Opinions on running the 4 channel J&S Ignition
 

Trying to decide on an ignition for my car. Right now I'm leaning toward the J&S 4 channel safeguard based on a reccomendation. Just wanted some others opinions. I'll be running the lastest Wolf 3D. I want to do 4 coils, that looks like a nice clean way to do it.

I'm also a bit undecided on coils. Any suggestions there?

Why do you need to replace your coils? Are the stockers damaged?

STEPHEN

Because I want to, since I'm trying to do everything ... top to bottom ... the best possible way.

I had the J&S. It was deadweight.

For you it is Eric, because it doesn't bitch slap you when you turn it to 30 psi on pump gas.

I'm talking about the J&S with the 4 channel ignition built in.

never heard of such :D

Ryan,

I'm not sure on the J&S 4 channel, I haven't read about it recently. I emailed J&S a while back and asked about using that to Run the Rx7's ignition. I was told they they were working on a rotary specific version at the time and it was to be a 3 channel version....

My recent reading on this subject has lead me to want a Crane HI6 with the LX92 coil... those seem to work great for many people running high HP. I need to re-consider the J&S setups.

As far as I know, the J&S is a knock protection system, not an ignition. It is wired through the ignition system to retard the timing when it senses knock. You use the three channel model for the pre-renesis engines. One channel for the leading, and the other two for each trailing.

If they have some new product not on their website, please let me know.

If you plan on replacing the ignition sytem with a four coil one, you will need to separate the leading rotor 1 and 2 trigger. Not sure how that can be done. Maybe with logic. The renesis uses four coils, but only one trigger. And it only reads the trigger when the engine is first started! That PCM has to be busy - and smart!

They have boxes with ignitors built in too. I'm surprised nobody here knows anything about them.

I'll try copying it to the Single Turbo forum ...

Hmm .. I could get that stuff free if I wanted. I just kinda thought general thinking was that the Crane HI6 wasn't all that great a product. Can I get a 4 channel HI6?

I am not aware of any 4 channel HI6's. I know Rice Racing and others that I have read are using 1 HI6 CDI box and Lx92 for each leading plug... and then running stock trailing. I don't have the exact post handy but if my memory is correct he stated that upgraded to this setup over stock made the difference in spinning the rear tires at 5500RPM and spinning at 4000 RPM.


The only other option that anyone is really running is 3 MSD 6AL's....

Eitherway, keep me posted on what you learn... 'cause I"m going through the same debate right now with myself... "what to run".

One last thing, Blue TII, Ian with the horizontal mount IC ran this setup and had to add... 10%?... fuel across the board to keep the same AF's.... it seem to work very well from what I have read.

Well, I want one multi-channel box. And I'd rather do 4 channels - one for each plug - than 3 channels. So now I'm just trying to pick a box. A few people make good 4 channel boxes. But the J&S seems like a nice unit with some bonus features.

Who else makes a multi channel box that we can use?

Seems like even the J&S setup is only an ignitor and you will still need a good CDI setup to effectively drive an aftermarket set of coils.

Which J&S system were you considering?

Any one running a Jacobs pro street energy pack (the new version)? I got one tossed in for my 'package deal' from rx7.com and am looking for comments on it. What I was thinking was using this to fire two MSD Blaster SS coils or Jacobs ultra coils for the leading. I had also looked at the Crane LX92 coils but was unsure about the compatability with the Jacobs unit. Any opinions or experiences?

Kinda on this topic, I did notice that AEM has the C2Di that is 4 channel. I'm asking around for people running that plus it's reasonable ~$330.

Also, autronic has a 4 channel CDI... but I can't learn much about it or price... though one person is using that CDI with M&W coils and it replaced the entire ignition...

AEM is descent, it will do what you want, but the install is not the plug and play type.

Is there a particular setup that you have found works best Sean? I was wondering about running that with some aftermarket coils... perhaps the LX92... but the crane site says they are high current draw.

I can handle any non-plug n-play no problem. I just want to know what the best options are:

Seems like
Crane Hi6 with Lx92 for each leading stock trailing
AEM C2DI with maybe 4 Lx92 coils?
Autronic CDi with M&W? (I haven't been able to learn much of anything about that setup.

Don't take this as hard fact, but the way I remember it is like this. Our car fires leading at same time, trailing fire sequentially. This we all know. There is no problem running a 2 channel amp on the trailing as these boxes are designed to fire sequentially also. The problem is on the leading. Most 4 channel boxes like the MSD are 4 channel but do to the power supply layout, can not fire two channels simultaneously. Therefore if you hook up two lx92 coils to the first two channels, they can not be set off at the same time.

This leaves two options for the leading plugs.

1) split the ignitor signal and run two cdi boxes(2 crane hi-6's) and two high output coils(2 lx92's).

or 2) run one CDI box and either a dual post coil such as stock or better yet a T2 coil(stronger coil) or parrallel two lx92 coils.

#1 is obviously the most expensive but yields the best results.

For the trailing there are again two options.

1) one two channel box and two lx92 coils or the two stock coils.

2) two CDI boxes and two lx92 coils.

This is why you see the serious guys going 4 boxes and 4 coils. It is the only pure way to go. Secound best is 2 leading boxes with two leading coils and a 2 channel box for trailing as it can fire sequentially and two lx92 coils.

As an aside note. Our stock coils are inductive style meaning they are storage type coils. These coils work well at lower rpms where the long discharge gives a good long burn and good torque. At higher rpms, they cannot acheive full charge and suffer to a capacative system. The opposite is true for the capacative system. It is too quick down low and bottom end power suffers but up top it delivers a stronger more consistent spark. This is why CDI systems are inherently multi spark from 3k down. They have to make up for the lost duration typical of inductive systems. The HKS is called twin power for this reason. It opperates as inductive down low instead of multi spark and cdi up top. The only thing that concerns me is that there is no amp section that ups the voltage to the coil as in a true CDI box such as the crane and msd.

I hope this helps. there is also a trick you can do that involves grabbing the trigger signal straight off the ignitor and running it to your box instead of grabbing it from the coils where it has gone all over the engine bay and back by the time it got there. This will give you a cleaner signal with less interference. Remember to use shielded wire for your connections.

Mike

This info was current one year ago. I do not know if anybody has come up with multi channel, batch firing boxes which utilize dual power supplies and/or bidgeable channels. This is the only way a 4 channel amp could work. Two of the channels would have to be bridgeable and be able to fire at full power over two channels. The other two channel would operate indepently and have seperate inputs, but could share a power supply as long as it could recharge quick enough.

Mike

Cool. I think that I agree with everything you said in the first post. I also agree that the 4x crane CDi with 4x LX92 would be the $hit. It's also $$$'s I was prepared to swing the $400 for a duel leading setup and leave the stock trailing.

Then with this post, I began to wonder about 4 channel options, particularly ones that might allow complete replacement of the stock IGN. ignitors, coils etc.

The AEM C2Di seems to be close, but I have been unable to determine it's current capabilites and thus it's ability to support the high current LX92 coils.

I have alos read very little about the autronic setup. I need to PM the owner of that setup to see what he thinks.

thanks for the response.

-Chris