T-61 on the street?
 

OK, here I've been thinking I had a turbonetics Ts04 that came in a great package deal. I finally got out the calipers today and actually measured the comp. wheel and comparing it to numbers on turbonetics website, I now believe I have a T61? Anybody running one of these want to share their opinions? I was planning on getting rid of if for something smaller with better efficiency at lower (15-17psi) boost levels, and would potentially have better response. This seems to be better than the Ts04 in this region, but it's still not a 60-1. It is a BB, so I've been told (anyway I can confirm this with out a rebuild), so that should help spool a little anyway in my daily FC.
Anybody want to buy it?:D

The T61 runs slightly more power than a T04S04 - it'll run up to 450hp or so potential.&nbsp I see nothing wrong with running this turbo...


-Ted

Turbo
 

I really would have suggest against using the T-61 for the sake of whole lots of turbo lag. Just sell it and get a T3/T4 hybird model that fits your application a little better.

J

Re: Turbo
 

...a T3/T4 hybrid on a Rotary engine....I don't think so. :nono:

A friend of mine had an FD with a T-61 (1.15 AR), Haltech E6k, street porting, and an FMIC. His turbo spooled around 3500-3700rpm, and made 442hp @ 15psig on the dynojet. He didn't have a problem with the lag, however his car was a real handful in the Florida rain. :D

Re: Turbo
 

Are you kidding me?

Please dont take this mans advice.

Re: Turbo
 

Boy, who let this one out of school early... :D


-Ted

Re: Re: Turbo
 

Ted- I've seen people state the reasons for not running a T3/T4 hybrid, but its been a while... I did a quick search and was unable to come up with anything. Would you mind posting the downsides to this? As I recall... the intake just makes more CFM, therefore overspinning the exhaust side, which increases the intake compressor speed, making more CFM... .infinite loop. Am I close?

Just looking for the facts.

Evil Aviator
A friend of mine had an FD with a T-61 (1.15 AR), Haltech E6k, street porting, and an FMIC. His turbo spooled around 3500-3700rpm, and made 442hp @ 15psig on the dynojet. He didn't have a problem with the lag, however his car was a real handful in the Florida rain.

Now that's the type of info I'm looking for. I've read all sorts of things, compressor maps etc, it's just hard to get an idea how the turbo will perform without talking to someone who did it.

I do know not to use a t3/T4 hybrid though.:)

I was looking at selling this and getting a Garrett GT3540, since I think I could do it for about the same cost, and from what I hear it will make the same power with less lag. I've heard 10psi by ~2800 RPM with 400RWHP potential.
I don't have the manifold etc yet, so that will be built around the turbo. I hate to build one setup for this turbo, then decide to change it to something with a different mounting scheme.

I also don't want a Garrett turbo that will need to be replaced yearly. I only say that becasue I haven't heard anyone speak with experience as to how long the GT turbo's last in a street application.

Well if you wanna listen to all these folks then go ahead. But i stand by my point and once you put it on you can realize my point for yourself the 60-1 is simply too large for your setup. But maybe there is stuff about your setup i don't know.

But anyway if it works for you more power to ya.


J

Yeah, you get the basic gist. Since it is very rare to find an exhaust side flow sheet for particular a/rs and wheel trims, you just have to do your research. Rotaries are a bit different as the exhaust heat, strong pulses, and high redline make them "happier" with larger housings. Main thing you have to think about is where you want your operating range to be. There is a trade-off for everything. You will make more power with a larger housing. When you step the A/R up you allow the engine to breath, making it more volumetrically efficient. You are able to ingest more air at higher rpms, because more exhaust is allowed to escape, instead of having to be "forced" out by the rotor (which takes a considerable amount of force), or entering the intake cycle. The trade off is decreased velocity lower down (spool). A stock SV T2 turbo is a T3 1.00 A/R equivelant, I believe. Look at it's power potential (even given an upgraded compressor). With a T3 housing, you simply do not let the engine breath well enough to make good power.

A T3 exhaust housing is suited for Hondas and DSMs, that NEED a restrictive housing in order to spool the turbo. I believe DSM guys run a .6 a/r T3 or so, with 60-1 front sides, depending on engine mods.

L&HRacingRX7, you have no clue what you are talking about sorry. A 60-1 is a compressor not an exhaust housing. We aren't even talking about that. We are talking about a T-61 (61mm T-series compressor, T-series exhaust housing). I agree with Evil Aviator. 1.15 divided.

Re: Re: Re: Turbo
 

Turbine section is matched to exhaust flow.&nbsp These T3/T4 hybrids can make gobs of power (over 500hp), but the really small T3 turbine section is seriously too small for a 13B, especially ported.

We used to use T3/T4 hybrids on 1.6l B16 and 1.8l B18 Honda piston engines.&nbsp A 2.0 H22 can now push a full T04, if you know how.&nbsp This give you an idea of the potential of gas exhaust flow versus turbine section.&nbsp Piston engines need smaller turbine sections due to the "overlapping" exhaust pulses coming out of the exhaust ports - the 13B doesn't have this problem.&nbsp Due to the peripheral exhaust post which open very quickly, the exhaust gases have a lot more potential in them (to spin a turbo).

The T3/T4 will work (I didn't say it couldn't) on a 13B, but you're talking about the powerband falling flat on it's face by 5krpm!&nbsp Talk about small powerband!



-Ted

Care to tell us who you are???
(Boy, I'm going to get into trouble on this one again.)

I've seen 13B's push 60-1 turbos putting out 400hp.
I've seen 13B's push T66's turbo putting out 500hp.
I've seen 13B's pushing T70's turbos pushing over 500hp.
Turbine A/R sizing and turbo exhaust manifold design is the key.

You sound like someone quoting the Turbonetics back in the old days; they used to say the same thing.

You make no proof of what you claim is true.&nbsp So far, all your statements have been claims with a well-you-don't-need-to-listen-to-me conclusion cause you've been overwhelmed by the majority.&nbsp Isn't it funny everyone else thinks your claims are false?



-Ted

Before you attack him Ted, let me get a few blows...

L&HRacingRX7...a friend of mine(I won't say it's Dragon) had a 60-1 wheel in a .50 compressor with a .84 exhaust housing and just a street port(no exhaust porting) and his powerband would lose power after about 7100 rpm's...and YOUR TELLING ME that a T3 exhaust side will work?

I know that Igy's FD when it had a stock motor and a T-04S with a 1.00 exhaust had GOBS of power throughout the whole powerband.

Maybe TWIN T3/T4's will work.

Just like Ted said, T3/T4 will work great on honda engine's. I've seen a T3/T04E combo on Rutt's Integra making Crazy power. If he was to put a full T4 on, he'd push the gas down and he'd have to wait for next week before he could spool.:p:

L&HRacingRX7 here is somthing you can try... Put a straw in you mouth and tape the rest of your mouth shut so you can only breath threw the straw and your nose. Now sprint 400 meters... you should run out of power about as fast as the 13B with a restrictive T3 exaust housing will...

Re: Re: Re: Re: Turbo
 

*cough* H22 = 2.2 Liters *cough*

:D

Re: Turbo
 

Whoops :)

I should have posted my setup, which certainly affects turbo performance to your point. This is for a daily driven FC, with a (fairly)recently rebuilt motor with new housings and rotors, *heavy* street port, oil mods, 3mm apex seals, yadda, yadda. Amemiya 80mm dual exhaust, FMIC, and I will be running an E6k.

I have ridden in several 60-1 equipped cars and feel that is a great setup. I just got this turbo for *really* cheap figuring that if I decided I didn't want it, I could sell it, make a little money and pick up something else. Now I'm just trying to decide if I really want to sell it or not.

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Turbo
 

Whoops!&nbsp Sorry for the brain fart - that's what I get for posting when I'm sick (pissing out my ass with this nasty stomach virus). :(

I think I'm getting my H22 and SR20 engines all mixed up - yeah, that's a stretch, but I'm doing a lot of SR20DET research right now. :D



-Ted

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Turbo
 

thank you for sharing! :eek: :(

I'll jump in here and say I think the 60-1 is an excellent turbo and should be the entry level turbo for an intercooled rotary running at least 10 psi boost. I am running this turbo and I've been in a friend's car with this turbo and it is a good street turbo. You can easily spin the tires whenever you want.

T60-1
 

I too have a Garrett T60-1 (.70 comp w/ 1.00 Turbine)...And so far I couldn't be more pleased with the power.. At 10psi it comes alive and pulls awesome..I haven't went passed that really because its still in a break in period...Whats nice is it still bolts to an HKS manifold and still keeps life pretty simple to install....Buy one, you'll love it.....

Brad

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Turbo
 

TMI:puke:

Ok how about this?
 

I have 2 turbos here. One is a T04/S04 with a P trim and a .96 undivided turbine housing. The other is a 60-1 in a HIFI also P trim with a .70 divided turbine housing. Given that I am running the stock motor (87 jspec) which combination of turbine housings and turbo should I run. I want a turbo with the PUNCH to it because I do some ample roadracing, but also want to wax many cars on the street. Please let me know, I am leaning towards the 60-1 with the .70 divided right now, and I have the T04/S04 for sale, but I would like to keep the .96 for later use. REMEMBER THE MOTOR IS STOCK!

Thanks,
Patrick Harris

Use the To4S... you'll want at least get a .84 housing for the 60-1... .70 is way too small... It'll choke at high rpm's with even the stock port. The To4S with the .96 would be great though...