Some interior lights & brights not working
 

I need a little help with this one... The lights in the gauge cluster, logicon, and brights are not working. The idiot lights and low beam head lights are working. I have tried a different headlight switch. I have also checked the ILLUM, ROOM, METER, and CIGAR fuses.

Any other ideas? Bad CPU? :scratch:

With respect to your high beams you would need to check the wires at the Dimmer Relay. The White wire needs to have a ground on it for the high beams to work so w/the lights on, apply a ground to this White wire and see what happens. If the brights come on then you know the high beam filaments are good, and that the contact in the relay is not stuck, and the relay coil is good as well. If the brights come on w/the grounding of the White wire then remove the ground and measure the voltage on this wire w/the low beams on and compare it to the voltage you get when the low beams are on, but the Dimmer lever activated to turn the brights on as the voltage should drop from high to low on the White wire when this happens.

When you try to turn on the gauge lights does the bulb for the Cigarette Lighter come on as well as the little bulbs in the turn Signal switch, Hazard switch, Wiper and Washer switch and Cruise Control switch?

Thanks. Ill check that. Car is s5 also.

What??????????? I used the S4 wiring diagrams but I believe the circuits involved are the same between the two models. Let me check the S5 diagram to make sure. And does this S4+1 have the air bag or not? If not then the wiring for the Dimmer is the same.

Edit: The Dimmer wiring is the same (if no air bag), but not for the other lighting problem you have, but still check to see if the bulbs in the already mentioned switches work or not.

the car is a s5 gtu (no airbag). the bulbs in the switch do not come on.

Do you mean switches as in plural and what about the lighter bulb?

Edit: And if the lighter bulb does not light up just check the Red/Green wire to it w/the light switch turned on for voltage and if present then the problem is a grounding issue.

with the key on:
the rear defroster light comes on with the button pressed.
turning the high beam knob causes the headlights to go up, but not light.

when I move the turn signal switch down, the gauge cluster, logicon, and all switch lights come on normally. (just noticed this)
while this happens the illumination knob does not dim the lights. The brights also do not work.

i think i have an s4 turn signal switch? does that matter?

They are not interchangeable in the normal sense and not sure how to repin/rewire it. I believe there was one thread related to this issue by "ICEMARK" years ago, but never found it when looking for it exhaustively.

with the turn signal switch unplugged, all works as described in post #1. does this sound correct? ill try to figure out how and repin the harness.

Did you just edit the previous post to say all "does" work w/the switch disconnected for I thought it stated none of it worked w/the switch disconnected.

all works as stated in post #1 with only the headlight switch connected.

This makes more sense so the problem appears to lie within the switch being an S4.

ok cool. ill find out how to repin the harness to work with the s4 switch. thanks

so if i'm looking at this right...the s4 and s5 appear to be the same? or are the exact opposite? heres what i have found in the wiring diagrams:

http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c314/amxfc3s/1-1.jpg

Looks opposite.

Ill repin the harness tomorrow and try that. Just wasn't sure if one picture was showing one side of the harness and the other showed the opposite side.

You should jumper two wires between the switch and plug to prove how it should be set up. On an S5 the Red/Yellow wire from the Dimmer Switch connects to the White wire that is part of the Front harness and this wire runs to the Dimmer Relay. So in your case you need to connect this R/Y wire to the opposite end of that plug ( so when you look at the switch, whatever pin of the switch that was connected to the R/Y wire now goes to the opposite end of that plug) then it is now and then jumper the Black ground wire from the switch harness to a ground source and the high beam part of the Dimmer Switch ought to work. If this works then everything is opposite.

Made a mistake here as the spot on the switch itself that should have the Black ground wire is to be jumpered to a ground source or the spot on the switch that is supposed to receive the ground can be connected to the Black wire in the harness switch to achieve the same thing.

Another thing to look at is when the lever on the switch is pulled back the contact in the switch closes and passes a ground to the Dimmer Relay to work, so what this tells you is if you pull back the lever on the switch to engage the high beams then that would cause continuity to occur between two of the pins on the switch for this has to occur as the lever is pulled back so as to pass the ground from one pin to the pin that connects to the Dimmer Relay. So, in closing, measure for continuity on these two pins and when you find it you know you identified the proper two pins and then you could compare these results to the plug diagrams to truly tell if they were mere opposites of each other. Hope this makes sense.

thanks. ill give that a try today

there's got to be something else going on here....

i hooked up a known s5 turn signal switch...
only the low beams come on still.
the dimmer knob doesnt do anything.
none of the gauge cluster, cluster surround, or logicon lights come on.
when i flip the turn signal switch, i hear the relay in the cpu but no lights come on.
the hazard lights dont come on.
the rear defrost light comes on when the button is pressed.
the sunroof opens but the map lights do not work
the wipers work

is it worth mentioning that the car was automatic but i put a manual trans in? also, i removed the cruise control.

Did everything work properly at some point or has it always been wrong?

i bought the car with no drivetrain, ecu, or EM harness. i swapped in a complete turbo drivetrain and usdm electronics (N370). the EM harness is from a S5 NA. the rest of the wiring (engine, front, body, etc.) harnesses came with the car. it starts up every time, just the lights dont work properly. i think im going to take out the turn signal/headlight sub harness and make sure all of the wire colors match the FSM. maybe someone swapped it out or tampered with it at some point?

The high beam problem as stated before could be a Dimmer Relay fault and the way to prove that was already mentioned.

The blinker problem could be the Flasher unit in the CPU. This unit has 7 wires. If you jumper voltage which should be constant on the Black/Blue wire to the Green/Black wire in the same plug, the left turn signal lights and indicator light in the dash should light up and the same goes for the right hand turn signal lights when the voltage is jumpered to the Green/White wire. If these lights work then the problem most likely lies within the Flasher unit. The Hazards and blinkers use the same CPU circuit board.

i cant find my meter at the moment so i probably wont be much help right now...

i did however try 2 spare cpu's and there was no change. i did notice that on the bottom of the cpu, there was only one plug connected. is this correct? i also have a manual trans cluster in the car. i tried both the manual and auto trans gauge cluster harnesses and there was no change.

when i had the s4 turn signal switch in the car, the cluster lights did come on when the lever was flipped.

There should be three plugs connected to the CPU. The large one houses the wires from the alarm and then there are two smaller plugs as one is for the brake lights and the other for the hazard/turn signals.

i had 3 plugs connected. a small one at the top, a long one under that one, and one on the very bottom.

after removing my turn signal/headlight switch subharness, it appears that my turn signal harness does not match what is in the wiring diagram. i am going to repin it real quick and try again

i'm pretty sure the sub harness is the culprit. i need to go through all 3 connectors and make sure the wires are correct. for some reason i only have one R/G wire on the turn signal connector when i should have two.

ok...so my headlight/turn signal switch sub harness was messed up. the two wires circled in blue and red were missing:

http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c314/amxfc3s/s5.jpg

i connected them to each other but i dont think i did it right.

there are two R/G wires in the blue connector. how do i know which goes where? also, am i looking at the connectors in the right direction when running the wires? or do i have it backwards? i get a fast clicking noise when i connect the turn signal switch. i think one or two of the connectors is wired backwards.

http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c3...522_182515.jpg
http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c3...522_182544.jpg
http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c3...522_182553.jpg

One of the R/G wires comes from the headlight switch (Panel Lamp Control Switch- helps to dim or brighten the gauge lights). So this R/G wire should have voltage w/the headlight switch turned to the first position. What kind of voltage readings do you get w/the headlight switch in the first position relating to both the R/G wires? Same or different? And it is confusing as to why there are two R/G wires for the diagram only appears to show one R/G wire.

there is no voltage on the R/G wire that plugs into the headlight switch when it is in the first position. i took the R/G wire out of the turn signal switch plug and repinned it into the same spot on the headlight switch plug as the other R/G wire. this caused the dimmer lights on the headlight switch to come on, and the switch started smoking. the dimmer lights in the cluster did not come on.

are you sure the plugs are pinned correctly? i am wondering if i have the pins reversed on one or two of the plugs.

As an example, the Yellow wire in the Front harness plug connects to the B/R wire of CR1. Does yours? This is how the defroster switch illumination light gets its power from (Turn fuse powers the Yellow wire and this wire by virtue of connecting/mating to the B/R wire then provides voltage to the defroster illumination lamp).

i do not see a yellow wire in the front harness connector...

http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c3...522_195702.jpg
http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c3...522_195714.jpg

In the post where you highlighted the CR1 plug w/blue that connects to the Front harness plug how many wires in your front harness match up w/the diagram you provided color wise?

EDIT: If you took the X-17 connector diagram and folded it in half then B/G mates w/B/G, R/G mates w/the asterisk, R/W to W/L and W/G mates with W/G as an example.

here are a couple better pictures

http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c3...522_201847.jpg
http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c3...522_201824.jpg

Look at my edit in the last post of mine and see if things match up as follows.

they mate as described in your post

EDIT: i only have one W/G wire in CR1. The wiring diagram shows there should be two?

Does this alleviate the concerns that the plug was wired in reverse or are you talking about another plug(s) entirely? And the Yellow wire should be positioned between the Red wire and White wire in the Front harness. If you don't have a Yellow wire in that slot then chances are the wire there runs to the Turn fuse and you know that if you pull the turn fuse that any voltage w/key to on would cease to exist.

Here are the exact wire colors i have in each connector

(F)
B/G R/G W/B W/G [ ] R/L R/B G/R G/B
B/B TAN V R RY L/O R/G G/Y B


CR1
B/G R/G R/W W/G [ ] R/L R/B G/R G/W
B/L R/Y B/R R R/Y L/O R/G G/Y B

Okay, for starters I'm not familiar with a "Violet" colored wire for the S4's don't have that particular color that I know of. Given this I thought it was a misstype in the FSM and assumed it was a "Yellow" wire so if yours is violet then things are okay. Sorry about that.

Now the Front Harness plug in question has a R/G wire between the B/G and W/L wire and the diagram indicates this to be wrong. Is the FSM wrong? I do not know but it might be best to temporarily depin this wire and see what happens. Also, next to this R/G wire you have a W/B wire when the FSM states it should be W/L. Again, is this another possible FSM error or not. I'll stick w/the I don't know until I could see what this wire connects to first. And lastly, your Tan wire is indicated as being White in the FSM. This needs to be checked further as well.

EDIT. Are you using W/B to represent W/Blue or White/Black? W/B should be White/Black.

the R/G wire between the B/G and W/L...you want me to remove this wire and see what happens? what specifically should i check?

EDIT: i removed the R/G wire. The dimmer function still does not work. Moving the headlight knob one turn does nothing. Moving it two turns causes the headlights to raise and illuminate. Turning the knob above the headlight switch causes the headlights to raise but not illuminate. This is without the turn signal switch plugged in (and what has been happening all along)

when i plug the turn signal switch in initially, nothing happens. when i turn the switch up, the headlight switch will raise and illuminate the headlights, but they will not turn off. i put the turn signal switch back to neutral, and nothing changes (they stay lit). i turn the switch to the down position, and nothing changes. when i unplug the turn signal switch and plug it back in, turn the switch down, the exact same thing as above happens until i unplug the switch again.

so, turning the turn signal switch is causing the headlights not to turn off.

(all of this with the G/R wire disconnected)


"I'll stick w/the I don't know until I could see what this wire connects to first." - what do you mean by this? what do you want me to check?

the tan wire is likely just faded white. let's go with white.

What I meant was I would look at the FSM and see where the wire in question ran to to see if your wire color that was different is accomplishing the very same thing (correct) or something entirely different (wrong).

And are you using W/B to express White/Black or White/Blue?

W/B = White black
W/L = White blue

that one is white/blue, i mistyped.

EDIT:

(F)
B/G R/G W/L W/G [ ] R/L R/B G/R G/B
B/L W V R R/Y L/O R/G G/Y B


CR1
B/G R/G R/W W/G [ ] R/L R/B G/R G/W
B/L R/Y B/R R R/Y L/O R/G G/Y B

let me know when i should reconnect the R/G wire

After looking at the appropriate diagrams for the R/G wires, one in the Front Harness and two in the CR-1 harness, are as follows. The R/G wire in the Front Harness goes to the Instrument Cluster to illuminate it so it then has voltage w/the Headlight Switch turned on if everything was good to go. The two R/G wires in the CR-1 harness plug figure are as such. The diagram shows a splicing of two R/G wires. One comes from the Headlight Switch and would therefor have voltage w/the switch turned on. Since there are two R/G wires in CR-1 check each to see if one or both have voltage w/the switch turned on. Now there actually might not be a splicing as what appears to be splicing might be another way to illustrate two wires running side by side so as make the diagram look cleaner. This I do not know. The diagram is in section I-1 on the right dside of the diagram and focus on the box labeled "Without air bag."

there are 2 R/G in the front harness...not 1.

"One comes from the Headlight Switch and would therefor have voltage w/the switch turned on. When you check this make sure you disconnect the Front Harness plug first." - how would i get voltage from the switch with the front harness plug disconnected?

As I reread my post I removed that statement, but not fast enough it appears. Look at diagram I-1. It shows 2 R/G wires for CR-1 so see which one runs to the Turn Switch and which one runs to the Light Switch.

Again look at diagram I-1. If the R/G wires coming from the Headlight Switch and the wire going to the Turn Signal Switch are spliced together then there would only be one wire in CR-1 required. So if only one is needed then that would explain why the other R/G wire in that plug would be connected to nothing as opposed to another R/G wire. Make sense?

So moving the turn signal lever to the right turn position cause the lights to pop up and light up. The Green/Yellow wire is supposed to connect to the turn switch on one end and the CPU on the other end (and specifically the Hazard flashing unit). The plug at the CPU, which is F-01, that has this G/Y wire should be such that the G/Y wire is slotted between the open slot and a Green/White wire. The G/Y wire is also above the G/R wire in this plug at the CPU.

If your using an S5 Turn Switch then unplug the Hazard plug at the CPU that houses the G/Y wire and w/key to off measure for continuity between the G/Y wire connected to the Turn Switch and the Black/Red wire connected to the switch w/the turn lever in the right hand position. There should be continuity. If there is not then the wire(s) involved are wrong.

Also, the diagram for the Turn Switch illustrates a White/Green wire connected to the Turn Switch but the plug diagram indicates no G/W wire, but instead a W/G wire so this needs to be checked. Which do you have? The wire should be connected to the Front Harness at X-17 (mates Front w/CR-1) and it runs to the Turn Cancel Sensor from the Turn Switch via connector X-17 and mates w/the Green/Black wire found in the Front Harness side of X-17. So G/B of the Front Harness does not mate to another G/B wire from CR-1

And in your pic of CR-1 you have what appears to be a Green/White wire that was cut and connected to a Blue based wire. Where does this Blue wire go to?

i unfortunately wont be able to check these things until tomorrow. i will update then. thanks for the help. if you think of anything else, please let me know.

sorry for not updating this recently...i ordered a replacement headlight switch harness which should be here on thursday. i want to try that before rewiring anything or burning out my switches. will update ASAP. thanks

ok, so i got the new harness and it looks like i am back to where i started...

the first turn on the headlight switch doesnt do anything.

the 2nd turn causes the headlights to come up and illuminate.

the turn signals do not work at all

the hazards do not work at all.

also, i am using a manual gauge cluster in an automatic chassis. i have tried the automatic and manual gauge cluster sub harnesses and neither makes a difference. i think this might have something to do with it?