Microtech for fd street/track days
 

I have a 93rx7 that I am putting back together after 7yrs of sitting in my garage without a motor. I ordered a v-mount intercooler from rotary extreme and will be going with a single turbo set up. I currently have two ecu. One is a power fc and the other is a microtech. My car will be driven on my days off mostly and it will see some track days. Kilo Racing is currently my mechanic. He is a good mechanic but most of his experience is in drag racing. My question is has anyone used a microtech lt10 on a fd on a roadcourse and what has been the experience good or bad?

Any help please this car is going to be put back together in a few short months and I need help trying to decide if the ecu will be a power fc or a microtech.

You could always try the Microtech sub-forum section.
You should have sufficient posts for that section now.
Oh,there is also a Power Fc sub-forum too.

Sell them both and buy a decent ecu. Adaptronic would have to be best bang for buck.

Generally speaking I think if you're going to tune it yourself, go with whatever one YOU feel comfortable with. If you're going to have someone tune it, use the one THEY are most familiar/comfortable with.
I'm not a tuner and can't comment about the Microtech. But the largest FD user knowledge-base, especially here on the forum, will likely be the PFC.

I will not be tunning because that would be a crazy I just dont have the knowledge nor the experience to tune it. Kilo works with Microtech and that is why I bought it. I have just heard some rumors that microtech is only good for drag racig due to the fact it works great at high rpms but does not work good at low rpms. At a road course you will sometimes find yourself in the lower rpms comming out of some corners. I just want to know if the person who told me this is just talking things he knows nothing about or if there is any truth to what he says. My motor went when I had my power fc and since Kilo stands by Microtech I just wanted to get more info before wires get cut on my fd. I am in no way questioning Kilos tunning but the microtech as far as what it can do for my driving needs.

I have seen some 20b microtech circuit track cars but have not seen 13b on microtech at the track.

Stock twins I would recommend using power fc the plug and play is just so much more simpler. If your going single turbo and want to make more then 450 hp then ditch the power fc and use a microtech. kilo is one of the best tuners in florida and has lots of respectable cars that been tuned for street applications. Microtech is as good as the tuner and kilo is one of the best. Ive bought ecu's from him and did my own installations. Hope this helps...

I will not have twin turbos it I think I am going to the rx7 store 35r turbo kit. I like I said before I trust Kilo I know him for over 14 years when in 1999 he fixed my FD when it caught an engine fire and toasted my injectors, rats nest and my computer harness. He is a great engine builder and tuner. I also know that he usaully tunes for street application and is genius when it comes to drag racing. I was just trying to see if anyone was using microtech for roadracing or track days with no issues. Drag racing you or on the throttle from the start and only get off the accelerator at the end of the run. On a road course you are on and off the throttle a lot. This is where I dont know if the microtech is designed for this without issues.

Road course is a little like daily driving a rx-7 in some aspects. When you daily drive a rx7 your constantly driving in demand traffic, stop, and go. At times we all step on it to feel the power of the rotary. Now I dont know anything about road racing just drag and street. But when you compare street with road racing with using a microtech. Its very similar and microtech has enough features to tune it accordingly. Now real world opinion microtech is a little finicky with low/ intermediate speeds sometimes needs tweek or two. Thats probably why you hear people say oh microtech is better for drag racing racing instead of anything else. I think if you had the knowledge to tune in matrix mode and use everything microtech has to offer for perfection. That would give microtech a better reputation. Last time I spoke with kilo I believe he doesnt use the matrix funtion. The ecu works good but there are better ecus with better resolution out their but they do cost more.

Samito thank you for your input. I will ask kilo if he uses the matrix function. The only reason I went with microtech is because Kilo uses it and tunes it. I have a power fc but once again Kilo will be doing the work. I hope it works well for my application. If it does not I will return to the power fc that I still own or look for another tuner and ecu. Hopefully I will get some positive info from some of the other forum members with experience with the microtech on the roadcourse. I will love to be able to keep the microtech since that is what my mechanic uses. Someone out there has to be as crazy as I am.LOL

Lol, I have a bone stock FD and im going to use power fc for learning purposes but im a microtech guy. Just want to learn something new though so will see how it goes. The simplicity of power fc plug and play is my favorite part.

Samito did you have to rewire your car to put in the microtech and if so I am imaging that you will rewire to put the fc. The fc seems to work well I have no complaints but my tuner tunes microtech so this is why I bought another ecu. I thought of selling the power fc with the commander but when it comes to the rotary world you I tend to never sell anything because things are for ever changing. Things have changed a lot from when my car went into storage in 2005. It was beating up my wallet and it wasnt some much the car fault it was a crapy mechanic who did the engine rebuild. Well it was not Kilo. I should have taken it too him but my mechanic at the time was doing well with the tunning and running of my car until a joy ride from an auto body shop killed my motor. Found out two lessons never leave the keys of an fd at any shop and listen to people when they say that a certain individual is a good with fd but does not know how to rebuild engines. Everyone said bring it to Kilo. I was just trying to stay loyal. Lesson learned.

IF this car is a street driven car, and not a dedicated track car, then the Microtech isn't an ideal ECU choice. It's an antiquated POS at this point that is only suitable for a track car.

Back in the day, the Microtech LT(s) series was delivered full of promises. Fast CPU, continuous software updates from Microtech, and additional features continually being developed. How many updates have we received since the thing was released 10 years ago? Zippo. So all of us LT8s (and this translates to the higher numbered ECUs as well) are stuck with an ECU that offers:

-poor interpolation between load points
-ridiculous timing model based on a distributor paradigm
-no closed loop O2 control
-extremely limited I/O
-crappy datalogging
-software from the late '90s

I'd highly recommend you go to an ECU that was designed in this century such as the Haltech Platinum series, MegaSquirt 3 (if you like DIY), or similar.

I will not be running any cats or emmissions. I dont know if that makes a difference. Dont know anything about tunning so in simple terms what kind of problems may I run into mechanically by running a microtech?

Aaron a lot of cars run microtech in Florida it is probably the most ran ecu in the Orlando area. Most of those cars are street cars and part time drag cars. I will not be running an O2 sensor.

The microtech comes with a separate loom "engine harness " that you wire from scratch. But the power fc uses the factory harness with no modification. I bought my car stock so its never been modded that's why I want to try the power fc to play with and add bolts on until I finish my new motor with single turbo conversion.

Makes since the power fc worked well for me no complaints but my mechanic uses mircotech and there is not too many honest mechanics around here so microtech it is for now. If things go wrong then I will go to pettit racing in Soufh Florida and run my power fc.

any of those 2 will be fine ... only problem is florida is most people tunning microtechs are just guessing . gotta find someone thats open to any other ecu

Ya in this area there are a few that know what they are doing but many are good sales people and can have you believing they know rotaries. A lot rotaries have been done wrong in this area.

Someone in this forum has to have had good or bad experience with micrtech lt10 in an fd on a roadcourse.

And put me in any of those cars and I'd immediately be complaining that they drive like crap. It is very, very difficult to get a Microtech running smoothly on a street car unless you tune it excessively rich. And by excessively rich, I mean that it's difficult to lean out the light load bins because of the poor resolution and interpolation. Lean those bins out and there is a big hump when the engine moves into the next bin. Terrible.

Not running an O2 sensor?!? Why in the great name of all that may or may not be holy would you do such a thing?! Widebands are a great tuning aid and necessary for good datalogs. And any ECU that doesn't suck (so not Microtech) can use an O2 sensor to continually adjust the mixture to keep the engine at optimal AFRs for both power and economy. The better ECUs can even self tune the AFRs via the O2 sensor.

You won't run into any problems mechanically running a Microtech. It is a reliable ECU that will do the job. However your tune will never be as good as the more modern ECUs. And considering Microtech has not dropped their price, there is zero advantage to buying one over a decent ECU.

I have over 10 years tuning Microtechs on everything from a 146HP stock port NA to 500HP bridgeported big turbo cars.

correct. if you want it to run lean on cruising at some points it will be a rough ride

im local and can tell you the goods and the bad from a micro .

feel free to contact me if you any questions

Street car stick with PFC, track car only microtech.

Aaron I maybe mistaken when it comes to the O2 sensor I know for the most part people do not run them because of the lack of a cat. I hear what you are saying about the ecu being out of date. What do you meen when you say the car will run like crap. Will the it idle bad or will it jerk back and forth when I am cruising down the highway? Have not heard those complaints around here. Does not mean that your not right though. I wonder if I can live with it or if it is just garbage. Let me know what you mean exactly what you mean when you say it runs like crap. I do not want to rewire my car for microtech and then it runs like crap on the road.

Hey,
I live like 20 minutes from Kilos shop and dealt with him a few years ago. He knows his stuff. That being said I have always worked on my own rx7s because of what you mentioned about local shops not be trustworthy. I've heard and seen of shops ripping people off all the time. I have had two FCs and now have an FD. I'm running a Power FC and with the right injectors it is much better for the street. It took me a long time but I have my car running pretty much perfect from a drive ability standpoint. I don't have emissions or IAC and my car has zero hesitations, starts perfect at any temperature and I run 15 AFRs cruising around. I think I get better MPGs in my FD than in my Evo X that is almost bone stock.

Plus the PFC is plug and play. Just change you are temp sensor to a fast reacting one and your map sensor if you plan on pushing more than 15-16 PSI and your good. The PFC does have its limitations, which is why I purchased an Adaptronic. But the car is running so good that I still haven't bothered to switch ECUs yet. Also, you can control boost with PFC.

Next time you are in the area, I'll give you a ride in my car and you can see how well a PFC can work.

idle will be fine . on the microtech if you want it to cruise on the hw on high afrs the car will run rough , only way to make it run smooth will be on the richer side

I am not a mechanic but I do some of my own mechanic work on my fd. I have learned that if you want it done right sometimes you have to do it yourself. I am trying to learn more and not be so intimadated by my fd. Most cars I just go for it and well the forums and youtube make me a scary mechanic.LOL!!!!!! Anyways when it comes to ECU my knowledge is very low. I understand that the ECU job mainly is to control fuel delivery and spark. I am sure I left some other things like fan speed and air intake but here we go. I dont know what AFRS is or loads. For what I am understanding the Microtech will waist more gas than other ECUs correct me if I am wrong.

If this is the only problem I can live with that for sure. I own a rotary so if I wanted fuel economy I would have a motorcycle. Already have one so lets go ROTARY! My rotary will not be my daily driver but yet just a passion,hobby that I want to enjoy to drive. I for now will have to just trust my mechanic on the tunning. It is hard to trust people in my area but here we go again. I dont think I will be taken for a ride again. I have own rotaries since 1992 in this area and I have been taken for a few bad rides. I almost gave up on my rx7 but I have seen a lot of persons on this forum run reliable fds and I can not give up hope on mine. Worst comes to worst I will sell boh ECUs and buy something else. My car will run well even if I have to travel out of this state to get it right.

JMM By the way I would love to take you up on that ride in your fd. I live very near you. Anyways I will be getting with you at sometime to see your car. I love rotaries especially those that are well kept and run well.

No problem. PM me or just stop by my shop.

Yimmy's Body Shop

Well I see for the track it should be good I wonder if anyone that runs it on their fd street car could tell me how a microtech is working for them. Track roadcourse still have not heard from anyone. I have heard some comments from a few tuners and I thank them for their input. If you are running microtech on a roadcourse or a street car give me some input on how your car is running.

stick with PFC

RX781 Why PFC? Have you ran both microtech and PFC in your car on the track or on the street? My mechanic tunes Microtech and that is why I am leaning this way but he usually runs drag cars and some street cars. I wanted some input on anyone who has ran microtechs on a roadcourse or street. I just wanted to make sure that I am not making a mistake. It is a lt10 with I believe microtech coils but dont quote me on that. I also heard that PFC are not very good on cars running over 400hp. I will not be running that much power but dont want to limit the car for the future.

If anyone else has some information I would I appreciate it or point me in the right direction. With so many FD owners and some using microtech on the street there has to be somebody in this large community that runs or did run a microtech for a track car, street car or a car that does both.

i have a track only FD with an lt10s microtech.

run e85, no idle control, turn the key, cranks twice and starts and just idles perfectly. no throttle input needed.

Its a great ecu and does everything i need it to at the track.

if you have a good microtech tuner, doesnt matter if he is a drag racer or a street car guy, the tune up will work fine.

car has run an x4 box with bosch coils, and now has no x4 box with LS1 truck coils.

Unknown user finally someone from down under where I know these ECU s are popular. Question are you drag racing or are you taking your car on the roadcourse. Many drag race with this ECU with great results but what about roadcourses. You know on and off the throttle situations. Low rpms high rpms. Drag racing is usaully high rpm. Roadcourse you may have to accelerate out of a corner at low rpm. This is where I am not sure about this ECU and why I started this thread.

https://www.rx7club.com/build-thread...d-rx7-1033758/

this is my car, videos of circuit racing it are in there.

i drag race it too.

Most people with Microtechs don't run an O2 sensor because there is nothing that the antiquated Microtech can actually do with an O2 reading but display and (poorly) datalog it. People with other ECUs that are modern absolutely do run O2 sensors, typically widebands, for multiple reasons. For example, modern ECUs allow FULL closed loop AFR control over the entire load table to tightly maintain an appropriate AFR regardless of conditions. They also support autotune which makes it a hell of a lot easier for a single person to tune a car. Additionally things like engine protection if the AFR starts to drift.

A Microtech isn't cable of any of this. The most important of the above features are closed loop.

I thought I was clear: Because the Microtech offers poor resolution and interpolation, the car at light loads must be tuned richer than it should be to maintain smooth operation. So you're wasting fuel, stinking up the air, dropping efficiency. Also the on/off decel on the Microtech doesn't have any smoothing. Zero idle control so the idle must be higher and richer than a proper ECU allows.

Oh and the timing control on a Microtech sucks. There's no other way to describe it. A virtual distributor...yeah, take something as limiting as a dizzy and then simulate it in software. Bloody brilliant (sarcasm).

Buy a Haltech P1000 with a plug and play FD harness then. Done and done. A well known supported configuration with a great ECU, large amount of forum support and a solid track record.

In this day an age, the ECU does far more than just control fuel and spark.

You are absolutely correct.

The Microtech is a fine ECU if you intend to use it on the track only. It is only on the street where its deficiencies quickly show.

I remind you I've been tuning Microtechs (as well as many other ECUs....Haltech, MegaSquirt, Wolf) for over 10 years.

Thanks for your input just having a hard time with making a choice. My mechanic really for some reason loves it. He says that the microtech was designed for rotary engines in mind. Man I am so torn between what the information that I am gathering. I do know that this mechanic is very well respected in the rotary world and has many rotaries on the track that run very well I will be researching in my area how well they run on the street. I have not heard any complaints about his work so this makes it hard for me to decide. I do take your information as valueble though.

Me personally, if there was no one in town that tunes haltech, get everything ready and trailer the car to someone who does. Aaron knows his stuff, and I enjoy every time he posts as I learn something new from someone who has "been there done that 1000's of times". I am going haltech on my build. But to each his/her own I suppose.

the microtech was originally designed around the rotary engine, that still doesn't mean much about its deficiencies. microtech works fine, rough but fine. it's just that most of us feel they are either too small a company or too lazy to make an ECU that is up to date, even their current line of ECUs are roughly 10 years old. find any other standalone manufacturer that thought it would be a good idea to let their products stagnate for a decade without any performance enhancements/evolution.

The company is fine and has more than enough resources to develop a new ecu, Dominic is lazy as shit though. If you want an ecu that had rotaries in mind, you can't go past adaptronic. Andy has an mx5 with a 13brew in it and his products are top notch. I have fitted a few and had a good play with them and I consider them best bang for buck ecu available. Personally given a choice for all ecus available, an autronic sm4 is at the top of my list. Working at an authorised dealer for autronic products probably does make me biased though. My fd3s is fitted with a microtech and I hate it. Absolute pig of an ecu. When I change, I won't even bother selling it. I will be getting more satisfaction out of tying it to the back of my car and driving for 4hrs straight with my car running a decent product.

lol, i hear ya. their laziness is going to put them out of business, even drag racers will eventually want more than the turd in a box that they're still selling(15+ year old tech) like it's still fresh and new. too many other companies with assloads more options for a few bucks more out there. even their newest release unit the LT10c is a joke, i'd be willing to experiment with the adaptronic versus buying another microtech even though i have never touched an adaptronic yet.

Trying to keep this thread alive in the hopes that someone in the rotary community has actually tried running this ecu on the track and the street.

Neye you are more than welcome to swing by and take a ride in my street FD(ac/ps) making 400 whp on pump gas with a Microtech. You can then make the decision yourself. Wise man once told me the arrow is only as good as the indian. (or something like that ) :lol:

Neyo, we also have multiple cars that run SCCA events and others that take their cars to Sebring and Road Atlanta with no issues. All microtech.

Nice!

My fd has a microtech in it I drive it everyday! But adaptronic is the only ecu I would consider for plug and play application. The microtech works but its not the best. The ecu is as good as the tuner...IMO