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-   -   Another won't start thread... Starts but doesn't idle. (https://www.rx7club.com/3rd-generation-specific-1993-2002-16/another-wont-start-thread-starts-but-doesnt-idle-1029593/)

MuRCieLaGo 03-22-13 06:05 AM

I started changing 4 injectors yesterday, I'll be done this afternoon. If it still doesn't start, 2 possibilities are remaining:

-Bad fuel
-TPS sensor out of range

MuRCieLaGo 03-22-13 04:06 PM

Update: changed injectors, without success. I put some oil directly in spark plugs holes and it started but can't keep idle, just like in the video.

MuRCieLaGo 03-23-13 11:31 AM

Water thermo sensor changed, without success.

MuRCieLaGo 03-23-13 01:27 PM

TPS readjusted, was a little bit offset but now it's #1 - still no success.

MuRCieLaGo 03-23-13 01:34 PM

Is there a way to "measure" sparks? I've tested spark on all 4 wires/spark plugs and it was ok...

MuRCieLaGo 03-23-13 01:35 PM

Here's another video, still the same issue. Elbow was removed, that's why it has a strong weird sound from the engine. 0:55 is a backfire. If I remove my foot from the gas pedal, it will die. If I let my foot on the gas pedal, it will also die. I need to pump the pedal.

I'm out of ideas.


AzEKnightz 03-23-13 10:32 PM

Who is giving you all the ideas to check all those things? I thought I had you fuel pressure check your system?

I am helping to diagnose a problem, not shot-gun a problem.

Check your fuel pressure and report back.

-Eric

MuRCieLaGo 03-24-13 05:18 AM

I'm sorry I became a little bit crazy about fixing this problem. You are right and I will buy a fuel pressure gauge this morning. I'll report back with numbers.

I checked fuel pressure by removing outlet hose from gas pump and it seemed OK... But it'll be much more accurate with a gauge.

Thanks for your help!

MuRCieLaGo 03-24-13 04:28 PM

I borrowed a fuel pressure gauge to a friend this afternoon because no car parts stores had a fuel pressure gauge in stock this sunday. Sadly, the fuel pressure gauge's maximum is 10 psi.

https://fbcdn-sphotos-a-a.akamaihd.n...18161697_n.jpg

I thought of another way to test the pump.

Jumper F/P to GND, it took 5 minutes 10 seconds to fill 17 litres.

My pump is a 255 LPH, so it should have taken 4 minutes to fill 17 litres. I think that's OK because when I was filling 17 litres, I was working a little bit against gravity.

https://fbcdn-sphotos-f-a.akamaihd.n...89666175_n.jpg

I'll look for a greater fuel pressure gauge tomorrow but I don't think I'm in the good path.

AzEKnightz 03-24-13 11:15 PM

So fuel pressure at 10 psi. You have a problem. 3 possibilities:

1) Fuel pump is weak
2) You have a massive leak
3) You did not set up your pressure gauge properly or faulty gauge.

How did you hook up your fuel pressure gauge? Was the maximum pressure of 10 psi when you jumpered GND and fuel pump?

-Eric

MuRCieLaGo 03-25-13 06:05 AM


Originally Posted by AzEKnightz (Post 11417141)
So fuel pressure at 10 psi. You have a problem. 3 possibilities:

1) Fuel pump is weak
2) You have a massive leak
3) You did not set up your pressure gauge properly or faulty gauge.

How did you hook up your fuel pressure gauge? Was the maximum pressure of 10 psi when you jumpered GND and fuel pump?

-Eric

Sorry, I was misunderstood! :)

The fuel pressure gauge's max is 10psi, so I couldn't have a reading. I can tell that the pressure is more than 10 psi but I can't say more (look at the gauge).

Today I'll try to get another fuel pressure gauge.

Mrmatt3465 03-25-13 07:54 AM

Did you check compression with an actual compression tester or did you pull the plugs and listen? I say this because I had a friend's FC that would start but not idle and it was a blown rear rotor.

MuRCieLaGo 03-25-13 08:47 AM

I only listened because both rotor had the same "air sound". I'll check exact compression this afternoon.

AzEKnightz 03-25-13 11:44 AM


Originally Posted by MuRCieLaGo (Post 11417273)
Sorry, I was misunderstood! :)

The fuel pressure gauge's max is 10psi, so I couldn't have a reading. I can tell that the pressure is more than 10 psi but I can't say more (look at the gauge).

Today I'll try to get another fuel pressure gauge.

Yep, you need a better fuel pressure gauge to properly diagnose the problem. A merely 10 psi pressure gauge wont do you any good ;-).


Originally Posted by MuRCieLaGo (Post 11417342)
I only listened because both rotor had the same "air sound". I'll check exact compression this afternoon.

Good, next step is to check compression. Matt's got you covered on that.

-Eric

MuRCieLaGo 03-25-13 01:23 PM

Compression is good 38-38-38 on rear rotor and 35-35-35 on front rotor, however I tested rear rotor before so maybe battery became a little weak. Anyway...

Compression CHECKED.

Also checked IAC resistance which is good too.

MuRCieLaGo 03-25-13 01:24 PM

Hard to find a fuel pressure gauge where I live... But I'll find and I'll be back with numbers.

Mrmatt3465 03-25-13 01:54 PM

Ummm. How did you check compression? With it in the trailing plug hole and with the valve removed and the throttle wide open right? You should be seeing more like 110-120PSI for compression. I hope those are not PSI numbers you listed.

MuRCieLaGo 03-25-13 02:13 PM


Originally Posted by Mrmatt3465 (Post 11417609)
Ummm. How did you check compression? With it in the trailing plug hole and with the valve removed and the throttle wide open right? You should be seeing more like 110-120PSI for compression. I hope those are not PSI numbers you listed.

35/38PSI per side. 38x3=114 35x3=105

Leading hole. Throttle wasn't open.

MuRCieLaGo 03-25-13 02:22 PM

And I only tightened the tester by hand.

From Rotary Resurrection:

"observe the needle bounces. You should see 3 in succession without skips, even bounces, in roughly the 30-35psi range."

I had to search, you scared me! :)

MuRCieLaGo 03-25-13 06:14 PM

Fuel pressure: 38 psi with a weaker battery and against gravity.

Kenseto 03-25-13 08:36 PM

38 psi falls in the normal stock range, iirc. Is your IAC still installed? If it is, it may not hurt to give it a good cleaning. Remove it and hit it with some carb cleaner. That should loosen up any buildup that may be causing the IAC to not function properly. Quick process that wouldn't hurt to try.

MuRCieLaGo 03-25-13 08:37 PM


Originally Posted by Kenseto (Post 11418012)
38 psi falls in the normal stock range, iirc. Is your IAC still installed? If it is, it may not hurt to give it a good cleaning. Remove it and hit it with some carb cleaner. That should loosen up any buildup that may be causing the IAC to not function properly. Quick process that wouldn't hurt to try.

I checked resistance in IAC and everything is OK!

Update: I drained gas fluid and I put brand new gas in the tank. Without success.

Mrmatt3465 03-25-13 08:43 PM

Negative ghost rider. You should be seeing more like 85psi @250rpms cranking speed PER FACE at a bare minimum. You shouldn't have a difference of more than 20 psi per face.

Banzai Racing Compression Test
Rotary Tech Tips: How to compression check a rotary engine

Cranking speed and having the throttle open or closed are major factors for determining compression. Looking at your post you say the throttle was closed. Do another test with the throttle open, but even compression is more important than high compression.
Matt

AzEKnightz 03-26-13 12:13 AM


Originally Posted by MuRCieLaGo (Post 11417865)
Fuel pressure: 38 psi with a weaker battery and against gravity.

Yes 38 is good, but that just mean your fuel pump is good.

Did you observe the fuel pressure after 5 minutes?

Fuel pressure should be no less than 21psi after 5 minutes of sitting.

If it is, then you have a slow leak somewhere.

As for compression test, Matt's got you covered with that video. Yes you need to have a minimum of 85 psi. A good engine compression will typically range from 110-120psi. per rotor.

-Eric

MuRCieLaGo 03-26-13 05:36 AM


Originally Posted by AzEKnightz (Post 11418280)
Yes 38 is good, but that just mean your fuel pump is good.

Did you observe the fuel pressure after 5 minutes?

Fuel pressure should be no less than 21psi after 5 minutes of sitting.

If it is, then you have a slow leak somewhere.

As for compression test, Matt's got you covered with that video. Yes you need to have a minimum of 85 psi. A good engine compression will typically range from 110-120psi. per rotor.

-Eric

I got 105 and 114 psi per rotor. Engine is healthy.

After 5 minutes pressure gauge was at something like 32 psi.


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