Ongoing no fire to leading side on Sa model
 

I just bought a 1980 rx-7 ls it took m e a while to get it running but when it finally started it back fires over and over out of the carb and if i let of the gas it dies the ignition coils, spark plug wires, spark plugs,distributor cap and rotor button have all been replaced...so i assume its the timing but i dont know how to check it or adjust it...so if someone could explain that to me that would be great!....also i was wondering if anyone couldl tell me the order of the sparkplug wires i think the person before me got them out of place so a picture or diagram of that would also be appreciated...my car runs very very weak wont drive up any hills and when i try to give it more gas the backfire gets worse..any idea would be great THX!

Could of been found by doing a search. :-)

https://www.rx7club.com/1st-generation-specific-1979-1985-18/distributor-spark-plug-wire-order-402288/

Recommend if you are going to be working on your car then download a copy of the FSM or get a haynes or chilton repair manual.

yeah i use to hav e a manual but ive moved three times since then so i ordered another one but i don't feel like waiting..and i did search or well...tried but this computer sucks and froze every time i tired

1980 Ignition coil information needed
 

I have a 1980 rx7 ls, the leading ignition coil closest to the firewall has no power going to it. I hooked a voltmeter to the contact while the car was running and it showed zero volts. I was curious if this is a bad coil or bad wiring. How hard is it to rewire the coil if this is bad wiring, what would be the best way to rewire the coil if the wiring is bad? Or perhaps a way to test the coil if it works... All help appreciated. Thx

That should be the trailing coil (one closest to the front of the car). When you measure voltage, are you measuring between the coil + and the chassis or are you measuring between the coil + and coil -?

BTW: The '80 only fires trailing sometimes. This is to keep a rich mixture to keep the fire lit in the thermal reactor (emissions control). If you are measuring between coil + and coil -, you will get no voltage (both termianls are at battery volatge) as the coil will not be firing. If you are measuring between each coil terminal and ground of the car, then we will have to explore other options.

Kent

Edit: I see you are talking the about the one closest to the firewall. My bad. Let me know how you are measuring voltage (from where to where) and we'll figure it out from there.

ignition coil wiring
 

MY 1980 RX-7, has no power going to the leading ignition coil...when i take the plug wire off the coil while the engine is running it makes no effect on the engine...SO! i was wondering if you can run the two coils together...like run the positive wire from the leading coil and wire it to the positive on the trailing and the same with the negative...will this decrease the power of the coils? or is there a alternate way to re run the wires for the coil...? THX! Daniel,

Nope. You can do that with the + (it is that way stock), but not with the negative. Otherwise you will be sparking the leading and trailing coils at the same time.

I'm looking at the wiring diagram right now and seeing what the prob may be. I'll pm you in a bit and let you know what I find.

1980 Ignition Coil
 

Can someone post a picture of their leading and trailing ignition coils (1980 only) with the wires included. The coils were replaced on my car before I bought it, and I think they were put in wrong. Thx.

Besides waiting on someone to supply you with a picture. Download a copy of the FSM.

I already gave him a link and he has looked at it I suppose.

Sorry I can't help with the pics. I used to own a '80, but that was like 12 years ago. Also, you should keep everything in one thread. It makes it easier for people to see what you have tried/tested already. It also helps for people searching in the future so they can see the solution to the problem.

Best of luck.

Kent

Please don't start anymore threads on this subject. If you have more questions or such just bump it up with the new info desired. :-)

Sorry bout starting new threads, I'm just kinda frustrated. But yeah you guys are right, I'll be sure to keep everything in this one thread. Ok, a few quick questions...How much would a new leading ignition coil cost me? I'm thinking like 40 bucks or something, shouldn't be too bad. Does anyone know if the coils on a GS are the same as my LS? Thx so much!

Yeah. The coils are the same. You can even get one off an 81-85 if you want. Let'sfirst see if that is the prob, though. It isn't too common for the coil to fail. First, can you verify the voltage reading to coil + and coil - for both coils? Then measure the resistance between coil + and coil -. Between these two, we can see if you are getting power to the coil and if the coil itself is bad. Based on those findings, we can check out the ignitor or the wiring.

Let's just go step-by-step and we'll track down the problem.

Kent

80 ls ignition coils
 

Well this is my 4th bulletin i bought new MSD coils because i thought one was bad...well i was wrong they are fine sooooooooooo.....somewhere my wiring is bad it still shows o volts on the leading coil...the trailing works i found that part out (shocked the hell out of me) but the leading has 0 power...i am starting to wonder if the ground is bad....the ground wires go to some kind of fuse box but all the wires look fine i wired the power wire to the other coil to see if that would work and still no power....is there a list of tests i can try or perhaps someone can tell me how to re-wire it? Or maybe a fuse somewhere?..Is there anyone near morganton NC who has the knowledge and time to maybe stop by and help me with this?

Let's go back to the testing. You never told we exactly how you were measuring voltage (from coil (-) to coil (+) or from chassis ground to coil coil terminal). It makes a difference as the coil (-) isn't ground. It is floating (means coil (+) and coil (-) will be the same voltage if the coil is not charging or firing). If you are measuring between coil (+) and coil (-), then you probably have a bad leading ignitor (in that box you speak of). Other possibility is wiring, but that isn't as likely.

Let me know how you are tking the measurement and we'll go from there.

Kent

well you see i left my volt meter in the back of my car...which has nop back glass and sooooo it rained.....so now i cant measure it but i can stick my finger on the plug turn the engine over and nothing happens...the power wires seem to be wired fine the only one that seemed iffy i straight wired to the trailing coil but still no power so it has to be the negative i think....but i dunno i was measuring from coil point to coil point + and - when this voltmeter worked the trailing showed 13 volts and leading showed 0

So, you were measuring between coil + and coil - (one end on the meter on coil -, the other on coil +)? Is so, the ignitor is probably dead. If your meter worked, it would be could to put the meter - on the chassis (or battery -) and then the other end of the meter on coil + (take measurement) and then coil - (take another measurement).

See, when you measure directly between coil - and coil +, you are just measuring the voltage difference (they could both be at 0v and your meter would read 0 or they could both be at 13v and the meter would still read 0).

If your meter is shot, you could get/make a test light and run the test. This would at least tell you if you had power to the coil. If power is present on both sides of the coil, then the ignitor is likely bad (or bad wiring from distributor to ignitor box, or bad pickup on the distributor).

So, you can either keep testing on you could just throw on a differnt ignitor to see if it is the problem. You would need one from a 1980 (the other years are different). They are called J-105 for what you need. If the ignitor is dead and you can't find another, look up the GM HEI mod on here. This replaces your ignitors with ones that are easy to find (and cheap).

I'll help as much as I can. If you were closer, I would come over and take a look at it for you.

Swap the ignitors out and see if the leading fires. That's the simplest test you can do.

What gauge cable are you using?

ok i will try some more tests and re-post probably tommorow

I checked voltage from both ignition coils from coil point (+) to chassis ground both coils registered 13 volts. So, I reversed the igniters and still only have power from trailing. I swished the igniters back into their original positions then reversed the wiring to the igniters and still...only power from trailing. So, I checked with a voltmeter the contacts leading to the igniters, the trailing side showed .63 volts and the leading showed .02 volts. I assume this means there is something wrong with the distributor. Any other ideas?

From the main harness, 12V wire splits up to the 2 coils (+) and the 2 igniters (+) terminal. hint hint

I take it you were the one who bought that SA in Salisbury that was on Ebay? Anywho. Morganton isn't that far from me. Here's the deal. If you have power going to the coil and the ignitors, but no ground signal coming from the dizzy, than it must be the dizzy. I don't have any more 80 dizzys, but you can always upgrade to a 81-85 dizzy. If your ignitors are good, than you can still use them with the newer dizzy. Seems to be something in the air here lately with dizzys. If your leading pickup has went out, than that will be the 3rd I have seen locally in the last couple months. Wierd?

ok well my compy went down for a few days and its been raining so i havent had much time to to tests...however i did take the dizzy cap off the rotor button and that little bronze shield...thingy.....i saw two sets of red and green wires the side closest to the front of the car was secure but the side to the firewall was loose when i pulled them out the wires had a needle in each one as if to make a connection through a sewing needle...(would that even work????) What other problems could there be?? if my dizzy ground is bad could i rewire it somehow??

OH btw yes i did buy the SA in salisbury off of ebay ^_^ it was a steal and a half...i can drive it with only the trailing coil working and it starts up with no trouble after it warms up but the cold weather is kicking her ass...(it floods out before i can get enough spark to get her started)

Hmm. Seems strange. I never opened my '80 dizzy when I had my SA, but pretty sure the pickups are the same as later models. I imagine that the loose one is the pickup for your leading. See if you can track down a used '80 dizzy to throw in there. That seems like your problem.

Replaced distributor and...
 

I got a dizzy in the mail today, installed it, and the car is still only fires trailing. What's my problem...? Arggg!

Sound like the leading ignitor is bad on both or you have a dead leading coil

Must be the leading ignitor, wiring or leading coil, then. Although, didn't you try switching the connectors to the ignitor around? It would have been better to add this to your old thread as most people won't have an idea as to the problem, what you have tried, etc. Perhaps if you dig up the old threads, you can send the links to rx7doctor and he can merge them together?

I have some spare coils if that is the problem. I don't have any '80 ignitors, though.

Edit: He has an '80 SA BTW.

Yeah, doc should merge these.

I have two '80 ignitors. They're the tall J-105 type. Both tested good. I don't have the box - just the two ignitors. This is not a for sale post by the way. Just a heads up kind of thing.

I have not reread everything here but merged all threads into one.
Would recommend first to swap out ignitors from trailing to leading side and coils also if this has not been done.
If after doing the problem is still there then you will have to verify that the wiring is correct to the leading side and that there are no breaks in the wiring. That power is getting to the prospective parts when the key is switched to the on position.

unless you have a bum wire or connection to your coils there should be power to both as they're wired in parallel as wacky hinted towards. It could be a coil, ignitor, high tension wire, plug wires, plugs who knows. You've got everything there on a working side that you can swap to, so just calm down and do things one by one. Don't worry you'll figure this out.

yeah i have swapped ignitors, and coils, and ignitor wiring, changed coils and dizzy the last thing i can think is the ignitor box, i followed the wires around and still didnt see a break or anything i go out just about everyday and piddle around and look at the wires but cant seem to find anything wrong...

I might have found the problem
 

It looks like something is broken in the igniter box... not exactly sure what it is... I think it might be a capacitor. Either way I'll take a picture and post it tomorrow so you guys can know what I'm talking about.

Didn't get any new answers. Car has gone up for sale.

SEE AD: https://www.rx7club.com/showthread.p...41#post7787941

Bummer, dude. Really, if you can hold of for a week or 2, I'll personally come down there it get it going. I don't have extra ignitors, but we could do the GM HEI ones if it comes to that. What city are you in again? I think that I checked before and it was like a 3 or 4hr drive? Anyway, I could maybe swing it next weekend, but the following weekend would probably be better. Another option would be to toss in an 81-85 dizzy. I don't have an extra, though.

Anyway, this shouldn't be too bad to fix. I would hate to see you sell it just because of this problem.

Let me know.

Kent

Whoa, hang on. I know troubleshooting can get extremely frustrating but don't give up yet. I was reading through the 80 FSM and the ignition system and some of the tests are quite a bit different than the later years. I've done a little bit of work on kgray's 79, but the 80 is different from that year too so bear with me. I'm not as familiar with this one as I'd like to be.

You really do need need to dl the FSM. If you do then you can follow my post much easier. First off, I'm going to guess that this ignitor box that has something broken is it is a wire coil that's broken. If so, it's a resistor coil and if it's broken, it will disable that side of the ignition. The best solution for this would be to upgrade the to the 81+ coil, ignitors and dizzy. If you wish to go that route, I can put a package of parts together for you and there's a writeup somewhere on the upgrade. It's not difficult.

Things to check:

Sec 1, p. 8-11. It shows an ignition test with jumper wires, check and see if those connections are plugged in and there are no jumpers. This test tests the leading and trailing side.

Sec. 5 pp.11-16 shows how to check the dizzy, time the engine, check the igniters , coils and plug wires. making the igniter tester is a bit of work. I just swap them in and out on the dizzy/resistor box to see if they work.

I would also pull the igniters and check the connection points for any bent/broken pins and corrosion. It wouldn't hurt to do this for all of the ignition related components and also do continuity tests on all of the related wires.

If you can, post a pic of the box and what you think is broken.

I have a solution that might work for you. Delete the funny ignitor box and just wire the ignitors to the distributor directly.

The function of the ignitor box thing is to disable trailing under certain conditions in order to send an ultra-mega-rich mixture of unburnt fuel into the thermal reactor to allow it to burn off the hydrocarbons and keep emissions low...ish. Basically the carb was jetted rich; the air/fuel mixture curve was set at the factory on the rich side, and at those times when trailing is switched off by the funky box thing, lots of raw fuel goes into the thermal reactor and 'keeps the fire lit' inside. It worked before cats became standard equipment.

If you're not affraid to do a little simple wiring, you can have full-time trailing and a far more reliable setup. Really the only thing you need to do is connect the S and G terminals on the backs of the ignitors to the wires coming out of the dizzy. Get the polarity right and you're in like Flynn. Get it wrong, and you'll see with a timing light that the marks are a little off. Just flip 'em around and you're good.

I've never really messed with '80 stuff before but I do have two good J-105s that I tested. One quirk I seem to recall about them was that the S and G terminals appeared to be reversed from the more familar J-109. Like I said, try it one way, test with a timing light and so on.

As for leading and trailing, it's pretty easy to follow the wires from the individual pickups to the plug. If you need help, Kent should be pretty familiar with rotary ignition that I don't forsee any problems. Heck, give it a go yourself. We all gotta learn some time. Just don't cut any wires. ;)

I was going to argue semantics, (MOP/OMP), that the phrase is "in like Flint", (from the movie In Like Flint James Coburn 1967), but I Googled it to make sure, and Flynn is correct. That leads me to wonder if you aren't older than I am Jeff. :rlaugh:

666, I hope your 7 is receptive to your sexual advances.

In like Flynn

Meaning

To be quickly and/or emphatically successful, usually in a sexual or romantic context.

Origin

This phrase is commonly said to be a reference to Errol Flynn, the Australian film actor. Flynn was famous for his romantic swashbuckler roles in Hollywood films and for his flamboyant private life. His reputation as a hard-drinking, hell-raising ladies' man was apparently well justified, although it has doubtless been enhanced by his delight in playing up to his image. For instance, he entitled his autobiography - My Wicked, Wicked Ways and also did nothing to dispel the incredible but nonetheless widespread rumours as to the the size of his penis and the number of women who had shared his bed. Flynn was acquitted in February 1943 for the statutory rape of a teenage girl.

The word in had been used with regard to success, good fortune or sexual conquest for some years prior to the 1940s. For example:

John Mills' Life Race-Horse, 1854: "The handicapper ... considerately classed me among the middle ones, and awarded 6 st. 12 lb. as my burthen. 'He's vell in,' said my owner, 'very vell in.'"

Alfred Mason's Clementina, 1901: "His luck for the moment was altogether in."

E. Wilson's Twenties, 1923: "Well, did Mr. Wilson get it in tonight?"

All of the above might lead us to believe that origin of the phrase 'in like Flynn' is clear. As so often though, things aren't quite as tidy as they might first seem. The earliest recorded use of the phrase is in a December 1946 edition of American Speech:

"In like Flynn, everything is O.K. In other words, the pilot is having no more trouble than Errol Flynn has in his cinematic feats."

That doesn't have the sexual connotations that the phrase acquired later. There's also an earlier, albeit oblique, reference from 1942 - in The San Francisco Examiner (Sports section):

"Answer these questions correctly and your name is Flynn, meaning you're in, provided you have two left feet and the written consent of your parents."

Errol Flynn's particular notoriety as someone especially likely to be 'in' in a sexual sense came about after his trial in 1943, although he was already known as a screen romantic lead. If the phrase does derive from his name then it appears to have been coined in regard to his all-round flamboyance and fame - which were both considerable by 1942 - rather than specifically his sexual success.

Another possible figure who could plausibly have been the source of the phrase is the political organizer Edward J. Flynn. He was a campaign manager for the Democratic party during the 1930s and 40s and was well-known to be highly effective at arranging political successes. Such machiavellian organizers were known as bosses. Flynn, with some irony, called his autobiography 'You're the Boss', in a reference to the American voting public.

Edward J. Flynn had not been associated with the phrase 'in like Flynn' prior to the efforts by etymologists to explain it though and no records from the 1940s make any such link. It seems very much more likely that Errol Flynn is the Flynn in question and, although the phrase may have been used before he was at the peak of his celebrity, it became well-known by association with him.

The 1967 James Coburn starred in the film, In Like Flint. This was a sequel to the 1966 Our Man Flint and presumably the screenwriters, on the lookout for another 'Flint' phrase, opted for a play on 'In like Flynn'. There's now some confusion between the two phrases and some use 'In like Flint' as if it were synonymous with 'In like Flynn'.

I was considering saying in like Flint Michigan, but then only some of the audience would get the joke.

I am going to roll down there on Saturday to give him a hand. Shouldn't be too bad to fix as he has already replaced most of the ignition system. If the ignitor is shot, we'll just give the GM HEI setup a shot. We'll also post up what the problem was in case any of you were wondering. :)