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is a haltech e6k still relevant?
Recently i got the chance to buy a e6k, i understand its dos based but is it still worthwhile wiring it up, i know alot of guys are running sprint re, or the ps1000 but those are not a option right now with budget, the e6k comes with a harness made for a fc and he will put a map on it.
Some may say to just pony up the extra cash and buy new buy again the difference in price could be another part to get me closer to running. Guys please advise. As always thanks for your time |
You would have an easier time tuning a carburetor. E6K, No wideband support, no datalogging, no idle control, no boost control, you have to tune the fuel map by looking at the RPM rows. meaning you can only look at 1000rpm. then you need to go back through the menus to get to the 1500. then another menu to get to 2000. Very time consuming and very easy to make mistakes without noticing. Poor injector staging. Stay away.
EB Turbo |
I have been mildly looking (only because I cannot afford a new harness yet) at the Haltech harnesses and a rotary guru that's local has my car and he said since my engine harness looks like a rat's nest that got stuck in a fan blade lol. I would love to line up and beat whoever had my car before me and the previous owners as well for all the shady shit they did to this car's electronics. He said the Haltech will simplify everything, eliminate tons of wires and random connections, and make it look a lot cleaner in the engine bay...
So, my question is which Haltech harness would he be talking about? (My car is single turbo with upgraded radiator and intercooler so a lot of stuff is disconnected or gone) Hope this doesn't hijack your thread man... Cody |
MICROTECH LT 10. Simplest and Breakfast of champions.
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Originally Posted by crmd37
(Post 11140533)
I have been mildly looking (only because I cannot afford a new harness yet) at the Haltech harnesses and a rotary guru that's local has my car and he said since my engine harness looks like a rat's nest that got stuck in a fan blade lol. I would love to line up and beat whoever had my car before me and the previous owners as well for all the shady shit they did to this car's electronics. He said the Haltech will simplify everything, eliminate tons of wires and random connections, and make it look a lot cleaner in the engine bay...
So, my question is which Haltech harness would he be talking about? (My car is single turbo with upgraded radiator and intercooler so a lot of stuff is disconnected or gone) Hope this doesn't hijack your thread man... Cody
Originally Posted by REBELDE
(Post 11140589)
MICROTECH LT 10. Simplest and Breakfast of champions.
Microtech LT-10 2x Hall,magnetic or optical input triggers. 4x Fuel injector peak and hold outputs. 1x Auxillary input/output. Now you need $155 for coms cable and software license, Now you need an Ignition expander $125, Data logging $125. So $1505 , no third party RS232 or CAN data output, boost control, idle control, Factory USA support, Not much better than DOS based editor, The list goes on. Or you get this for $760 AEM EMS-4 Injector Outputs (8 ohm minimum, High Impedance Only) 4 Saturated Coil Triggers 0-5V Falling Edge Fire (Do not connect to coil primary) 4 VR (Mag) Cam Input 1 VR (Mag) Crank Input 1 Hall VSS Input 1 Hall Crank Input 1 Hall Cam Input 1 GPIO - 1.5A Low Side Output / 0-5V Analog Input / Switch Input 4 GPIO - 1.5A Low Side Output / 0-5V Analog Input / PWM Output 4 O2 Sensor Input 0-5V Analog 1 Knock Sensor Input Programmable 1 Throttle Position Sensor Input 0-5V 1 Manifold Pressure Sensor Input 0-5V 1 Coolant Temperature Sensor Input 0-5V 1 Inlet Air Temperature Sensor Input 0-5V 1 Sensor Ground 1 5 Volt Reference 1 USB comms Yes Communication cables included Yes Fully enabled editing/logging software included Yes CAN bus equipped with Programmable Send / Receive Yes CAN data stream output 32 ch Internal data logging 8 MB Maximum internal logging rate (per channel) 125 Hz PC logging Yes Data analysis using AEMLog Yes EB Turbo |
To be honest i had not even considered the aem, sound like a good route how difficult is the learning curve for tunning on it, i will be doing it myself since the local tuner here does haltechs and has a reputation of blowing things up while tuning. EB im not calling you out but where did you get the price of 760 i would be intrested to read up more on it.
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Originally Posted by jagfc3s
(Post 11141276)
To be honest i had not even considered the aem, sound like a good route how difficult is the learning curve for tunning on it, i will be doing it myself since the local tuner here does haltechs and has a reputation of blowing things up while tuning. EB im not calling you out but where did you get the price of 760 i would be intrested to read up more on it.
Examples of the EMS-4 (#30-6905) Retail is $843.34 AEM eBay Tri-Point Engineering |
Just to set the record straight.
The E6K can log a wideband input. It does datalog to the laptop. It does have closed loop idle control for 2-wire IAC valves (BAC). It does have open loop boost control. The software and tuning procedure is not as convoluted as EB Turbo makes it out to be. You do not need to go through the menu to access various RPM points. Simple N (next) and P (previous) key strokes will do this. In short the E6K has been a work horse for quite some time. Very reliable little unit that works well for what it is. If you can pick it up for $300-400 a harness that is not trash, it would be a good buy. The down sides to the E6K are the DOS software. On newer laptops, you'll need to run a DOS emulator and fool with a USB/serial adapter. The wire harness is NLA from Haltech. The AEM EMS-4 uses the same connector and that harness can be adapted. But, by the time you spend a few hundred on an ECU and buy a new harness, you're in the neighborhood of a new low-end ECU. Last thing that I always notice with an E6K is the lack of RPM resolution around idle and just above idle. Would be nice to have some more RPM points here, rather than the standard break points every 500 RPM. |
Essentially someone put a Carb in a box with some wires coming out. Dont be fooled. You get this for $1100. I would assume you get the basics, MAP, TPS, AirT, WaterT, but they dont list it.
Microtech LT-10 2x Hall,magnetic or optical input triggers. 4x Fuel injector peak and hold outputs. 1x Auxillary input/output. Thats right. Haltech and AEM SUCK compared to microtech. The aussies got that damn thing engineered greatly and very simple. No Wonder why the worlds fastest rotarys from Puerto Rico, Australia and New Zeland use them. |
Originally Posted by REBELDE
(Post 11141576)
Thats right. Haltech and AEM SUCK compared to microtech. The aussies got that damn thing engineered greatly and very simple. No Wonder why the worlds fastest rotarys from Puerto Rico, Australia and New Zeland use them.
EB Turbo |
1 Attachment(s)
Microtech about 4 lt10s now. Haltech e11 once crap, haltech e8 crap . You on the West Side of USA where Wankels are slow. Tuning is so so but the best state (Cali ) to buy fuel injectors because 5-0 motorsports rock out with their cocks out..... Other than that MEHHH!! Keep your AEM. Most of us will keep Micros......... This is one of my last projects a 13b turbo alcohol suzuki samurai for your enjoyment master AEM tuner wanna be......
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Guys before we keep making this a who's cock is bigger, we should just go back to informative post. C. Ludwig the e6k i found is 500 harness made for a t2 will need injector ends and a map sensor seller will make a map for the ecu according to the parts on the car.
I understand that the ecu that best fits me ia one im comfortable with, but with so many options and local tuner availability it make it a hard choice for a new guy in the standalone world. I dont mind doing my homework i just need help getting started. My goals for this car are 350+ hp dd S4 turbo 2 block judge ito ports S4 na 9.4 rotors Turbonetic 60-1 .98ar Parellel fuel system with aeromotive fpr Wahlbro 255 fuel pump 550 primaries ( still thinking about it) 1600 secondary Water meth kit. These are parts i have ready to put in just trying get this thing done. |
that fuel pump is way too small. If you are on a low budget just make a dual MSD fuel pump setup.
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I will look into my fuel situation would a dual walhbro be better since i already have one.
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running intank or outside?
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In tank
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Originally Posted by EB Turbo
(Post 11139928)
You would have an easier time tuning a carburetor. E6K, No wideband support, no datalogging, no idle control, no boost control, you have to tune the fuel map by looking at the RPM rows. meaning you can only look at 1000rpm. then you need to go back through the menus to get to the 1500. then another menu to get to 2000. Very time consuming and very easy to make mistakes without noticing. Poor injector staging. Stay away.
EB Turbo |
Originally Posted by BASTARD
(Post 11141720)
:lol: you must be a jack of all trades and a master of none ... the E6K is very capable and it isn't that difficult to use, a child could learn to use it
EB Turbo |
The single Walbro 255 will support 350 whp just fine. They start to fall off around 425+. I've done 460 whp (Dynojet) with one. At that point it was struggling to maintain pressure and we backed the boost down to provide 420. The car has been running happily for a few years now. Have several others running happily in the 400-420 whp range.
If you're serious about the E6K, make sure you get some good pictures and info on the harness. Properly wiring everything is the cornerstone to proper EMS function. You don't want to buy someone's poorly built problems. EB, stop being so dramatic. The E6K is certainly no more time consuming than setting up anything else. If you're familiar with it, it's quite easy really. For instance, I cussed Microtech for days the first time I worked with one. That is until I figured it out. From there I realized, even though they do things differently, it's a quite easy interface to work with. Every systems front end is different, even though the system is doing the same thing in the end. Once you take the time to learn to navigate them, most work just as well as the rest. My one exception would be Hydra, but even that is improving finally. Going back a few posts, the EMS-4 is a good choice. It has great feature content for the price. However, the $760 price quoted doesn't include a harness. You'll need to drop another $225 or so on that. To the OP, there are many choices. In the end, all EMS do the same thing. They're controlling fuel and spark. All the choices suggested will work well for you goals. The AEM EMS-4 would be the most feature rich. The used E6K would be the least expensive and would do the job. Buying used is always a crap shoot though, especially on the harness side of things. The front ends of each are unique, but that doesn't mean any one of them is hugely better or worse than the other. Define your primary goal (price, features, something your tuner is familiar with, etc.) and go from there. When properly installed and calibrated any of these systems will do what you're looking to do. |
Originally Posted by C. Ludwig
(Post 11142000)
The single Walbro 255 will support 350 whp just fine. They start to fall off around 425+. I've done 460 whp (Dynojet) with one. At that point it was struggling to maintain pressure and we backed the boost down to provide 420. The car has been running happily for a few years now. Have several others running happily in the 400-420 whp range.
EB, stop being so dramatic. The E6K is certainly no more time consuming than setting up anything else. If you're familiar with it, it's quite easy really. For instance, I cussed Microtech for days the first time I worked with one. That is until I figured it out. From there I realized, even though they do things differently, it's a quite easy interface to work with. Every systems front end is different, even though the system is doing the same thing in the end. Once you take the time to learn to navigate them, most work just as well as the rest. My one exception would be Hydra, but even that is improving finally. Going back a few posts, the EMS-4 is a good choice. It has great feature content for the price. However, the $760 price quoted doesn't include a harness. You'll need to drop another $225 or so on that. To the OP, there are many choices. In the end, all EMS do the same thing. They're controlling fuel and spark. All the choices suggested will work well for you goals. The AEM EMS-4 would be the most feature rich. The used E6K would be the least expensive and would do the job. Buying used is always a crap shoot though, especially on the harness side of things. The front ends of each are unique, but that doesn't mean any one of them is hugely better or worse than the other. Define your primary goal (price, features, something your tuner is familiar with, etc.) and go from there. When properly installed and calibrated any of these systems will do what you're looking to do. I am currently doing around the same but am looking for a little over 400whp, maybe something less than 420whp. I have these things as of right now: -CJ Motorsports stage 1 fuel kit with rails and lines -CJ Motorsports twin fuel pump assembly -Two walbro 255 fuel pumps (which I may be replacing with something that flows a little better like a pump that flows 290lph) -Aeromotive 13109 Fuel pressure regulator -GT40 Single Turbo -Apexi Power FC + Commander I have also been told that walbro pumps are close to about 6-8lbs of boost per pump, so with a twin assembly you would be fine with about 12-16lbs of boost on your car. Can anybody confirm this? Cody |
Originally Posted by REBELDE
(Post 11141576)
Essentially someone put a Carb in a box with some wires coming out. Dont be fooled. You get this for $1100. I would assume you get the basics, MAP, TPS, AirT, WaterT, but they dont list it.
Microtech LT-10 2x Hall,magnetic or optical input triggers. 4x Fuel injector peak and hold outputs. 1x Auxillary input/output. Thats right. Haltech and AEM SUCK compared to microtech. The aussies got that damn thing engineered greatly and very simple. No Wonder why the worlds fastest rotarys from Puerto Rico, Australia and New Zeland use them. ive owned and tuned them all... way back to the d4s and the e6A there is no way a microtech is as capable or as user definable as any of the haltech series ... its a shit ecu,, dumbed down so imbeciles can install and make a rudimentry tune from it the LT10 / LT16 is STILL so far behind the rest of the players,, its laughable .. no user define.. no true internet share capability... a cruel joke to those now trapped with said units i spend 90% of my time still explaining / troubleshooting microtechs to morons PS haltech experienced back to the f3,, and i have re-engineered early micros to do much more,,, and currently help produce custom EOMP controllers,, so im no idiot with any of these ecus,, and a competent judge of a shit one as pointed out above,, the haltechs limitation is early ones demand DOS,,, and those up to e8/e11 demand a serial port,,, or lots of adapter hassle ... once your through that initial setup,, even an e6k is a hands down winner over any microtech ////////// that is all |
Originally Posted by bumpstart
(Post 11144892)
get off the crack..
ive owned and tuned them all... way back to the d4s and the e6A there is no way a microtech is as capable or as user definable as any of the haltech series ... its a shit ecu,, dumbed down so imbeciles can install and make a rudimentry tune from it the LT10 / LT16 is STILL so far behind the rest of the players,, its laughable .. no user define.. no true internet share capability... a cruel joke to those now trapped with said units i spend 90% of my time still explaining / troubleshooting microtechs to morons PS haltech experienced back to the f3,, and i have re-engineered early micros to do much more,,, and currently help produce custom EOMP controllers,, so im no idiot with any of these ecus,, and a competent judge of a shit one as pointed out above,, the haltechs limitation is early ones demand DOS,,, and those up to e8/e11 demand a serial port,,, or lots of adapter hassle ... once your through that initial setup,, even an e6k is a hands down winner over any microtech ////////// that is all Just using the word "imbecile" shows what kind of douche bag you are. Try to tell Microtech is shit to the Aussies, dudes from New Zeland and of course US the puerto ricans since them 3 places mastered the rotary engine before your douche bag ass was born. (No pun intended to any caucasian dude) Just you!! Another tuner wanna be......... Back on topic CMD get an aeromotive A1000. Thats all you will need for up to 600 HP |
Well sale of the e6k fell through so im back to saving pennies. Lol
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Boys will be boys I guess lol, at least there is some valuable information amidst all the insults and ridiculous allegations. But of course, it's always humorous haha.
Just remember guys that just because a standalone ECU is perfect for you doesn't mean it's the same for someone else. But I appreciate all the information as I'm sure so does jagfc3s and everybody else :) I wish we could start a thread comparing and contrasting these systems with each other in columns and rows to make the on-paper comparison a lot easier to view but that's out of my expertise range. |
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