My Seventh Seven is dead
 

I don't know what happend with those other three posts but I appologize.

After owning 7 RX-7s, the seventh one is dead. And I thought 7 was supposed tobe a lucky number.
I was driving home from work yesterday when I had a sudden loss of power. Just did a compression test and found that the rear rotor has no compression at all. I guess my options are:

1: Sell it for what I can get.
2: Try a rebuild myself
or
3:Try to get a TurboII engine, drive train, and ECU etc. to put into my car.
It's a 1988 Silver convertible, nothing else is wrong with the car. I just got it about 3 months ago and haven't even had a chance to drive it with the top down.
Anyone know of any reputable rotary shops in the Rhode Island/MA area that could do the TII swap? Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated :( :confused: :(

I've got to ask, how have you gone through SEVEN engines?

maikeru: you get all the parts and provide a place to stay and I'd gladly help you! :)

If you don't have the place and time to do the turboii swap yourself........it's going to be tons cheaper to sell what you have and save up and buy a used turboii. Or have SonicRat over to do the work.

Oh, and take HAILERS advice, it is a hell of a lot easier to buy a turboII than it is to build one! Or you can rebuild your NA engine, or buy a rebuilt one and ditch the block and that's fairly cost effective, but the TII swap sure isn't pretty (or cheap)

Your story is a good lesson. These cars are getting real old. May be showing low milage, but you can bet they've been run hard. That's one reason when I buy one, I rebuild the engine right away. I wouldn't leave town without doing so. I also know that's not possible for a lot of folks. Better luck on your next engine, and take SonicRats advice and buy a rebuilt engine, if possible.

Sorry, I wasn't clear enough in my earlier post. I didn't go through seven engines I have owned 7 RX7s over the last 12 years, two of which are in my driveway. One has 150,000 miles and still runs great and the other is the convertible that has the trouble. All my other 7s never had any problems. The vert is the only one I ever had engine trouble with. I'ts a new experience for me, having a rotary die, which is why I am a little lost as to what to do. After 11 years preaching rotary reliability( which I still believe in, it would take a lot more than this to derail my belief) It's also the first vert I've owned. I'd love to keep it and get back on the road. As far as Just selling it and buying a TII, I agree it would be the easier road but if I was able to pull off the TII drivetrain swap I'd have one rewarding RX-7 . The hard part is finding the engine and drivetrain, ECU etc. I think I remember some rebuilt 13b TII for sale online, I'll have to do some digging online and explore my options. Thanks for all the advice and to SonicRat thanks for the offer. I'll have to see if the TII swapp is going to be to difficult or costly.

i have seen several turboII verts on ebay that people have done a nice job on. have you considered buying one that someone has already done this project to?

put a t2 swap in that bad boy if you have another car to drive. if not then. see if you can get your hands on a good comp block!

I have seen them but between the cost of the car and shipping as most are not available nearby, I think it would cost less to do it myself. Also the TII swap is just something I'm thinking about doing as a result of my engine dying yesterday. The engine showed no sign that it was on it's way out. It ran strong until yesterday. I thought it would be that way for a long time to come.

This guy is selling a S5 jspec engine..
https://www.rx7club.com/forum/showth...5&pagenumber=1

If it's a vert, it just might be worth the TII swap. :) Nothin like a TII vert!

it's a vert, and the TII swap is my firts choice. Thanks fo the link Rx7Nub.

I also found this one, allthought the engine has fairly high mileage, the rest of the stuff may be good..
http://www.bcrx7.com/modules.php?nam...ewtopic&t=1962

sorry it is allready sold, i forgot to check the bottom of page.

thats not really that many miles. 110k kms is like 66k miles.

its sold though :)

i'd look on ebay if you are just looking for a jspec engine and transmission to rebuilt and slap in your car.

however, if you want a whole TII drivetrain and engine, check out:
www.rotaryresurrection.com

landers sells TII swaps and can install them as well. i think on his site right now he has 2 complete turboII drivetrains for like 500 bucks, (everything from the flywheel back.)

if i were you i'd buy one of his rebuilt 13bt's for 1500 bucks or so and buy the rest of the turboII drivetrain from him because he has all the parts needed for the swap, he can give you valuable advice, and all i hear about him is how good his engines are.
if you went that path, you could give him your engine core and have everything ready for your installation for less than 2500 bucks? sounds pretty good to me. (providing you drove down to tennessee to pick it up, not sure about shipping)

jacobcartmill, thanks for the link I will check it out. That sounds promising.

yeah. i'd email him and ask him some questions. he's really helpful and i've heard nothing but good things about his engine rebuilds.
(and hell, 2000 bucks for an entire turboII swap including engine... who can beat that?)

Yeah.. Buy the parts from landers, find some garage space and have at it!

edit:
though, having him do the work may be a bit tricky, considering he is in Tennesse(sp?)

Well I have a sister in law that lives near Nashville, I think it's time I pay her a visit.;)

SonicRat have you ever done a swap like this?

Hahaha, how you going to get a blown vert there though!? :)

One of those car haulers I suppose

Ahh, I guess. :) That'd be a fun trip, hell it'd be fun to actually see where I get all my parts from, though I'm afraid I would leave with half of his stockpile. ;) I buy waaay too many parts.....

How about this? A 20b conversion. Is that possible? Would be sweet.

Yes. It'll cost you about $10,000 though. :)

Nevermind then. SonicRat have you ever done a TII Swap?

Yep! Read my signature! :)

Landers is selling the complete swap + hood for $1,700 + shipping (er, whoops)

I wrote to him and he wrote back, $1,700 is for a used engine, it would be $2,700 for a rebuilt one with everything I need plus shipping which would be about 200-250. So for about $3,000 I could get the whole setup, is that a good price?

I would say so. That's for a rebuilt engine and a complete tII drivetrain. That'd make your vert seem like a completely new car :) (Not to mention make it worth a hell of a lot more!) :D I say go for it if you got the cash!

go for it man. landers is the pimp.
you and rat can get it done :)

SonicRAT, Landers said he could also build me a ported non turbo. Which route would be better. I wouldn't have the rarity of the Vert TII but I would Imagine I would get more engine life. Is my thinking correct in this? What would be the life expectancy of each be providing they are well maintained and not beat on?
thanks again for your continued advice

a ported non-turbo will last longer than a ported turbo.

the life expectancy really depends on how heavy your foot is. the more boost the car sees, the shorter its life. but generally, non-turbo motors last longer than turbo motors.

your swap would be much easier putting the non-turbo motor in there and may last longer over the years, but you wont have nearly as much "awe factor" or speed as if you were to put the turbo engine in there.

thanks jacob, what about hp difference between a ported non turbo and a non ported turbo?

hmm... about 50-75hp difference. It's a hard choice, I know that. Reliability, or Turbo! I went to the dark side and got the turbo, but now I've got an NA to back it up. ;) It's really up to you, it's not like you're going to have to replace the Turbo engine once a year or something... It's just going to randomly go out sooner than a NA engine would. And if it's well maintained, oil changes/coolant flushes/tune ups accordingly/problems fixed as soon as they occur, it should last quite a long time.

Sonic are you saying that a stock rebuilt TII has 50-75 more HP than a ported non turbo, or would that be a some other costom turbo? At any rate, I think I'm going with the TII option. Not as reliable and more costly but the rare product that would result I think would make it worth while. I had a TII for about 3 years once and didn't have any problems with it. I'm guessing I would need a suspension upgrade on the vert to have handling be the same. Thanks again to every one who offered their advice. Also an extra thanks to Sonic and jacob.

you can get to about 220-230 bhp with a stock engine @ about 9-10 psi of boost on the stock turbo.
i'd think a ported non-turbo engine would get you about 175-190 bhp.

I thought the stock TII put out 170hp in the 87-88 and 180hp on the 91-92. I had no idea that the stock Tii could put out 220HP. I'm looking for everyday releiability and driveability as I do not race, although I am am prone to the occasional stoplight challenge(damn hondas) If I can get 60k-80k out of a TII I'd be happy. I'm going to try a rebuild on the engine I pull to have a backup.

totally stock, the 87-88 turboII's put out 180 bhp.

totally stock, the 89-91 turboII's put out 200 bhp.

the 86-88 nonturbo engine makes 140 bhp. (160 ported?)

and the 89-91 nonturbo engine makes 160 bhp. (180 ported?)

the good thing about these turbo rotaries is you can easily raise the horsepower by raising boost. by simply adding an intake and exhaust, you can get 80 bhp because the freeflow exhaust and intake lets the turbo breath and spool easier, of course you would have to start watching the fuel mixture at this point.

however, you should probably have plenty of power at stock boost levels.

you can get over 150k with a turbo engine if you take care of it.

Is it difficult to set the proper fuel mixture correctly?

This is good to hear.

you have to get an air fuel controller (like apexi S-AFC or the likes) but you really dont need to worry about that until you are running around 9-10 psi which you wont be seeing unless you mod it.

:)

Just do it, as nike would say. ;)

I intend to.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...&category=6327

http://ebay2.ipixmedia.com/abc/M28/_...e9/i-2_B_L.JPG
http://ebay2.ipixmedia.com/abc/M28/_...e9/i-1_B_L.JPG
http://ebay2.ipixmedia.com/abc/M28/_...e9/i-5_B_L.JPG

thats how i'd want it done if i were to buy one :) nice paint, nice engine bay, nice and clean.

sorry double post

No question that is nice but at over $17,000 invested, I'm sure he wants big bucks for it.

I've done the drivetrain part... figure a good, solid day's work with an assistant. You need the flywheel (just leave it on the TII motor you are swapping in) clutch, pp, clutch slave cylinder, tranny, crossmember, driveshaft, and complete rear subframe to make it as easy as possible. You have to lengthen the wires for the sensors in the tranny (neutral, 5th gear sensors) but otherwise WITH THOSE PARTS it is a straight bolt-in. The only thing more difficult about a 'vert is 6 bolts to remove the extra brace on the bottom of the chassis.

(I've done all of this... now on to the part I haven't done yet!)

The engine is another day's work, again with an assistant. You need the engine, the engine wiring harness, the AFM, the boost sensor, the hose to the brake booster. (It has a check valve in it, unlike the NA one.) The Convertible ECU is rumored to be mapped as a turbo ECU, but I can't positively confirm that. It IS a different part number from the coupe ECU. You will also want to replace the fuel pump with a TII one or perhaps even an FD pump. The NA cars don't have the relay to change the fuel pump voltage, so the "rewire" is already done. You'll need to add a boost gauge- some folks recommend swapping the dash wiring harness and using a TII instrument panel. I, however, like having the ammeter, and the factory boost gauge is crap anyhow. I think a small box to house both a boost gauge and an Air/Fuel meter (just led's in a row, the DIY kind) would mount nicely on top of the column, being RIGHT where you can see it, and not obscuring anything since it would only hide the part of the tach that isn't used. (This is what I plan to do at least!) In my case, the motor will be ported with either a hybrid or a full T04B. I have the motor, (and all that other crap!) just gotta tear it apart and get to work.

Thanks for the breakdown Brad, very helpfull. Did you do the drivetrain swap on jackstands or did you use a lift?

Thanks again.

Mike

I pm'd you and told you how I did it using jacks and jackstands. It's really not too hard once you have all the parts together. If you're seriously going to do it, I'd be glad to help. Though I have no cars on this side of the country, so I'd have to work out a way to get there. Just give me a warm place to stay and some food and I'm all good to help! ;) Getting the parts is the hardest part. Installing it is a breeze compared to that! :)