intermittent no start
 

having a problem with a microtech install. installed m-tech 3 weeks ago but never got it to start. the problem is it will sometimes try to start but most of the time it wont. looking at the laptop software you will find the the rpm is also intermittent as well as the amber light on the unit. removed the crank angle harness and ohmed it out. found no resistance. reinstalled and had the same problem. talked directly with microtech and we agreed on getting it tested. boxed it up and sent it in. THEY FOUND NO PROBLEMS!!. they insisted it was a grounding problem so when i got it back i added 4 engine grounds. same problem. removed crank angle sensors and tested. found them good. i also shimmed the sensors to get a closer gap and found the signal got better and still very intermittent. to my understanding if you dont have a consistant flicker with the amber lights as weel as the rpm on the laptop then there is no need to go any further right. any help will be appreciated. car is a 94 fd. microtech is a lt10 with ignitor.

it trys to start and it wont??

maybe you have your fuel mapping totally wrong...

if the fuel mapping is totally wrong should you still loose your rpm and flickering amber lights. remember it will only try to start when it has this.

10secrx7 - the mapping was done by Jon at microtech(repair) in Aus. I talked to Maria at microtech repair ,she the ecu was fine and that the set-up and base map was install, what else could be the cause

how is the battery voltage when you are trying to crank the engine?

If there is a fuel delivery problem and the engine is cranking but not firing the battery voltage may drop lower than the sensors or may be the ECU can operate at and you may get a flicker on the RPM

Do you have FUEL? at the injector, are the injectors firing? is the fuel pump pumping?

Do you have SPARK? pull a plug out and watch if there is spark when cranking.

once again when trying to start we have no flickering amber light or rpm which means we have no pulsating injectors or coils. i thought you had to have a pulse to pulse injectors and coils.

once we intermittently get an rpm/amber light flicker it will try to start. we cant get it to hold a signal long enough to adjust the map to get it started.

guru's please chime in.

sorry carbon man the battery voltage with booster connected is 14.20 volts. it drops to 11.90 ish when starter is first applied and will level out to 12.15 after initial load.

check your cas wiring again, it if it getting signals but not strong ones try swtiching the wires around

Dlae

im sorry 10 sec rx7. i have pulled the harness out of the car and ohmed, found no resistance but dont understand about swapping wires around. but i do feel the signal is not very strong at all due to the fact it will attempt to get better if i get the trigger sensors closer to the pulsewheel.

any other thouhgts? is it too late to get a refund? e-8/e11 sounds good right now!

I would try another CAS and sodder it directly to the wires.

CJG

i have tried another cas but i havn't tried the soldering trick. thanks!

what does dale mean by swapping wires around.

Any Other Ideas. Anyone Else Had This Problem.

swap the wires around, change the 2 signal wires around the other way on the sensor,

it is obusally something wrong with your install or the car would have started, probing the wires and checking for resistance is not going to tell you anything, your not getting the correct signal from your sensors,

in other words the schematic could be wrong, because wiring is not.

no the schematic is right, if your plugs are ok, your battery voltage is over 12v when cranking, you have fuel, your fuel pump is working and your motor has compression and it still wont start then the wiring is wrong somewhere.

have you tried simple things like pulling a little fuel out and trying that??

I'ave had a few problems with Mirotech's on Rotarys, and have found the (some) problem's by going in to screen 31 (set up) and in the Config mode dropping the number (4 for 13b) (6 for 20b) down to 0, this put the LTX--in to a self check mode--eg-- will fire the injectors ( without the fuel pump going) and the coils.
You should feel the injectors firing, and with a timing light -- find out if the coils are working.
All so --its not flooding??--the crank settings could be high for it--I had this on a 13brew motor.
:shooter:

well 10 sec rx7 i just checked the ecu end of the connector with an oscilloscope and had a strong steady signal every time. i connect it back to the ecu and have the same intermittent signal problem with alternator removed. i talked with tim at microtech and got him stumbled. mabye you have another suggestion. please.

try bringing the air gap away a little bit, might be too close. Mazda has air gap specs in the factory service manual

we have the sensors at factory settings, we believe the ecu is bad, DO to the fact all measures have being covered, from bat voltage, testing the harness, installing new CAS, we even tested the signal from the CAS at the sensor and even through the harness-a strong signal every time., but once it's installed into the ecu the amber light flickers on and off mostly off intermittently. I bought the Microtech LT10S from A-Spec three weeks ago. I even mailed this ecu off to microtech in Aus. it checked ok. so why am i having the same issues. I was hoping A-spec OR MICROTECH could swap ecu's with me just to honor their warranty or just plain good customer satisfaction but no help(the ecu is brand new) can anyone help! Haltech really sounds good right now. BETWEEN A-SPEC AND MICROTECH NO ONE IS HELPING IT'S BACK AND FORTH - can anbody help?????????????????????????????????????????????? ?????

listen to me, have you changed the polarity around on the wires to the cas??

you can probe it and scope it all you want but if the polarity is backwards you will never get it start...

you can winge all you like but im telling you 99% of problems with any ecu is the install or tune... if it was installed right and the tune hasnt been messed with it would have started 1st kick, so as much as you think your perfect im betting it is something with the install causing the problems...

also the orange light is suppose to flash when cranking.... it means it is getting a signal..

i will reverse polarity in the morning which is susposed to make it a rising edge trigger. no problem. but is the exact opposite of what the manual states. i guess the manual is 99% of the problem.

my e-11 will start my fd rising or falling edge, but e-11 is in a different league.

i dont care what your e11 can or cant do, i wouldnt piss on one if it was on fire but thats just my opinion...

im sorry. im just venting. thanks for the info though. i will try it in the morning and keep you posted. thanks again.

With all this trying have you changed things and they have not fixed the problem and you have not put them back? (like sensor set up, sensor wiring, timing, fuel trim, etc.)

are all the sensors reading corectly?
TPS, MAP, Air Temp, Water Temp,

Do you have fuel pressure at the injectors?

Do you have SPARK?

Make sure the plugs are not fowled from trying to start. (change the plugs)

~Ian.

yes all other sensors are reading correctly. new plugs, everything thing back in place just not recieving a signal. once again i didnt think injectors or coil would pulsate without a signal.

but if the orange light is flashing when cranking it is recieving a signal... just not the right one hence the reasoning behind swapping the trigger wires around

the orange light is intermittent just like the recieving signal. with everything connected except the fuel pump power(dont want to flood the engine) for every 20 cranks you will recieve a signal mabye four times. this means crank 5 sec's and wait 5 sec's. 20 times. looking at the laptop's rpm guage in the upper right corner while the owner is in the car looking at the orange light. the four or 5 times i get an rpm reading out of 20 cranks on the lap top he will se the orange light pulse inside. they correspond exactly everytime. i went out this morning(23deg out) and reversed the polarity and found the same results.at this point i am more interested in the pin out. if microtech said it's ok i will believe them because i sent them an ecu not the entire harness and car. i am starting to wonder of the pin location in the four way connector is correct. they dont give numbers to location so 10 sec. rx7 can you help me identify the pin location for the trigger input. i know a lot of people do stupid things, i have been there my self. i wired the car according to the manual, had the owner check it over before covering it in loom. and had another person i work with to also look it over. this does'nt mean shit to some people but i will tell you a little on myself. i am a diesel tech 11 yrs. this year for detroit diesel(yes ddc uses a gt42 turbo) i have done repowers( taking cats out putting ddc in. i won the series 60 challenge 2 yrs in a row. (electronic troubleshoothing) s60 is the leading on the road truck engine. ddc was the first company to put electronics on a heavy duty truck engine. i make wiring repairs in trucks every day. srs,trs,vss,opt idle,cruise,jake brakes,injectors etc. in all trucks. i dont claim to be an expert through all this because i still after 11 yrs. learn everyday just like every one else in the world. but i am just letting you all know i am not a novice. with all this being said i cant get a simple car started.(what a dumb ass right). you guys help is very appreciated and i will continue until the problem is found. by the way this is my fourth microtech install, 1st on an fd and of course my e11 install on my fd. thanks again. now can anyone help with this pin out!

regarding the pinout: do the 3 wires on the CAS harness meet to the 3 pins on the ECU (postion wise)

the pin out digrame is on the bottom over the wiring digrame, if it is not on yours you can download a manual from www.microtechefi.com that will have the pinout on it

dale

Yes It Has Its Own Connector But I Am Trying To Find If The Locations Meet.

good news. i was able to bring a sensor simulator home from work. i will be able to simulate the cas and really get down to the problem. i will keep you all posted.

well sadly the sensor simulator showed the same results. we also had a guy from mazcare come by and take a look. still same problems. so now it is for sale. lt 10s with ign box still under warranty. the owner is willing to take a loss and get rid of it. best offer please. it is 3 weeks old and purchased from a-spec.

dude do you got the complete harness installed? I mean everything grounded and connected like the X4 box, coils, fuel pump, etc... get everything connected and soldered in and try again

everything in connected and soldered in. put the unit in test mode and it proves it. we are just having a trigger input problem.

well i had a interesting conversation with Maria from Microtech regarding your problems, this is what they did when the ecu arrived here,

1, ran up on test bench and worked perfectly,
2, pulled apart and inspected the board, nothing wrong so put it back together.
3, PUT INTO A CAR AND RAN THE CAR ON IT!!!!

so there is nothing wrong with the ecu, it is in your install, something is not correct somewhere.

well anymore suggestions. i have checked everything you said so far. is there anything in the ecu set-up that can cause it?

there are 2 pickups on the front of the motor, try swapping everything in different combonations and see if that works,

hey 10secrx7 rotarynut and I are working together- r u familar with the LT10S software and if so can you email me a setup please

with A-spec telling they can't swap ecu's with me and microtech saying the ecu is ok-but nothing is working out- ur the only one that's trying so thanks man! can you tell me what other factors can contribute to my ecu not receiving a signal. we've got dozens of testing equipment, we test the sensor-its fine a signal everytime, once plug in no action-maybe the setup is wrong u think? if so can provide?

i have done a heap of LT10 stuff and never had a problem with them,
only thing that will stop it starting is something stupid like the wires to the CAS are not correct, or someone has changed something in the software like the number of cyl's is not set to 4 or something silly like that,

try every combonation possible for the cas wiring, you will see on the plug the 2 bottom wires are the signal wires so dont hook them up to the same sensor or it will definatly not work,

i have had 1 problem in the past (on a LT8) where 1 of the wires wasnt earthing properly, take a picture of the 4 pin plug that goes into the ecu, i want to see the side where the wires go into,

sure thing - do have a contact number or any other source of communication you can email it at rotarynutz05@yahoo.com thanks

as it is christmas time here i will be taking a break starting in about 2 hours time,
i wont be answering my phone, wont be answering emails, i will jump on here every now and again and see how your going?

yeah me too, hey thanks for ur help Merry Xmas I'll keep you informed

merry xmas to you too,

just post what you find here and ill reply when i get a chance

1. are you sure your pink wire is not cutting out (12V+) make sure the green light on the ecu is solid as youre cranking. if not jump the pink wire to the Red constant wire for testing purposes

2. you stated everything is connected... i assume you have the fuel pump connected and the coils are giving out visable spark? (test mode)