|
Atkins Rotary - Deceptive Business Practices; Selling non-OEM as OEM Parts and Prices
I'm writing this after some prodding from several long-time members (one has been here for more than 19 years) of the RX-7 community and this forum. For anyone buying OEM-advertised parts from anyone, I advise you to inspect what gets shipped to you and ensure you received what you paid for. On March 29th, I ordered an OEM front wheel hub and bearing assembly from Atkins Rotary. I double checked the part number advertised on their website and compared it to the OEM part number from a Mazda dealership website; they matched. I then called Atkins Rotary and spoke with them to ensure they had at least one in stock so as to not delay my project any further. Their website said they had 985 in stock, but I bet Mazda doesn’t even have that many. I was placed on hold, then a few minutes later, he confirmed they had two in stock. I then made the purchase.
Here’s a screenshot of my order: https://i.ibb.co/55tNqcv/atkins-screen-pic.jpg Here’s a screenshot of their website page of the specific part I bought. Note the two areas I circled in orange indicating the OEM part number. https://i.ibb.co/sPHc0Zh/Atkins-Wesb...-Wheel-Hub.jpg It was delivered on April 2. This COVID-19 pandemic allowed me to be home and I promptly opened the box. I immediately noticed the markings, “GSP 113118 P8E” on the front of the wheel hub and double checked it with the part # on my order. They were not a match. Knowing aftermarket wheel hubs are available for the FD RX-7 and not wanting the old bait and switch tactic to be pulled on me, I googled to compare what I received with pictures of other OEM front wheel hubs. No pictures of OEM hubs online had any letters or numbers on the front of the hub. Here’s a picture of what I received: https://i.ibb.co/BLQFGwW/actual-received.jpg Eventually, I was able to determine GSP is a manufacturer of AFTERMARKET parts. I found this specific hub Atkins sent me to be sold on Amazon for $37.89. That is less than 25% of the cost I spent ($164.25) from what Atkins Rotary advertised as an OEM part. Here’s a screenshot of this hub for sale on Amazon: https://i.ibb.co/WFgGSvJ/Amazon-Whee...screen-pic.jpg I immediately called Atkins Rotary and spoke with an individual telling them I received the package and inquired as to why I received a non-OEM part. The name sounded like “Lane” or “Elaine.” The individual said they were new and passed the phone to Dan. I explained to Dan the part I received was not OEM and that I traced it to an aftermarket part on Amazon for $37. He had no immediate response. I then went on to discuss the outrageous cost of shipping, $39.30. They utilized a USPS medium FLAT RATE box. I knew they gouged the price of shipping at more than double the cost because just a few days prior, I had shipped a USPS medium flat rate box worth more in insurance, at half the cost they charged me. Dan tried to tell me the difference in cost was due to signature confirmation, but I told them USPS just left it at the door AND there was no label indicating “signature confirmation.” Even so, the cost of a signature confirmation is $3.15. Dan then told me they would send me a UPS return label and would refund the $164.25 for the hub and the $39.30 shipping. He went further and said that is the same part he had been selling for years and that if no one specifies they want an OEM part, he ships that. I responded and told him that receiving an OEM part is implied, especially when they list that part with the OEM part number and pricing it in the realm of what an OEM part would cost. Additionally, their website’s picture lacks the GSP aftermarket part number on it. I then asked if he even has an OEM front wheel hub in stock and he said, “no.” I told him it’s unethical to ship an aftermarket $37 part after advertising it as an OEM part being sold for $164, which is 4.3 times the cost. To further indicate he knew what he was doing, his only other response was that he couldn’t even get it for $37 because his cost is $60. [[b]As of the time of this post, Atkins' website still advertises this part with an OEM part number. To add insult to injury, I noticed the website count of their wheel hubs "in stock" has ticked down by two; inevitably, another victim or two won't receive the OEM part they were likely expecting] I’ve heard stories of people being charged exorbitant amounts for shipping by Atkins, but having been in the RX-7 world for a while I never would have expected them to treat me, and apparently several others, with the old bait and switch tactic. He indicated that the aftermarket part which can be had for $37 is what he’s sold for years. I can only imagine what other parts Atkins Rotary has done this with. Not only is this false advertising, it’s deliberate fraud and deceptive business practices. |
Originally Posted by av8r01
(Post 12404234)
I'm writing this after some prodding from several long-time members (one has been here for more than 19 years) of the RX-7 community and this forum. For anyone buying OEM-advertised parts from anyone, I advise you to inspect what gets shipped to you and ensure you received what you paid for. On March 29th, I ordered an OEM front wheel hub and bearing assembly from Atkins Rotary. I double checked the part number advertised on their website and compared it to the OEM part number from a Mazda dealership website; they matched. I then called Atkins Rotary and spoke with them to ensure they had at least one in stock so as to not delay my project any further. Their website said they had 985 in stock, but I bet Mazda doesn’t even have that many. I was placed on hold, then a few minutes later, he confirmed they had two in stock. I then made the purchase.
Here’s a screenshot of my order: https://i.ibb.co/55tNqcv/atkins-screen-pic.jpg Here’s a screenshot of their website page of the specific part I bought. Note the two areas I circled in orange indicating the OEM part number. https://i.ibb.co/sPHc0Zh/Atkins-Wesb...-Wheel-Hub.jpg It was delivered on April 2. This COVID-19 pandemic allowed me to be home and I promptly opened the box. I immediately noticed the markings, “GSP 113118 P8E” on the front of the wheel hub and double checked it with the part # on my order. They were not a match. Knowing aftermarket wheel hubs parts are available for the FD RX-7 and not wanting the old bait and switch tactic to be pulled on me, I googled to compare what I received with pictures of other OEM front wheel hubs. No pictures of OEM hubs online had any letters or numbers on the front of the hub. Here’s a picture of what I received: https://i.ibb.co/BLQFGwW/actual-received.jpg Eventually, I was able to determine GSP is a manufacturer of AFTERMARKET parts. I found this specific hub Atkins sent me to be sold on Amazon for $37.89. That is less than 25% of the cost I spent ($164.25) from what Atkins Rotary advertised as an OEM part. Here’s a screenshot of this hub for sale on Amazon: https://i.ibb.co/WFgGSvJ/Amazon-Whee...screen-pic.jpg I immediately called Atkins Rotary and spoke with an individual telling them I received the package and inquired as to why I received a non-OEM part. The name sounded like “Lane” or “Elaine.” The individual said they were new and passed the phone to Dan. I explained to Dan the part I received was not OEM and that I traced it to an aftermarket part on Amazon for $37. He had no immediate response. I then went on to discuss the outrageous cost of shipping, $39.30. They utilized a USPS medium FLAT RATE box. I knew they gouged the price of shipping at more than double the cost because just a few days prior, I had shipped a USPS medium flat rate box worth more in insurance, at half the cost they charged me. Dan tried to tell me the difference in cost was due to signature confirmation, but I told them USPS just left it at the door AND there was no label indicating “signature confirmation.” Even so, the cost of a signature confirmation is $3.15. Dan then told me they would send me a UPS return label and would refund the $164.25 for the hub and the $39.30 shipping. He went further and said that is the same part he had been selling for years and that if no one specifies they want an OEM part, he ships that. I responded and told him that receiving an OEM part is implied, especially when they list that part with the OEM part number and pricing it in the realm of what an OEM part would cost. Additionally, their website’s picture lacks the GSP aftermarket part number on it. I then asked if he even has an OEM front wheel hub in stock and he said, “no.” I told him it’s unethical to ship an aftermarket $37 part after advertising it as an OEM part being sold for $164, which is 4.3 times the cost. To further indicate he knew what he was doing, his only other response was that he couldn’t even get it for $37 because his cost is $60. [[b]As of the time of this post, Atkins' website still advertises this part with an OEM part number. To add injury to insult, I noticed the website count of their wheel hubs "in stock" has ticked down by two; inevitably, another victim or two won't receive the OEM part they were likely expecting] I’ve heard stories of people being charged exorbitant amounts for shipping by Atkins, but having been in the RX-7 world for a while I never would have expected them to treat me, and apparently several others, with the old bait and switch tactic. He indicated that the aftermarket part which can be had for $37 is what he’s sold for years. I can only imagine what other parts Atkins Rotary has done this with. Not only is this false advertising, it’s deliberate fraud and deceptive business practices. |
Yes, this has been how they operate for some time now. I've ordered quite a few "oem" things from them and the most aggravating part is the INSANE shipping cost and the fact that o-rings and gaskets show up in USPS flat rate boxes with zero packaging. It would straight up be loose o-rings and gaskets in a box. They've been selling "oem" parts for a while now. It seems everyone has kept their mouths shut about it since Atkins basically has an answer for just about every part needed, both oem and "oem". They advertise A LOT of parts as oem but you will receive whatever they send. Some of it actually is oem in own packing, some in a generic clear bag or some just tossed in the box with the rest of what you ordered.
it would seem the "......for years" excuse is the most widely accepted explanation for just about anything. So long as you've been getting away with it for x amount of time, that makes it ok. Nothing will come of this of course but at least it's out there that this is what it is. Atkins is not selling all oem parts. They advertise everything as such but it's not all actually oem. If you order an "oem" part from Atkins, you will receive what they send. Actually oem or just something they see as oem-ish or oem enough :lol: It also seems the time to actually pack the part is factored into the shipping price. It's the only justification I can think of since they don't actually use any packing material. with that said, I will continue to but things form Atkins. If I'm going to get played, I'd rather it be from them than the local mazda dealer. |
Originally Posted by cr-rex
(Post 12404241)
with that said, I will continue to but things form Atkins. If I'm going to get played, I'd rather it be from them than the local mazda dealer.
|
Nice, I'll look into that. Maybe that will be my new "Atkins" lol
|
If you think your shipping price around the US from Atkins is high you should see what he charges to ship to Australia . It is s total ripoff some times the shipping costs you more than the parts :pat:
|
Another good reason to buy from Ray Crowe!!! I’m sorry you had to endure that experience!
Email Crowe.Ray@aol.com a description of what you need and he will reply with part numbers and prices. His shipping is $15 flat rate. Ray is the best option for OEM parts! |
Originally Posted by Molotovman
(Post 12404256)
Another good reason to buy from Ray Crowe!!! I’m sorry you had to endure that experience!
Email Crowe.Ray@aol.com a description of what you need and he will reply with part numbers and prices. His shipping is $15 flat rate. Ray is the best option for OEM parts! |
Wow, this would piss me off. I've never had this problem with Atkins, but thanks for sharing.
|
Amayama.com straight from Japan:) Ships to europe in about 10 days
|
I've had my share of issues with Atkins as well. For a few years now if I need parts I try to go with Mazmart.com. I always get genuine Mazda parts from Paul. Or as he likes to say " no artificial ingredients" lol. Paul has always gone above and beyond to get me what I need.
|
For those who don't have Facebook or are not a member of the RX7 Facebook group, here are Atkins' replies and comments from others in response to Atkins' bizarre defense:
https://i.ibb.co/5Bxqjb4/atkins-thread-1.jpg https://i.ibb.co/3CVPV8q/atkins-thread-2.jpg https://i.ibb.co/1ZTv3VT/atkins-thread-3.jpg https://i.ibb.co/1RwRFmJ/atkins-thread-4.jpg https://i.ibb.co/DLsGq6b/atkins-thread-5.jpg https://i.ibb.co/BBhvdC8/atkins-thread-6.jpg https://i.ibb.co/BBhvdC8/atkins-thread-6.jpg |
Plain and simple fraud.
Good to know, so i will avoid shopping there. |
Thanks for sharing.. That makes me wonder how many shops/stores do that. Hopefully not all of them.
|
Thank you for sharing. Disgusting.
|
@av8r01 could you share a link to the fb page with that post?
|
Originally Posted by cloud9
(Post 12404405)
@av8r01 could you share a link to the fb page with that post?
"RX7" is a private group on Facebook so you'll need to request access. Atkins Rotary's comments are around the halfway point if all current 175 comments are expanded, just after the "Michael Jackson eating popcorn" gif. |
WOW I used their closing kit sans apex seals and am pretty happy with them but this is not right. It would be one thing if they said it is aftermarket or not OEM that would be one thing but using the OEM part number with no other language about it not being OEM doesn't just imply that it is OEM... end of the day they should come out and apologize for the confusing description, state it is non OEM and if the part is truly OEM quality, or the same manufacturer as the OEM part say that and let people make an informed decision.
I worked in a dealer as a repair technician for years and if we used non OEM parts we had to clearly state that to the customer for fear of liability, I guess Atkins is counting on people not noticing then blaming the installer if the part fails or just warrantying it. |
Or they're just banking on the fact that no one is going to complain because of the resource they are in the community.
|
Thanks to Mazda I’m back on all four wheels today. This is what the front and back of an OEM front wheel hub assembly are supposed to look like.
https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.rx7...696218cc9.jpeg https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.rx7...910312d75.jpeg |
and there’s more 😡. the replacement axle nut from Atkins doesn’t fit in the 35mm socket so that’s another misrepresented OEM part. I had to drive into town and pay another $18 to get a new socket for it to fit just to install it. FFS. It ended up being a 36mm for the AFTERMARKET nut Atkins sent even though, once again, their website advertised that part with an OEM part #. The old nut is next to it for reference (see staked mark)
https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.rx7...9660f2502.jpeg |
Ever since I came across one of their parts online for an FD that stated something in their description something like, " These are no longer made, we bought all 500 that Mazda had in inventory" followed with a price that was at least double than what I was seeing it online, i've avoided them since which reputable vendor does that? I mean, they could've omitted that quoted section above and left it up to the consumer to make that decision that they're an a**.
|
FWIW
About 12 months ago I ordered a pair of front Timken 512118 Hubs from RockAuto. When they arrived they were Timken boxed, but inside they were NTN HUB066 identical to your's supplied from Mazda - $56.99. |
TIMKEN is an oem so that would make sense
|
I have experienced NTN bearings on all Timken kits i have purchased:)
|
Originally Posted by ChrisNZ
(Post 12405561)
FWIW
About 12 months ago I ordered a pair of front Timken 512118 Hubs from RockAuto. When they arrived they were Timken boxed, but inside they were NTN HUB066 identical to your's supplied from Mazda - $56.99. For example, EXEDY owns a HUGE portion of the 1990s-2000s OEM clutch market for Japanese vehicles. But, they aren't an OEM supplier for many American / Germans vehicles. So in order to fill those gaps in their catalog, they will buy OEM clutches from LUK or Valeo and throw them in an EXEDY box, with their own part number, instructions, etc. That way, when they want to sell to PepBoys or Advanced Auto, they can present a catalog with everything rather then get pigeonholed holed as just the "Japanese clutch guys". As for whatever Atkins is doing, I have no comment on that. |
Aww man just ordered some gaskets everything but one oring had an OEM bag. Now I'm paranoid...
|
It's exactly like you suspect.... if it's not in an OEM bag then it's not OEM lol
can you post a picture? |
Not too many resources left for odd little parts for the RX-7. Shipping costs suck, but imagine having to find those o-rings and hubs with no Atkins around.
Ray Crowe is one guy at one dealership on the east coast. How old is he again? Is he even working during the lockdown? My other car was a Mazdaspeed Protege that I had to sell it because there are straight-up NO resources for parts, at any cost. Endlessly trying to figure out what parts for other cars work on the MSP. Mazda 6 brakes, Tribute clutch, etc. All a big fucking headache that would be alleviated in one shop sold parts for that car. That MAZDA. |
its not a matter of being ungrateful because we all are. we're very grateful. the issue is the crooked and deceptive practices to take advantage of people. i think its important that the line is drawn with what this is all actually about. no one is being ungrateful about atkins being a resource, its just the way they treat customers and the way they operate. like i mentioned before, just because there are shop out there catering to a niche market it doesnt give them the right to treat the customer base however they want. there is still an expected level of professionalism and customer service that comes along with it.
the "shut up and color" approach that some members are trying to defend is a little unsettling. we need these sellers just as much as they need us. we're not out of line to demand and expect more respect as a customer than we've been getting. |
Originally Posted by cr-rex
(Post 12405910)
It's exactly like you suspect.... if it's not in an OEM bag then it's not OEM lol
can you post a picture? https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.rx7...527a083bdf.jpg |
Originally Posted by Redfogo
(Post 12405955)
Yeah here is a pic hope it's still worth using seems okay...
https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.rx7...527a083bdf.jpg with regard to the timken bearing chances are high that the bearing itself has multiple applications and timken buys that bearing then makes the flanges and presses it all together for the application. this is common and OEMs do this as well. it is far cheaper to go to someone who does nothing but make bearings all day and buy theirs than make bespoke bearings in house. |
Yeah its just stupid.
Nothing wrong with selling non-oem parts. Very good to have a shop dedicated for the RX-7 / Rotary with both OEM and nonOEM. Only thing it serves is to shit your reputation. |
Seems the general agreement here is that the issue is them selling non-oem parts under the guise of being OEM parts. Theres no problem with selling them, its just when your advertised part numbers "just so happen" to be the same as OEM and the price "just so happens" to be in line with OEM and the image is of an OEM part, then you receive something that isnt OEM, there in lies the problem. Its deceptive any way you look at it. Intentional or not.
to rectify the situation, just making it clear the parts being sold are not OEM would silence all the commotion |
Atkins has always been pretty up front about their o-rings being 3rd party sourced, some of which they claim) outperform stock such as the inner o-rings and may be reusable and will be testing their proprietary inners pretty soon, I also decided to pick up another full o-ring kit from them but with (what I'm hoping is true) factory inners. Because I'm a masochist i figured I'd go all out and also get one of Pineapple's HD kits, as well as a 'new stock' o-ring kit straight from Mazda (currently on some sort of slow boat from Japan, it's literally been 2.5ish months). I'll probably start some sort of thread but so far I'm pretty happy with most things, including most of Atkins' known 3rd party seals however the outter o-rings they've supplied in both kits are very thin compared to some other stockers I had on hand. Like 12a or thinner thin. Also they're white on sides like the stockers however it seems very sloppy so I am suspect if they're actually Mazda (which they don't advertise mind you) or if they're made up to look like Mazda.
|
Originally Posted by Natey
(Post 12405917)
Ray Crowe is one guy at one dealership on the east coast. How old is he again? Is he even working during the lockdown?
|
My point is the more resources the better. We need a west coast Ray and maybe a Canadian one too. There's no need to work the one guy we have to the bone during a global pandemic...or any time for that matter.
also, I'd never sleep around on Ray. :love: |
Atkins is a good resource, in a niche market.
They stock a massive inventory, and need to make a profit. They gave you a refund when you asked for it, I think they did all I would expect. I have always been happy with the parts I got from Atkins, they answer emails, they aren't the cheapest, but as you said you can shop around. |
Alright I feel like I need to chime in here.
I rebuilt an engine. I used 10 corner seal plugs from Atkins and 2 from Mazda (yes I can be strange like that sometimes). The engine ran for 3 minutes, then I opened it again. The 10 plugs from Atkins were completely destroyed and 2 from Mazda were completely new. I placed another order from Atkins and I clearly wrote (at least 4 times) that I want:
I received everything last week. The parts came in bags with blue and white Mazda tags. Wonderful! I just discovered that one of my corner seals had to be changed, so I went to the local dealership and ordered one. It came with the corner seal plug. I could compare directly the OEM plug from the local dealership with the Atkins OEM plug. I don't wanna complain here about the bad quality of corner seal plugs. My concern is the fact that I paid extra money to get OEM plugs and they sent me "their OEM" plugs but with the Mazda tag in the Ziploc bag. That is pure FRAUD and I don't understand how they can get away with this. https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.rx7...081cdbccda.jpg https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.rx7...343ee51135.jpg https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.rx7...0b1ced4940.jpg https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.rx7...20e7ac6b7a.jpg |
Just came across another response from 2014, where Atkin's is pulling something similar, reply #40, on selling a 929 brake master as an OEM, and the person receiving a centric. Seems like they've been doing this for awhile now.
https://www.norotors.com/index.php?t...2109#msg252109 |
@MuRCieLaGo That's unreal.
Also, I could be wrong about this(someone please correct me if I am) but I don't think anything from Mazda comes in a zip-lock style baggy(I've never ordered corner seals but I've never received any parts in a zip-lock style baggy). Which, if correct, arguably demonstrates a premeditated and deliberate attempt to deceive. |
Originally Posted by cloud9
(Post 12406613)
@MuRCieLaGo That's unreal.
Also, I could be wrong about this(someone please correct me if I am) but I don't think anything from Mazda comes in a zip-lock style baggy(I've never ordered corner seals but I've never received any parts in a zip-lock style baggy). Which, if correct, arguably demonstrates a premeditated and deliberate attempt to deceive. I know the plugs I have received from them are not OEM but they still joined a Mazda OEM tag (and I paid $20 extra for that tag too). By joining the Mazda tag they just confirmed that they are deliberately frauding. This is criminal and I am sad that they are not in Canada. They would deserve an easy lawsuit. I compared their Mazda tag with a "real" tag and it seems to be the same material, it doesn't seem to be a copy. Their tag seem genuine, and I don't understand that part. |
Originally Posted by garage alpha
(Post 12405675)
This isn't THAT unusual. Lots of manufacturers want to offer a "complete" catalog and will even buy competitors items and sell them in their own box in order to fill the blanks.
For example, EXEDY owns a HUGE portion of the 1990s-2000s OEM clutch market for Japanese vehicles. But, they aren't an OEM supplier for many American / Germans vehicles. So in order to fill those gaps in their catalog, they will buy OEM clutches from LUK or Valeo and throw them in an EXEDY box, with their own part number, instructions, etc. That way, when they want to sell to PepBoys or Advanced Auto, they can present a catalog with everything rather then get pigeonholed holed as just the "Japanese clutch guys". As for whatever Atkins is doing, I have no comment on that. I think the moral of the story is to not give this vendor a second thought. |
Believe the moral of the story is that the practice is deceptive and borderline fraud.
They should clearly note that the parts are not OEM and the OEM number is provided as reference. Selling OEM as your part is one thing. Selling your part as OEM is completely different |
Selling your aftermarkets part with the Mazda OEM tag is fraud, period.
|
Bumping this because I don't know how much eBay garbage is on my car since I started paying full price for OEM parts from Atkins.
Never again. |
Originally Posted by Zepticon
(Post 12404344)
Amayama.com straight from Japan:) Ships to europe in about 10 days
|
I recently ordered an exhaust gasket Atkins site said ‘a few left’. When nothing arrived I sent an email. No response. I then called. Guy said ‘Well I have a lot of buildings to look thru, no idea where those gaskets are’.
I then asked for a refund. He said sure I’ll do it today. A week later no refund. Filed PayPal dispute, received refund. Will no longer use Atkins as parts supplier. |
Not sure how I missed this thread on here until now. I've had a few really bad experiences with Atkins over their false-OEM-part advertising. I'm not sure if anyone on here remembers the ridiculous fake gasket order that blew up on facebook a few years ago, but that was me. I've still got the emails where I politely asked some questions after I received a low grade home cut out crap gasket that had been marketed as the OEM part using the OEM part number and image where they rudely blew me off and basically told me to just eat shit and get over it.
What was worse was when it blew up on facebook they updated their website and played it like I missed the ball and that it had been that way the whole time. Not only was this a LIE, but THEY KNEW IT WAS A LIE and went out of their way to try and spin some credibility to their LIE. I can't stand a liar. Skeese |
Wow, sad to hear about this. I've had pretty decent luck with them, but I think it's because I've only ordered things they couldn't replace with generic. Taking my business elsewhere :(
|
| All times are GMT -5. The time now is 01:00 PM. |
© 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands