Why are 13b-REW so expensive now?
 

I haven't been on the forum for a while, but have noticed that the cost of a new engine from Mazda is twice what it used to be. What gives? Do we know the reason why it has gone up and will it go down in the foreseeable future?

From the video I watched of new 8C range extender rotary assembly line Mazda is currently using the rotary engine factory and workers to produce the new rotary engine.

I dont know if Im hoping they re-re-retool for 13B-REW in the future or a 16X for the Iconic SP.

I say re-re-retool because after RX-8 ceased production they retooled from 13B-MSP back to 13B-REW and we had a period of readily available cheap crate engines.

How long was the old price the old price?

Maybe the price just caught up with reality.

Mazda Motorsports pricing-
Before 2018 $3,400
after 2018 $4,900
Now 2023 $5,900

Almost doubled in last 5 years.

Do prices ever go down?

I did think it was kind of crazy in 2018 when I bought a crate engine that a brand new engine from Mazda cost just a couple hundred more than a brand new set of stock twin turbos from Hitachi.

than

Didn’t the price increase again about 2 months ago to $11,000?

Yeah last I heard they were at least $11,000.

That sucks they are using the factory for a range extender. I doubt that car is a hot seller for Mazda.
It deserves another thread, but that Iconic SP is pointless to have a rotary. From my understanding the rotary only works as a generator for the batteries/electric motors. At that point you wouldn't be able to tell the difference between a 13b or a 2.5 iron duke.

its not even out yet!

i was hoping to actually hear it from someone at Mazda during Sevenstock, but i didn't. however i think you are correct. Mazda bought a couple fancy new machines to make the 8C, and maybe the assembly of those took all the available time, so the REW got shoved aside.

the odd part is the price increase, i've never seen one that big before, and ive been at this for 30 years!
the really odd one though is the 2019+ Mx5 transmission, those doubled too, but they are all under warranty, so Mazda is just changing themselves more.

I was at Sevenstock too. Very disappointed with the show Mazda brought. None of their new cars I would consider buying, with the exception of the Mx-5. That car is getting old in the tooth and the color options for it are dismal. I drive a bone stock white 2017 Civic Si, so I feel like I am not a difficult customer to please. I fear Mazda is turning into a very boring company, almost the Volvo of Japanese car makers.

Honestly it's amazing they stayed as cheap as they did for so long. It's a high performance exotic engine and still 1/5 the price of an equivalent Porsche engine.

I don't know this 100% but it wouldn't surprise me if they were being sold as a loss leader for quite some time.

I believe the rotary enthusiasts are an endangered species within Mazda... we've already seen that only a few staff work on rotary products there.

Mazda's business has been diminishing in recent years (due to changes in consumer preferences and the premature push to electrification/hybrid) but this year's revenues are up:

https://www.mazda.com/en/investors/financial/highlight/

Customers, not necessarily RX-7 owners, want cars like the CX-90 and they are more profitable.

Selling cheap cars and parts (as much as this pains us) doesn't work for Mazda's survival. Korean and Chinese cars are taking market share and Mazda has to partner with companies like Toyota to survive in today's market.

we will see about that, the Cx90 is a return to form, its got an 11 page PDF on how you're supposed to treat the customers when they come in for all 4 recalls

https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.rx7...a751ce183a.jpg

I didn't say CX-90 customers weren't suckers... but people buy what they want, regardless of the consequences.

The Mazda dealer said the CX-50 and CX-90 were "months away" so I bought a new CRV off the Honda lot.

Then the next week the CX-50 and CX-90 showed up at the dealer.

The little motor in the CRV reminds me of driving a 1950s Willy's jeep (not that there is anything wrong with that)..

That new 6 cylinder in the CX-90 is appealing.

But I'll likely be driving the CRV for the next 20 years.

Are CX90 customers special or something? Makes me wonder what they give you if you roll in for service with a MX5 or God forbid, an RX8, RX7 or old school rotary :rofl:

No soup for you!

When you can build a high performance conventional engine with aftermarket rods, forged pistons, crank, cams, etc, for thousands less, the future isn't looking too stellar.

yes!

that is really hard to predict, these days you might draw a crowd.

Since I'm in holiday fantasyland, I'm imagining Toyota tuning up Mazda's new inline 6 and putting it in the Supra and Mazda using the money from leasing that to do rotary shit.

the CX90 is a RWD platform, and they have a new Rotary engine, so new sports car would be really easy

Ha! I think this mentality is a big part of why prices has increased. Funny people didn't question inflating automotive values year over year but raise a call for alarm when support parts go up? Umm, that's kinda how a desirable x,y,z situation works. I've said it time and time again that RX enthusiasts welcomed this trend with thunderous applause. FD was never meant to be a dream / unobtainable vehicle.

I agree with the fantasyland comment. Mazda's days of cool cars is long gone and I highly doubt they will ever create something that will inspire the public the way their RX's did.

It was sad to hear.
 

Rob Dahm talked about it and that was the only reason I knew about it. Yea it was a big hit especially for me someone new to the community and who is about buy his very first RX-7 and completely built his dream car from the ground up finally and then hear how much I have to pay for a new short block was very sad to see. Imma have to hold up my project a little bit longer

just rebuild what you have with new major parts, it will be less than a new keg if you have the resourcefulness to pull it off, some parts shipped direct from Japan are less (8.5 CR T2 rotors), Mazda Motorsports; if you’re a member, on the parts that aren’t (irons and housings), etc.

if you don’t need emissions, two front rotor housings rather tha a rear housing saves about $300 or so, RX8 6-port stat gears many hundreds of dollars less, and so on …
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It's likely a combination of a few things.

1. Post COVID, stuff is just more expensive globally. Supply chains, raw materials, transportation, labor etc., were all disrupted, stuff costs more.
2. The production capacity is shared with new models (range extender)
3. They've adjusted the cost to be a viable business moving forward.

That last point is actually a good thing if you think about it. Motors (and plenty of other parts) had become scarce, rarely in stock, backordered, or NLA. If the motors are more money but Mada actually produces the stuff because they can make money on it, that's better for us long term. It's a low volume specialty model, the fact that you could get a new motor for it for $5k probably wasn't sustainable.

you're missing the part in the chain where Mazda USA stopped stocking them. a few years ago they were ordering 20-50 at a time and they had them in stock. at some point they stopped doing that.
so they were always backordered, because they only ordered it for you. sales didn't seem to change much, but perception did.

and someone at Mazda USA seems to think if they have a part in stock its bad, so its kind of typical.

Glad you brought that up. in 2023 the other thing that happened is that Mazda USA raised prices, but Mazda Japan didn't (plus the exchange rate is really crazy right now), if you can look at prices globally, Mazda USA priced themselves out of the market. buying globally you need to include shipping and maybe taxes as well, so its delivered price. stuff from Japan shows up pretty quickly too (unless you use FedEx, they took a week to go make the pickup).

Mazda prices vary a lot, rear housing is the glaring one, as its hard to see why (they use an R stamp, and drill 1 hole the other way?) Mazda USA wants $1600, Amayana, which is my Mazda Japan proxy wants $693 plus $60 to ship...

or you can just order two fronts and live with the OCD :P

Yup. I'm thinking Mazda's days of manufacturing rotary engines, that aren't for the range extender, are numbered. Hopefully the aftermarket will step up, and maybe even bring a little affordability, to our little shrinking corner of the automotive world.

Looks like the Billet options are starting to be more of a reality, especially with the price hike for Mazda. For not a ton more money, you can go billet. I don't personally know the longevity or quality of these billet builds but I'm hoping they will be more of an option in the future.

the rotor housings though, those are still fairly exclusive to Mazda, but apparently Atkins is attempting to pull something off without a liner. They had some 12A housings made and posted on social media. So maybe somebody else will try.

https://www.rx7club.com/se-rx-7-foru.../#post12582627

unfortunately a number of racing classes require the engine “block” to be OEM, which is plates and housings on a rotary engine.

I did luck out buying all the major engine components; all three irons, pair of housings/rotors/stat gears, etc. about 9 months ago. Glad that I didn’t wait.

but I just posted a wtb ad for the REW “distributor gear” spacer on the eshaft stack between the front pulley hub and the oil sprocket, as it seems to be NLA. I didn’t readily find a revised part number for it and wasn’t sure if the Renesis part is the same thickness. Please lmk if you have one laying around.
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It's entirely possible that they raised the price because they are production limited and wanted to reduce orders, and maybe want to have some actual profit margin. They can only build x amount of engines. At 11 grand demand will drop to match supply.

like maybe zero 😭

well apparently I stumbled across the new part no. 0839-11-531 for the distributor gear spacer, but it’s coming up everywhere except on Motorsports. So I was thinking maybe JP only then, but I’m seeing it listed on USA websites. 🤔
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it went further than that already. there were a few engines ordered at the old price, but received at the new price and then not sold. they will after a while get returned to Mazda USA, who has a propensity to scrap stuff like this.

Need to find that scrapyard.

so way back in the mists of time someone followed the truck to the scrap yard, and there were armed guards.
truck was full of 84-85 Rx7 leather seats, $3500 each

in the USA, you can write off anything you scrap, which is more advantageous than selling at a discount.

Beware random URLs from Nebies.

so funny enough I checked the Motorsport pricing for a full set of new REW iron plates today, and the total price for the full set of three only increased $75 from a year ago. :dunno:
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Maybe that's vindication on where exactly the deficiency is. IIRC the plates and housings are all manufactured in Malaysia or something now. If the price discrepancy is between a collection of parts before and after its assembly, then there you go.

yeah, the 8.5 CR T2 engine rotors are still a much better buy from Japan. Enough to justify the ship cost. So it does seem to be more of an assembly issue in that regard.
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