Then why when i pulled my twins off, to replace them with the single, were the oil lines dried up? I mean the water lines were flowing through. Not trying to argue, just curious. They did have a lot of miles on 'em and who knows what they went through with previous owners. And for the carbon build-up thing, couldn't you just use Seafoam every once in a while to help with that instead of having to redline the motor?

 

How the hell can anyone view running to redline as an avoidable chore??? Jeesh, sell the car and get a Civic or something at that point. This IS a sports car, last time I checked!

 

Everybody that's in denial about the Rotary, and it's inevitable failure when using forced induction always points to the 4 Rotor, N.A. 787 of Le Mans. A couple of points about that.

1) 4 Rotor N.A. Motor
2) Mazda Engineers, who's livelihood depended on that car doing well.
3) A 24h. Continuous race.
4) Race Gas.

Now to my points,

1) N.A. Motors do much better both on the FC, and now on the Rx-8 in Mean Time Between Failures (MTBF).

2) Mazda built that car to win, and gain some visibility in the Motorsports world. In Japanese companies failure is shameful / disgrace.

3) So you're going to tell me that 24h of continuous running without heat cycling is going to be indicative of 100+k Miles ?? I've got some Honda and Toyota people who'd love to differ. History has seen different results, in that a conservatively driven Forced Induction 2 Rotor Turbo FD has, if Lucky 140k Mi, between rebuilds. A Conservatively driven stock 6 Cyl. Toyota Supra, has 200+k between rebuilds...

4) Running consistently on a "Lab Tested" Tank of Race Gas 101+ Oct. will make any rotary owner breathe easier, since fuel "quality" is no longer a factor. Not to mention Tuning / Gash Slosh, Is also eliminated as a major concern.

Now I've owned 2 Rotary Powered cars, with a combined total of 3 Engines... and can sympathize with both sides, the side that said It's the greatest thing ! And Especially the side that said it's a POJ. It cam be very smooth and reliable, but it only takes 1 or 2 components to be weak or failing for the whole thing to go south, and those components are numerous on the FD, and much fewer on other cars even the 8 and FC/FB, so chances for something to wrong are greater...

All this being said, I Love my FD, and wouldn't sell it hence I'm still in the game, unlike many of my other ex-FD brothers....

 

Congrats, you're on the right track. I'd like to re-organize your list a little, in order of importance:


1.) Proper Maintenance.
Replace all filters (oil, air, fuel) and fluids (oil, coolant, trans fluid, rear diff oil, brake fluid) immediately. Change the accessory belts, spark plugs, and spark plug wires also. This should be done with any used car, especially a used sportscar. However, since basic automotive maintenance isn't taught in school anymore, I feel obligated to mention it first. Download the Factory Workshop manual from this site, it should be one of the 'sticky' threads at the top of this section.


2.) Proper Driving Habits.
To me, this means installing coolant temp and boost pressure gauges, and treating the car like a race car. Don't be afraid to use its power when it's safe to do so, but don't abuse it to the point of damaging the hardware. Don't boost until the car is warmed up (180F / 82C), or you'll have coolant seal issues. Don't shut the car off when it's too warm (I like to see less than 210F 99C). Most turbo timers are useless because they idle the car without turning the fans on, so the engine actually heats up because there's no airflow through the radiator & oil coolers.


3.) Proper Cooling.
Install that downpipe (precat replacement), and I'd recommend an FC thermoswitch before an upgraded radiator. See this thread for more info: https://www.rx7club.com/3rd-gen-archives-73/fc-thermoswitch-fd-447606/


4.) Proper Fuel Management.
This is really important, some people might list it first. But since you haven't mentioned a desire to increase the power, you should be fine with the stock ECU and fuel map. If you experience boost creep after installing the downpipe, you should install a boost controller to keep it at 10psi. As long as your fuel system is properly maintainted (fresh fuel filter every year or two), you shouldn't need to upgrade or retune your ECU unless you're trying to remove the main catalytic converter.


-s-

 

Well from what i HEARD, the higher you rev the motor the faster the seals are gonna wear down. And not everyone who owns a sports car wants to push it like one all the time. Some people daily drive these things by choice.

 

Yes, higher RPM heavier load means faster wear. Can't really avoid that. But boosting hard when you accelerate is not going to add a whole lot of rev's per mile. Except at the track, which is a whole other story.

I think Rynberg will agree that when you want to punch it, you should punch it. (Assuming the car is warmed up, road is clear, yadda yadda). At an onramp, for example. Even going uphill in 5th gear you'll find yourself running at 10psi.

He's not saying you should cruise down the highway in at 7k, but if you never want to push the pedal to the floor ever then you should ask yourself why you're driving an FD.

Dave

 

And i do punch it and get the boost up at times, but i just didn't understand the whole thing with HAVING to redline it when you could just get the rpms up to like 5 or 6 grand with good boost. And what about that Seafoam? wouldn't that be a good way of maintaing carbon build-up as well?

 

Pop the hood and let the heat rise out of the engine. If it's windy, it will cool even faster. This works wonders after a hard auto x run. Even in the dead heat of summer my temps take a nose dive after shutting off and popping the hood.

 

Just imagining that made me laugh

 

According to the engine buliders I've heard from, carbon build-up is not a problem with the 13brew. Boost keeps it cleaner.

 

Everytime I read the "Le Mans" excuse I want to rip my hair out of my head. The Rotary setup in that car is like Apples to Oranges to the 13b and is only similiar in that it's a Rotary engine. It's 4 Rotors---NA. Not 2 Rotors - 2 Turbos. You might as well say Toyota's 1.5litre 4 cyllander Tercel motor is just as stout as the Supra's 3.0 Litre 2JZ Twin Turbo GTE motor...

 

What I'm going to tell you is that I'll take Mazda's millions in rotary R&D and hundreds of years of engineering degrees and experience over your "points" any day. Race gas?? Oh yea, that's what it takes to win Le Mans.

 

The problem is that for every million Mazda has spend on rotary R&D the rest of the automotive world has spend many many billions on piston R&D.

A rotary powered car - particularly a turbo powered one - is fun for an enthusiast but claiming that it can be as inherently reliable as a piston driven engine is, well, unconvincing.

The rotary is a failed fetish - the number of rotary powered cars in production can be counted on one finger - and is almost impossible to justify in economic or engineering terms.

 

I hate to say it, but you are correct. You guys will find that rotaries are about 50 years behind piston motors. Luckily some of us learn from the " other " motors and it apply what has been learned...

 

Re:Race Gas, Not by itself but it sure helps

Re: Learning, And "Others" just don't want to learn, or are blind to the curriculum

 

but how can you put a number on the grins [almost] every person on this board gets everytime they hit the go pedal??

I must say...rotary drivers [that I've met] are far more passionate about driving than 98% of piston driven cars/trucks on the road. (remember that 2% is probably greater than the total number of rotary powered vehicles...but still )

 

You can't say failed if they're still being made and sold. Honestly, I am surprised at the number of manual trans RX-8 being sold. Most models, even among Corvettes, have a tough time selling a majority of manual trans cars. It says a lot about the appeal of the rotary engined RX-8.

Fetish is also a harsh term. But I would agree the rotary engine occupies a small niche and it is never likely to grow beyond that.

I have owned all 3 generations of RX-7, two of them purchased new. But I have never purchased a one of them just because it had a rotary engine. I bought them because they were small, light, fast, and a good buy compared to other cars available at the time. You would have to admit though that the rotary engine played a big part in the small, fast, and light equation.

I had a conversation with someone recently and we agreed there's a good reason for the decades long popularity and dominance of the V-8 engine. They're compact and powerful and relatively cheap for the power you can get out of them. My other car has a dual cam V-8 with variable valve timing. It's a wonderful engine. Smooth and torquey with a lot of top end power too.

So, different strokes for different folks. And different rotations too.

 

REF: RX-7
REF: V8

 

I especially laugh because the rotary win doesn't even support the point they're trying to make! It does the opposite!

Let's see. This one time in 1991 a rotary powered car scored the overall win at Le Mans; that means piston motors have won every other running. I think this year makes the 76th or so running of the 24 Hours so that makes it:

Pistons: 74
Rotary: 1

Ooooh! It's really close!

 

^but..........but..........but they had to change the rules the next year to make it fair for piston engines, because the rotary dominated by so much. And thats why the rotary hasn't been back

LOL

 

Yea, i thought they banned rotaries from Le Mans cuz it kicked every1's ***.

 

It was banned for a short time, but the ban was deemed dump and removed. Mazda just never entered again.

 

Common myth that is perpetuated by rotary zealots.

 

Quick D, keep posting! You're almost at 10,000 posts

---Love, your favorite Rotary Zealot

 

Ahhhhhhhh the fountain of youth. The next step is to write up an ECU module that will monitor all sensor readings and automatically adjust boost, fuel, cooling fans, pumps, voltages, timing etc. as it detects catastrophic failure due to faulty components and driver abuse. I haven't driven or worked on an RX7 yet but I'm sure the existing ECU can do with some enhancements.

I wonder who would be interested in running my upcoming "Free, use at your own risk!" engine management software for the FD3?