DavidDeco

It may be a few weeks until I can get it Dyno tuned. Will I be okay driving around with the base map (assuming I tell it about the 1300 Secondaries)?

Here's my setup (pertinent parts):

Large SMIC
Pettit Cold Air induction
CB, HF Cat, DP
Cosmo Fuel Pump, Rising Rate Fuel Reg
1300 cc Secondaries
Street Port - Newly rebuilt
Stock Turbos and still sequential
Thanks

machinehead

I think the base maps are pretty damn good. I ran around on them for quite some time without any problems. If anything I would make sure that you have the newer version. It should say like 5.08 or something like that on the display. If it says 2.0 then you may want to take some timing out.

Which brings me my own question... Has anyone ever done a wideband test of the base fuel maps?

mmaragos

I have run it a few times (street tuning). From 4000 RPM to 7500 RPM in a 3rd gear pull (WOT, 0.9 boost setting):

Max AFR = 11.59 (FJO)
Min AFR = 10.51
Ave AFR = 11.08 (80+ data points on each run)

Max Inj Duty (on ave) = 89%
Max Boost = 0.88 to 0.90 kg/cm^2

Max Knock = 25, min = 4, ave = 15
Max Air Temp = 58 deg C, min = 40 C, ave = 49 C
Ambient Temp range (approx) = 80-90 F (26-32 C)

See sig for mods...I did not have the HKS twin power or the A'PEX intakes, used to have stock ign and M2 aluminum intake.

Stock engine and turbos with about 90K.

I need to get back out and do some more testing. I want to try to clean up the areas where it dips below 11:1 consistently.

machinehead

Well, that backs up my assumption that the base maps are pretty good as I suspected.
Thanks for posting that. People, including myself have spent so much money having these "experts" tune thier cars when most of them did not even need it or the experts only made things worse.

machinehead

Just a few other tidbits... I have been studying some different maps.
There is a generic TO4S map that has been floating around, it is basically the one you get if you mail in you PFC to XS for single turbo tunning. I have been using that lately. It is SUPER rich. To get it into the high 10 and low 11 a/f range I removed a good 15% of fuel out through the pimm settings. At P17 N17 base map=13.5 with a correction of 1.398 which equals 18.873, take out my 15% and you get 16.04ms.
Check this out. The stock fuel map at P17 N17 has a base value of 12.44 and a correction value of 1.398, this gives us 17.39ms
Now finally, I paid to have them dyno tune my car... P17 N17, 11.97X1.445=17.29ms!!! That is the stock setting! They just leaned out the base map and added in the correction map. Can you believe that ****! Basically what it means is that the stock map is no worse than the one I paid 500 bucks for. But now I know who is full of **** and who is not... maybe that was worth 500 bucks?

nocab72

I put down 320hp, 280trq (.90kg/cm^2) on the base map this weekend with about 5% fuel trimmed out of the 5 - 8k RPM range, a/f was between 11 and 12 throughout the run.

I'm looking for a better map now to pull another 30hp out of her!!

Here are my mods for when my sig changes in the future.

Apexi Power Intake / PowerFC w/Commander & Datalogit
M2 Downpipe / RX7 Store SS MP / Greddy Power Extreme Exhaust
Efini Y-Pipe / Greddy Pulleys / Greddy 2 FMIC / Pettit AST
Nippondenso Competition Fuel Pump / HKS Twin Power / Fluidyne Radiator
ACT SS Clutch / RB 9.5lb Flywheel

K

Wade

iTrader: (1)

The base maps were too lean for my car. I saw about 12.5 a:f at 12-13psi until very high RPMs where it would start getting rich. I have all the bolt on mods, stock engine and ported sequential turbos.

Chuck Westbrook found the same thing with his car and 12-13psi of boost except I don't think his started getting rich on the high end (maybe because he has a ported motor and I don't). He has all the bolt on mods, ported engine and turbos.

Wade

nocab72

hrm, mine was very very rich (9:1) prior to y-pipe & FMIC with PIMS @ 100%. Took them all they way down to 88% on 4k - 8k on the dyno with wideband before they came up into the mid - high 11:1's.

Now with the above listed mods including y-pipe & FMIC I still pulled out 5% to get the a/f where I wanted it...mid - high 11:1's.

Everycar is different, what works for someone else may blow up your car, so becareful everyone!!!

K

machinehead

Yes I would not want to be responsible for someone damaging thier engine. I just thought it was funny when I actually got around to adding up the numbers and then seeing how they came out the other end. I think Apexi did a wonderful job and obviously put in some r&d.

7at11

I heard about that Kyle, I'll be you were expecting more since you posted elsewhere about how much that IC helped no? How much and where did you get that mount for the O2 sensor welded on? Got to start piecing things together for when I order my computer, but I'm glad you posted your PIM readings I was wondering how much you took out. Good videos on CR btw also!!

grampa

Don't count on the PFC maps being enough.

Dave at KDR did my 94 yesterday (a bit hot in the shop).

With my mods it was scary lean @10psi ~redline.

Relevant mods:
94 touring
CWR intake
efini y-pipe
ARC SMIC
Greddy hardpipes
Aquamist
DP, EGT
bonez hi-flow
m2 dual catback
PFC & datalogit
RB light steel fw

mmaragos

How much RWHP and how lean?

Badog

Same mods as Nocab's with the only difference being an Apex'i FMIC and a main pulley, I did 318 /260 @ (.80kg/cm^2). It was on the same chasis dyno, but they did not have the Wideband O2 setup for this session (good for a baseline, wasted trip for test/tune)

SleepR1

Grampa,

Will Dave Barninger tune your car if you have him do a ported motor?

I plan to have Dave do a ported motor with reliability mods. The other upgrades will be intake, IC, dp, hi-flow cat, cb, Japan spec twins set to 10 psi of boost on the A'pex Power FC.

Will the base map work for awhile until I break the motor for serious tuning? Will Dave send you the maps? Is it best to have a datalogit or will the commander be enough to do what I need to do?

SleepR1

BTW,

I've seen all the numbers on these maps, people have been throwing around. How hard is it to make adjustments to the maps with just a commander? Would it be worth it to have a datalogit version?

Badog

Datalogit and a WideBand O2. Then you can learn how to tune. Or, when I come out to Indy when the shindig is supposed to happen that Mike is working on, I can tune you with my Datalogit and WB O2. Check out the NE section.

redrotorR1

Still, can you make tuning adjustments with just the Commander? I have the PFC and Commander sitting on my table at home. I'm getting around to installing it ... probably this weekend ... but if I wanted to, could I make adjustments without the Datalogit?

SleepR1

Basically my question too

Badog

Sure you can.

What are going to tune against? Most people run a wideband and use AFRs.

redrotorR1

I was curious if you could enter in some of the posted maps of other members who have the same setup. I know, everyone's car is a little different, but if the map is conservative ... could save you some time and money.