Autocross: Can a fb compete with Miatas?
I think there are a few of us doing it, but how common is it?
This is an update from my last race (I'm on Sumitomo HTR tires) Wow, what a great race this past weekend!!! Even though the clutch is toast, and we had to be very delicate with it on our starts and that shift into 2nd gear, the car did just fine. We probably could have gained another second or so on the starts with a good clutch, but we still managed to put the fear of God into them. Here's the kill list (all but a couple of these were on race rubber): 2x Honda S2000 10 out of the 11 Miatas (one was supercharged, with two drivers, I beat one but not the other) 944 Turbo Mazda MS3 2x BMW Z3 8x rotaries (including an ITA car, and a turbo II) 4x Subaru WRX 2x Subaru STI VW Corrado Official results are here: http://furrin.org/Results/tabid/56/a...--9122009.aspx (I'm 98 CSP). Lots of photos from the event (I'll post a link when I get them uploaded) and a bunch of video that I'll post up if I ever get the time to go through it. I think we'll be taking a bit of a break while I sort out the clutch, a fuel leak, and install some new front struts (upgrading to race Illuminas from the "stock" Illuminas). Well, so much for the theory that a 1st gen will never be competetive against the Miatas. . |
Photos are up: http://furrin.org/Resources/PhotoGal...0/Default.aspx
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Ok your post cheered me up. Sometimes I feel like going out and getting a project Miata but then I go into the garage and my FB is staring at me begging for more seat time. Until I know my skills are up I will be autoxing my FB until the wheels fall off! Hopefully I can bring some kill stories and trophies like yours to the forums amd my garage shelf. I was looking at the nationals results and noticed that a FB finshed last in CSP. That is what bummed me out.
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Last place huh? That is a bummer.
Maybe next year there will be more than one rotary in CSP. :) I'm thinking that the car might be ready for it, as long as I can get the free time needed to travel. Thinking about it though... |
shit i'm always the slowest time of the day at the local track =D
i think my car needs a better driver |
Originally Posted by mazda6guy
(Post 9494824)
Ok your post cheered me up. Sometimes I feel like going out and getting a project Miata but then I go into the garage and my FB is staring at me begging for more seat time. Until I know my skills are up I will be autoxing my FB until the wheels fall off! Hopefully I can bring some kill stories and trophies like yours to the forums amd my garage shelf. I was looking at the nationals results and noticed that a FB finshed last in CSP. That is what bummed me out.
The car is prepared for Improved Touring S (ITS) club racing so it is very under prepared for CSP. The chassis and cage on the car are first rate....all spherical bearings, custom watts link (not in the stock location) Koni's, Tri-link etc. The 13B engine is dead stock....has to be in ITS and was not running well at the club race held the weekend prior to Solo II Nationals. IT cars are not competitive in Street Prepared solo II. I have not spoken to the driver, he is on his way to the Runoffs, I am not sure what happened exactly but I would suspect that he had car issues. Certainly not a driver issue in this case....he is really freaking good! To the bigger issue here.....yes, I believe an FB can be competitive in CSP. The move to Lincoln Air Park will help allot because the courses will be bigger than what was being laid out at Heartland Park. RX7's have been very competitive in the past when Nationals was at Forbes Field and at Salina....both sites featured big courses. Search for Captain America on this site.....that car was really fast. I think the formula is a fresh iron apex seal 13B with a weber carb/Sterling, light weight flywheel, 4:88 rear end, 13x9 wheels, Hoosier tires, Koni double adj shocks/struts, a tri-link rear suspension, pan hard bar, Re Speed/ISC/Racing Beat front sway bar...Lots and Lots of seat time and a talented driver. That said....a Miata would be easier but what would be the point of doing what everyone else is doing:) |
Ya quite easily I might add
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Hey Mustang, that car was running both a watt's linkage and a tri-link? I always thought it was one or the other? Just curious.
13x9 wheels with the new Hoosier 255s would really be great. Hopefully I can afford something like that in the spring. Trying to keep up with these guys while running cheap tires is a lot of work! :) However, I wanted to get as good as I could on cheap tires before going back to the race rubber (I had a used set last year but they were only good for a couple of events). |
Not to be a downer here, but while I think a FB could be a fine regional car its going to take alot to come close to a nationally prepped CSP Miata. Those cars are stupid fast. Just look at the results. At nationals this year, CSP was one of the fastest classes that uses actual cars (yes I know the weather screwed up some of the fastest classes like SSM and SS), but still. Look at the San Diego national. Eventual runner up Schenker beat national SM champ Simyani by almost 2 seconds a run! Even ProSolo, which is certainly not playing to the strengths of a CSP car, Schenker is only losing to 1 SS car and 1 ASP car.
I don't know how light you can get FB legally, but I know that the miatas are in the 1800-1900 lb neighborhood, and most of them are on 275s or 255s. In theory, an 13b would be slightly more powerful than even a 1.8 VVL Miata engine, but I don't know that 10 or 20 hp is going to make a huge difference. I'm not saying you shouldn't try, but you will definitely have your work cut out for you. Prove me wrong! Please! Great driver in the right car, I'm not going to say its impossible. |
Well, I don't doubt that the competition would be much more fierce at the National level. But keep in mind, I'm currently running $50.00 tires and taking on Miatas on race rubber (not to mention the fact that one of them is supercharged).
I certainly wouldn't expect to walk in and take a win my first year. lol. But it's getting to the point where I'm consistently beating Miatas and S2000 cars (that are obviously not even in my class). Once I get a set of 255 Hoosiers on the car, I think she might have a fighting chance against the more highly prepared cars and better drivers. I might also consider installing the tri-link that's been sitting on the shelf for a couple of years now, but I'm still not sure if I will. The car already is handling so well, I just have to wonder how much better could it possibly get? Maybe it would be worth the trouble of installation, but I'm just not convinced yet. And I'm sure that some people will question the quality of the competition that I'm running against. All I can tell you is that we have some very experienced drivers and some amazing cars at our events. But of course, I won't have a genuine comparison until I actually start taking on the guys at the National level. So, maybe we'll see. :) I still have a lot to learn, but I think the car itself is ready for this. If my new partner works out, then it will probably happen for sure. He's been my best friend for two decades, and is a hell of a driver. His talent seems to be inborn or something, because he doesn't have any experience with competition. But he raced my car with me for the first time last year, and he finished only a second behind me. Best of all, he's got a great garage complete with a lift and air tools. And a vehicle that can tow a trailer. So financially, it would be great if he gets on board with me. One other thing, I will probably try to stay with the 12a rather than upgrade to a 13b. The 12a is what I've got now, and I've always said that I've never lost a race due to a lack of horsepower. But if something were to happen to my current engine, then I would certainly entertain the idea of an upgrade. Mostly it will come down to my driving, and how much I can learn to improve in that area. The car is definitely more capable than I am at this point. lol. I'm still playing catch-up! |
Originally Posted by Kentetsu
(Post 9496710)
Hey Mustang, that car was running both a watt's linkage and a tri-link? I always thought it was one or the other? Just curious.
13x9 wheels with the new Hoosier 255s would really be great. Hopefully I can afford something like that in the spring. Trying to keep up with these guys while running cheap tires is a lot of work! :) However, I wanted to get as good as I could on cheap tires before going back to the race rubber (I had a used set last year but they were only good for a couple of events). Regarding tires....over the Labor Day weekend I raced my car on Kumho Ecsta V700 235/45X13 tires. I ran them on 7" wide wheels. I have always wanted to try them but was concerned that they might be over-sized for my wheels. Any way....they were AWESOME! Incredible grip. The Tire Rack puts them on sale from time to time so you might want to try them. They would be even better on an 8" or 9" rim. Get them shaved if you order them. |
Thanks Scott! I wasn't even aware that they had Kuhmos in those sizes. I'll check them out for sure.
Running a 235 on a 7" rim, wow! I would not have expected that to work out for you. Although last year I was using 215 Sumitomos on the stock 5.5" wheels. Lots of sidewall bulge involved. :) |
I love this thread. This has been on my mind a lot lately.
I've got an FB that's getting a 13B-RE swap (got both car and engine for a steal), and it's a project first and racecar second. Recently, I've been looking into how the car would fare as an autocrosser. I know it'll do a lot better than my EM2 Civic. To the best of my interpretation, the car's going to fall in SSM with the -RE under the hood. I know that's like stepping into a heavier weight class by half an ounce, and I've already got a good idea of what I'm going to need to be semi-competitive. But it's good to read threads like this, it gives me some hope. I'm planning on running the widest wheels I can fit under the car and not rub. Until this thread, I wasn't aware two-way adjustable Konis were an option for this chassis... Anyone care to point me in the right direction? I thought Illuminas were the best we could get. Regardless, OP, thanks for letting my know my daydreams aren't completely insubstantial. |
Originally Posted by Kentetsu
(Post 9496913)
One other thing, I will probably try to stay with the 12a rather than upgrade to a 13b. The 12a is what I've got now, and I've always said that I've never lost a race due to a lack of horsepower. But if something were to happen to my current engine, then I would certainly entertain the idea of an upgrade. Mostly it will come down to my driving, and how much I can learn to improve in that area. The car is definitely more capable than I am at this point. lol. I'm still playing catch-up!
A 13B-DEI (S5 six-port) with stock intake (VDI, 6PI, throttle body mod), open exhaust (pre-silenced true dual), tuned with an Rtek ECU put down a consistent 170 - 180 RWHP. I'm not sure what a weber carb will buy you, but I'm curious to see the difference in torque and power curves. I think 190 RWHP might be possible by running 101 octane and leaning out the mixture; however, this is pure speculation since I've never tried it, and 101 isn't cheap (and neither is a blown engine). Either way, peak horsepower doesn't matter too much to me since I don't sit at 8000 RPM for very long if at all. |
Well, let's just say that if a good 13B dropped out of the sky and landed in my garage, I wouldn't hesitate to throw it in there. But there's a couple of things to keep in mind about this project of mine:
1. I have a wife and 3 kids. 2. This is my daily driver. 3. I work about 60 hours/week. 4. Because of all of the above, I have to be very budget concious. :) |
Originally Posted by Kentetsu
(Post 9499600)
Well, let's just say that if a good 13B dropped out of the sky and landed in my garage, I wouldn't hesitate to throw it in there. But there's a couple of things to keep in mind about this project of mine:
1. I have a wife and 3 kids. 2. This is my daily driver. 3. I work about 60 hours/week. 4. Because of all of the above, I have to be very budget concious. :) |
Thanks DamianSoul
That's also why this project has taken me 9 years to reach the point that it's at. Never enough time. But, it seems to be getting easier each year as the kids get older. I'll have to get them behind the wheel too in another few years. They're already asking about kart racing. :) |
Originally Posted by Kentetsu
(Post 9499087)
Thanks Scott! I wasn't even aware that they had Kuhmos in those sizes. I'll check them out for sure.
Running a 235 on a 7" rim, wow! I would not have expected that to work out for you. Although last year I was using 215 Sumitomos on the stock 5.5" wheels. Lots of sidewall bulge involved. :) I had run V700's in the 215/50 x 13 size in the past and liked them. They were not as good as the V710's turned out to be but still a fun tire to drive. But apparently an extra 20mm in tread width makes a huge difference. I was turning really fast lap times and running over the Mustangs, Porsches and Vipers in the twisty bits. There are several sites I watch on a regular basis. Tire Rack.com is one of them because you never know what you will see. I have gotten deals on Hoosiers and Kumhos in the past on their site. The other place to look is on Hoosier's web site. They are always selling discontinued tires cheap. Sometimes they have DOT's that I can use. I feel your pain when it comes to a budget. Club racing eats tires like crazy so I am always looking for a deal. I make it my mission to win races on the cheapest tires I can find!!! |
Originally Posted by DamianSoul
(Post 9499511)
You're probably right about your skill as a driver being the biggest factor, but I've always felt that a more powerful engine was one advantage that a 13B has over the 1.8. The national prepped Miatas are putting down around 150 RWHP, and they are very fast. I worked one of the faster sections at the Farmington National Tour, and every time Bill Schenker drove by his acceleration uphill was just unreal compared to the local CSP Miatas. The best local prepped CSP Miata weighed in at about 2100 lbs, and it looked quite slow through that section compared to Bill's Miata. Since the FB in CSP trim will probably weigh somewhere around 2100 - 2200 lbs, it seems like the extra horsepower can only help.
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No doubt the Miatas are incredible cars. But we look so much better! :)
I always joke that anyone can win in a Miata. Well, more like half joking. lol. I've met several Miata drivers who started out with RX7s, and all I hear is "I loved my car, right up until I drove a Miata for the first time".... |
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Wish I could find some better photos, but here's a shot of some of my competition. This is the supercharged Miata that I've been sparring with.
Also a couple shots of some other nice cars. I haven't beaten the Lotus on dry pavement yet (turbo, 450 whp), but he's only a couple seconds faster than me. I don't think I'll break into his territory until I get some decent rubber. :) |
No matter what I respect the Miata. I still see me in the furture becoming a Miata owner and still competing in my RX-7. I lived in Germany for 5 1/2 years and I always wodered why every other German driver owned a Miata. Incredible piece of machinery.
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No doubt. I would love to have that car (please don't tell my 7). It's like a force fed rollerskate, and a blast to watch. Hell of a nice guy, too. But I must beat that damn Miata! lol.
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Originally Posted by Unevolved
(Post 9499206)
Until this thread, I wasn't aware two-way adjustable Konis were an option for this chassis... Anyone care to point me in the right direction? I thought Illuminas were the best we could get. . |
As long as we are posting Miata kills, I got 2 SSM ones today, and a viper lol. http://www.phillyscca.com/solo2/index.html hopefully results will be up soon
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Nice work! Vipers are fun to watch trying to autocross; if they only had a little
more horsepower they might do alright. lol. Like trying to swat a fly with a sledge hammer. :) |
Thought this may warm the hearts of all FB autocrossers: See the CSP results
http://detroit-scca.org/e107/e107_fi...s_9-20-09a.pdf Jim Susko gave the CSP guys in the Detroit Region a lesson in his IT-7 FB. Sounded awesome too. All were using Hoosiers except #26. The 99 Miata in second was a Spec Miata race car. I was so excited to meet Jim and see his car in person. But really Jim is an excellent driver while no one else in his class has close to his ability. Vance Johnson, who was second, and I were always very close in times when I autocrossed my FB a few years back. I'm just average in driving ability so just saying its all about the driver. I regularly pound the ES Miatas but not when they are driven by a good driver. If you don't know who Jim Susko is, see here: http://www.gforceengineering.net/ |
Sweet deal! Thanks for the motivation Bruceman.
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Wow, I didn't know that Susko actually raced a 7 anymore. Very cool, wish I could have been there. :) You get any pics of his car?
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Check out the back of the Solo II rule book. I think Susko is in there a few times in DSP - a Fiat X19.
The double adjustable Koni's that we use are race strut inserts that require 2" strut tubes. You have to shorten the stock tubes and then chuck the spindle in a lathe. The negative with the double adjustable Konis is that one of adjustments is on the bottom of the strut so you have to pull the insert out to access that adjuster. I have been thinking about the FB vs Miata issue for the last few weeks. I had a chance to look at the fast Miatas at the 2008 Solo II Nationals. They were impressive and certainly very well driven. I don't think their speed was from horse power but rather I think the key was the tires they were running. The Miatas have the the ability to fit and use 13x10 wheels fitted with 255/40 x 13" tires. Putting a lot of rubber on the ground and being able to use it is what makes a car fast in a Solo II. When I was running in CP the big revolution in the class was the movement from small diameter (21 - 23") slicks on 10" wide wheels to taller (25"- 27") slicks on 12" wide wheels. Once the guys got enough suspension under their cars to use the bigger tires they could add more HP and the cars handled better. The result was that the CP cars went faster...allot faster. They also got allot more expensive but that is another issue. There are more examples of the affects of big tires in Solo II in the Stock classes. Again, when I was active I didn't get beat by too many stock class cars at Solo II Nationals. At one point I am pretty sure I finished in the top 5 in SS and beat all other Stock Classes based on time comparisons.....of course I was still 2-3 places out of the trophies in CP. Now, when you look at the results you see how incredibly fast allot of the stock cars are when compared to Street Prep and Prepared class cars. The difference is the size of the tires being fitted on cars from the factory and the fact that they have suspensions that can use the bigger tires. The biggest advantage that the Miata has it that it has a really good suspension. Put one on a lift....they are really cool cars. This means that putting on big tires and making them work is very possible with the Miata. The FB, on the other hand is not quite as blessed. It has a pretty good Mac Strut front end (compared to the crap under a mustang) but the stock rear suspension is a problem. A tri link helps but I think that you would also need to get creative with a set of traction bars that sort of replace the lower control arms and are in the correct geometry. This can be done but it is a grey area. So my final assesment is that for an FB to be competitive it will need to run as much rubber as the Miatas to use their HP advantage. Then you need to get springs, sway bars, dampers and traction aids to use the big tires. It would also help if one of the two course layouts you are asked to run allows an RX7 to get up to speed and not slow down too much. So, yes, an expertly driven, properly prepared FB runing fresh monster Hoosiers on the right course can win a National Championship. |
I currently have a set of Diamond Racing wheels that are 13x8. I am considering selling those off and moving up to 13x9 wheels, which would allow me to run the new monster Hoosiers (255/40/13).
I'm still not convinced that I will need to install my trilink/panhard setup (the car handles so damn good as it is right now), but that is another option that I am considering. I'm figuring that, although the National level Miatas will be very highly prepped, I think that the supercharged Miata I'm currently battling most of the time (which is very well prepared and driven) would at least hold its own against them. If that is an accurate statement (potentially, anyway), then I should be in pretty good shape. Last race I beat one of the two drivers of that car, and the race before that I beat both of them. And don't forget, that's with them on Hoosiers and me on Sumitomos. This is the only real "guage" that I've got to go by right now, and I think it's a pretty realistic one. My car might not be completely prepared for hitting the Nationals, and I'm probably not ready as a driver yet. But I think that both of those factors are getting close enough to being ready that I should start considering the possibility. Hell, if I get my arse handed to me when I start running the regionals, then I guess I'll know my answer sooner rather than later. :) |
Originally Posted by Kentetsu
(Post 9517824)
I currently have a set of Diamond Racing wheels that are 13x8. I am considering selling those off and moving up to 13x9 wheels, which would allow me to run the new monster Hoosiers (255/40/13).
I'm still not convinced that I will need to install my trilink/panhard setup (the car handles so damn good as it is right now), but that is another option that I am considering. I'm figuring that, although the National level Miatas will be very highly prepped, I think that the supercharged Miata I'm currently battling most of the time (which is very well prepared and driven) would at least hold its own against them. If that is an accurate statement (potentially, anyway), then I should be in pretty good shape. Last race I beat one of the two drivers of that car, and the race before that I beat both of them. And don't forget, that's with them on Hoosiers and me on Sumitomos. This is the only real "guage" that I've got to go by right now, and I think it's a pretty realistic one. My car might not be completely prepared for hitting the Nationals, and I'm probably not ready as a driver yet. But I think that both of those factors are getting close enough to being ready that I should start considering the possibility. Hell, if I get my arse handed to me when I start running the regionals, then I guess I'll know my answer sooner rather than later. :) Whether or not you are ready or have the ability to compete is something you cannot know until you have been there. Everyone has to have a first time. Wondering or speculating about where you might place isn't what you should be thinking about. You go for the experience and the learning opportunity. To be honest with you, unless you are comparing yourself to drivers that go to Nationals and have run on the new site you have no way to know how well you will do. But again....that should not be your concern or focus. What I mean by learning opportunity is that you will have the ability to look over all of the car in your class during impound. Despite the fact that most of them will be Miatas and Hondas you can learn an incredible amount by just looking, listening and asking questions. There will be other classes you can look at too that you can learn from as well. It is like going to Autox University! Also you can meet with tire reps and maybe even some shock reps and find out what they have to offer. By the way, if you are buying new tires before National you can usually buy them at the event site and save yourself tax and shipping charges. I bought a set of Kumhos that way and saved a little cash. My write up is what I believe a max effort FB will have to have to win. Your results may differ....but you will not know unless you go! |
Originally Posted by mustanghammer
(Post 9517178)
Check out the back of the Solo II rule book. I think Susko is in there a few times in DSP - a Fiat X19.
The double adjustable Koni's that we use are race strut inserts that require 2" strut tubes. You have to shorten the stock tubes and then chuck the spindle in a lathe. The negative with the double adjustable Konis is that one of adjustments is on the bottom of the strut so you have to pull the insert out to access that adjuster. |
Even if you can't do nationals next year, try to run Peru or Toledo. You'll get a real good feel for how you running on a national level at those events.
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Originally Posted by Unevolved
(Post 9518214)
Any further information you could give me on this setup would be much appreciated. That sounds like something I want to try, I think it'd be worth it, and it sounds within my capabilities.
1. Starting with a strut from a 84/85 FB (they have bigger/stronger spindles) all but about 5" of the strut tube is cut off. 2. The strut is then chucked into a lathe using what is left of the strut tube. This allows the bore of the strut tube that runs through the spindle to bored out from the bottom. 3. The strut tube bore is opened up so that the new 2" strut tube is a tight but not a tolerance fit with a depth of about 4" or so. 4. Once bottom bore is done, the strut is removed from the lathe chuck and the rest of the old tube is cut off. 5. The the spindle is put back in the lathe - this time it is chucked using the bore that was cut in the bottom of the strut tube. 6. The remaining strut tube bore is opened up to fit the new 2" strut tube. 7. When the strut tube bore is finished the spindle is placed on a mill and the spindle to streering arm bolt bosses are spot faced so that a lock nut can be used on the bolts that attach the spindle to the steering arm. 8. A bottom cap is machined on the lathe - the strut tube has to have a bottom. Santa Fe Garage cuts a tapper into the bottom cap to help center the strut cartridge and a hole is put in the center for adjuster clearance 9. A Spring Perch is machined to fit the stut tube 10. The new strut tube is inserted into the bored out spindle and tig welded into place. 11. The Spring Perch is tig welded into place on the strut tube 12. The bottom cap is tig welded into the into the bottom of new strut tube. If a geometry correction spacer is going to be used on the bottom of the strut, we mig or tig weld them to the bottom of the spindle as well. I beleive that Susko sells these on an exchange basis. We source the strut tubes and Koni Strut inserts from www.kcraceware.com. The tubes come in various lengths and need to be matched to the length of the strut insert you are planning on using You can contact Santa Fe Garage at www.santafegarage.com |
Great info Scott! I saw this shock setup on the Gforce website, but at $1,300 bucks I'd have to sell one of my kids in order to afford it. :) Didn't much like the fact that you have to pull the insert to make one of the adjustements either.
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Originally Posted by Kentetsu
(Post 9520249)
Great info Scott! I saw this shock setup on the Gforce website, but at $1,300 bucks I'd have to sell one of my kids in order to afford it. :) Didn't much like the fact that you have to pull the insert to make one of the adjustements either.
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Originally Posted by mustanghammer
(Post 9519601)
Here is how we do it at Santa Fe Garage.
1. Starting with a strut from a 84/85 FB (they have bigger/stronger spindles) all but about 5" of the strut tube is cut off. 2. The strut is then chucked into a lathe using what is left of the strut tube. This allows the bore of the strut tube that runs through the spindle to bored out from the bottom. 3. The strut tube bore is opened up so that the new 2" strut tube is a tight but not a tolerance fit with a depth of about 4" or so. 4. Once bottom bore is done, the strut is removed from the lathe chuck and the rest of the old tube is cut off. 5. The the spindle is put back in the lathe - this time it is chucked using the bore that was cut in the bottom of the strut tube. 6. The remaining strut tube bore is opened up to fit the new 2" strut tube. 7. When the strut tube bore is finished the spindle is placed on a mill and the spindle to streering arm bolt bosses are spot faced so that a lock nut can be used on the bolts that attach the spindle to the steering arm. 8. A bottom cap is machined on the lathe - the strut tube has to have a bottom. Santa Fe Garage cuts a tapper into the bottom cap to help center the strut cartridge and a hole is put in the center for adjuster clearance 9. A Spring Perch is machined to fit the stut tube 10. The new strut tube is inserted into the bored out spindle and tig welded into place. 11. The Spring Perch is tig welded into place on the strut tube 12. The bottom cap is tig welded into the into the bottom of new strut tube. If a geometry correction spacer is going to be used on the bottom of the strut, we mig or tig weld them to the bottom of the spindle as well. I beleive that Susko sells these on an exchange basis. We source the strut tubes and Koni Strut inserts from www.kcraceware.com. The tubes come in various lengths and need to be matched to the length of the strut insert you are planning on using You can contact Santa Fe Garage at www.santafegarage.com And one thing I can't grasp from your instructions is how the damper is held into the knuckle when it's all said and done. It seems like, from how I understand it, that under full droop the whole assembly would come apart. Sorry for being a little slow with this, I work better with diagrams. :) |
Originally Posted by Unevolved
(Post 9523017)
That's good to know, I'll have to look into that. Excuse my noobish question, but is there a specific damper length I'd need? And I'm guessing there's no major fitment problems with double-adjustable dampers in the rear (at least not to the same extent), but which rear dampers are used?
And one thing I can't grasp from your instructions is how the damper is held into the knuckle when it's all said and done. It seems like, from how I understand it, that under full droop the whole assembly would come apart. Sorry for being a little slow with this, I work better with diagrams. :) The finished product bolts into place the same way that the stock part does. The only difference is that the strut tube is a bigger diameter so that you can run strut inserts with larger diameter pistons. These struts will dampen higher spring rates than anything that is available to fit the stock diameter strut tube. That is the whole reason for this mod. If you don't plan on running really stiff springs on the front....like over 450lbs then a set of Illuminas will work fine. The strut insert is held in the strut tube with a cap that threads into the 2" strut tube - just like the stocker. Sorry, no diagrams, photos, etc at this time. The cheapest double adjustable rear shock is a Koni Sport made for a Fox Mustang. They basically bolt in and have adjuster at the bottom for rebound and one at the top for compression. This is what KC Raceware and Santa Fe Garage use on the backs of there E Production cars. Charlie at KC Raceware gets them for us....contact him. |
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well i am not race in autocross any more. but the the race track i race now is a lot like autocross...
i think one big point of autocross is Tire !!!!. who can fit widest and newest tires have more chance of getting better result.. this is down size of SA if you are runing GSL-SE brake you cant fit 13 inch wheel. and using 15 inch wheel require a lot of work to fit 255 hoosier into it ;) here are some video and picture to cheer you up a bit. https://www.rx7club.com/attachment.p...1&d=1254387253 As some guys might know. i have a 1981 MAZDA RX-7. That i nick name it to HSF (stand for Honda S2000 Fighter. At recenly locoal Time attack event. I was award to Fastest Street Tires car of that day.... :) I was .3 sec faster then sec place car. which is S2000 :) Feeling pretty good for a 30 years old car to get such result some thing i have change when i ship HSF to ASIA. a 4.7 Final drive. and 195/50/15 Toyo R1R. way too narrow for my HSF. but that is also one of more reasonable tire to get here http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3b51QXY5C1k I am consider to buy a 3 link set here from usa. cause as you seen in video. most of turn i am going side way. a lot of reason is my power. poor suspension from mazda and also ha some of turn in this track is Bank.......which made it pretty hard to drive in my opion |
I still drool over your car man. :) Great videos too. Nice to see these cars out there humiliating the Miatas and S2000s....
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well, i don't know if it was driver skill or what but i killed a r33 skyline on saturday by 2 seconds.
also i'm running single adjustable koni yellows in the front, drop in fit, also have the part number 8641-1072-SPORT have fun |
Good info on the shocks. I'm happy with my Illuminas right now, but maybe down the road when they wear out I'll have to look at the benefits of an upgrade.
And nice kill on the Skyline dude! Those things are monsters. I got to play with one at the Tail of the Dragon meet last spring and had a great time... :) |
Originally Posted by Kentetsu
(Post 9575847)
Good info on the shocks. I'm happy with my Illuminas right now, but maybe down the road when they wear out I'll have to look at the benefits of an upgrade.
And nice kill on the Skyline dude! Those things are monsters. I got to play with one at the Tail of the Dragon meet last spring and had a great time... :) |
Originally Posted by Bruceman
(Post 9512948)
Thought this may warm the hearts of all FB autocrossers: See the CSP results
http://detroit-scca.org/e107/e107_fi...s_9-20-09a.pdf Jim Susko gave the CSP guys in the Detroit Region a lesson in his IT-7 FB. Sounded awesome too. All were using Hoosiers except #26. The 99 Miata in second was a Spec Miata race car. I was so excited to meet Jim and see his car in person. But really Jim is an excellent driver while no one else in his class has close to his ability. Vance Johnson, who was second, and I were always very close in times when I autocrossed my FB a few years back. I'm just average in driving ability so just saying its all about the driver. I regularly pound the ES Miatas but not when they are driven by a good driver. If you don't know who Jim Susko is, see here: http://www.gforceengineering.net/ |
I think your selling yourself short, Kentetsu.
I've seen him drive quite a few times and it's almost scary (the night run at the Dragon comes to mind) how good he is at making that little car of his do what he wants it to. Especially on the Sumi's. While a good tire for the price, they are still an economical summer street tire. Far from a race tire. They are actually pretty decent in light snow with full tread too. With race tires you'd be shaving seconds off your times, and nailing FTD every time. Once Sterling works out a solution for the stock manifolds you'll have even more power than you need. I would suggest you make a serious effort to get to the next nationals. Hell since I'm missing DGRR10 I'd even make the trek out to see you compete. You'll never know just how good the car is until you take it there. There you'll have a chance to really evaluate the car and find out if you need the panhard/tri-link or not. For serious competition I think a harness and racing seat would help a lot. I noticed in my videos that even with the belt tight I seem to get tossed around quite a bit, which is why I hold the shifter so much. Some gloves too, for those hot humid days when your hands get a little slippery. While there is always some improvements to be made (even F1 drivers screw up) I'd find it hard to believe anyone else could just hop in your car and know it's limits any better than you. |
Cut it out Chris, you're making me blush! :) Get yer darned car back on the road already!!!
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You can compete with a miata, but it takes some work. I autoX in sports prep. I finished 2nd in points theis season and all season I was chasing this guy in his spec miata. 108whp on toyo r888's. It took me learning my car and kumho710's to finally beat him on the final race of the season. I'm finally getting pretty fast in my car, and I think there's still a ton of speed in the car that I havent been able to get out of it yet.
https://www.rx7club.com/nw-rx-7-forum-33/wow-adrian-hot-today-track-868116/ My car: 190whp S313B w/ 12A Y center iron. cleaned up ports. Custom RE,ISC, HP42K exhaust. Weber 48IDA, Crane HI6R DF ignition w/ FC coil. Hi6 on trailing, Mazdatrix camber plates, REspeed coilovers 300/200 springs, Tokico mr2 struts in front, kyb gas-a-just rear, stock front swaybar, no rear swaybar. hawk HP+ pads, custom master cylender brace, FC radiator, front mount oil cooler, |
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