persona from me lol.

i have heard the single turbo upgrade is best, but like i was saying im not really doing it for raw speed.

this truck is merely show and the awe factor of having the rotary in the bay is good enough for me, but also making it fit and cleanliness of swap+wiretuck/shaved firewall is key.

i really appreciate ur last post pele, for that seems to be the most honest response ive gotten anywhere and that helps a lot!

im not looking into doing anything with these two donor truck minus looking at them and maybe just a purchase to put the old b2600 engine into for a quick sale to afford this build a bit quicker.

the truck that the rotary is going into is and will be the truck to add onto and keep.

if there are more suggestions, i appreciate feedback and im finally starting to really feel confident on this..

I can appreciate the fabrication and work that goes into building a mini truck...

Bagging, modifying suspension, etc... And you're right, they're all about being clean. Good smooth welds, chrome in the engine bay... I do like the looks of them...


Personally, not my thing, as I like to raise my trucks up and get them more dirty. ;) But when a truck is done up right and looks good, I can give credit where it's due.

ok, so im pretty sure there is going to be cooling issues?

am i going to need to upgrade my fan and radiator?

also i have heard oil cooling issues? any truth to that?

picture for reference of what we"re dealing with here =)
http://img245.imageshack.us/i/sparks.jpg/

well, guess i cant post pics on here...
is there a certain post count to post pics?

I don't know about post count. Resize the pics to less than 256k and upload them using the "manage attachments" and then copy the link and paste between[img] and[/img]

You WILL need to figure out how to mount an oil cooler, regardless of engine... Even the NA engines have huge oil coolers.

I suggest in front of the radiator or under it.

Use the stock truck radiator for the time being and monitor coolant temps. You can upgrade later, as there will be a LOT of room under the hood when you swap engines.

im completely gaugeless right now, so i will definately look into a temp gauge.

heres a link since they wont post, if anyone is interested in seeing what we are working with here..
http://www.okshowpics.com/displayima...bum=130&pos=52

^

Yeah, you're gonna need to run a custom manifold anyhow. Factory location of both FC and FD turbos will probably melt that passenger's side tire.

ok.
well hell lol.
are u talking custom as in home built or something aftermarket?

^ Custom is always home built. ;)

I'd find something that puts the turbo up high and either forward or aft of the engine. That should get it away from that tire.

Like I said, get the engine in there first, run it NA if you have to. Just see what you're working with.

My truck was a 4x4, so I still had the inner fender and the tire was a foot away from the engine. I probably could have used the stock turbo setup...

Custom truck calls for custom parts.

The guy I bought my turbo engine and everything from was doing a swap into a B2200 with a 12A. There was ample room for everything, but since he's dropping it, I'd say go NA, because any decent turbo setup would fail with relocation. Or he could sacrifice dropping it a bit in lieu of making more reliable power, having a cooler engine bay, and he could do something not many mini truck drivers can - drift. I know OP wants an FD motor, but not why... seems like a wasteful expense, when similar gains can be had for far less. And these are mini truckers, they don't know a whole lot about rotaries.

To OP, get the truck with the 12A in it, the engien should be mounted to the front subframe, with the engine's front cover doing all of the mounting, supported by the trans.

You'll take that 12A front cover and bolt it onto your 13B, the 13B will then shoehorn in - happily. Then you have to figure out transmission mounting, which shouldn't be difficult, since it may be use stock supports.

i just want the awe factor from the swap when im at a show and people are like are u f'ing kidding me when they see it and then to be able to drive it away with the blowoff valve going off of the 13b would be totally worth it to me, so i would like to do the fd or turbo II swap.

i have no idea how or where to start with a custom turbo mani. that is one thing that i know needs a lot of thought put into it for air flow and such. is this something a muffler shop could fab up? im sure it wouldnt be cheap, but like u said i could source a keg and go n/a until i get everything figured out.

so oil cooler and fabbing up a turbo mani. alright, now we are getting somewhere.

i really do appreciate all the advice, but stop trying to turn me off from the turbo swaps lol
=)

You're starting from the wrong end.

Get it together and running, first.

i guess i dont fully understand what u mean by that statement..

im starting from the wrong end?

wanna explain?

You need to make a running, functional vehicle before you can do anything else.

You have done other custom trucks, right?

+1.. Get it running and moving on the rotary FIRST... Then add the turbo.

yes i have built other trucks..
ok, i see what ur saying now...

im trying to get more familiar with the rotary, but im more hands on than anything, and there are no rx7s here so its tough...

oh, btw, im putting inner fenders in when i redo the firewall(trailer fenders molded in) so do u think that will help with the turbo problem on my tires?

ok, my firewall is cut out and i am ready to weld in the sheetmetal and was just making sure im not going to need to do anything to the tranny tunnel or anything to make room for any of the parts? i know the rotary is smaller and should have no issues, but i just wanted to check..

You shouldn't. But it all depends on your setup.

k thank u..
working on getting some rims sold so i can start buying some parts.. yay

ok, well all i have found is complete engines.
im sure i am just going to buy the complete swap and see what i have to do from there.
i figure i should have no problem selling whatever i dont need?
well atleast i hope...
once again, i appreciate the help

ok, bringing back the dead thread.

so i am finally at a point where i am ready to buy an engine, and i am pretty sure i am going with either an s4 or s5 longblock with tranny and ecu and all the wiring.

i sold my engine and tranny and exhaust so i am going to mate the whole setup up and then have a driveline fabbed up for me.

any thoughts?

will this be my best bet?

the truck is now rhd also, so hopefully i wont have to move the turbo too far.

aslo will i have any problems with lag if i relocate the turbo?

this is also another reason i want to go single turbo. i realize mazda put a lot of work into making the sequentials work in sucession and i dont wanna mess that up.

i can get the fd engine for a few hundred more and if i dont have a problem relocating the turbos then i may still go with the 3 rotor, but as of now i am satisfied with going with the 2 rotor single turbo.

comments please. this swap will be bought with tax money.

thanks