ABS Removal?
Hi,
I've had a brake issue over the last few months and have changed quite a few parts including the booster, front calipers, soft lines to the calipers, and the master cylinder. The issue is a soft pedal or lack of torque when braking. I need my brakes for the track and my next step would be to switch out the ABS pump or delete the ABS all together. So, I need input from you track guys, what should I do? Keep ABS or delete it? Thanks |
fyi - 2MCHPWR had some ABS issues and has a few threads on troubleshooting. Might want to read some of his threads on the topic.
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Thanks I will. I am unsure if it is the ABS but its one of the last points in my brake system that may be the issue plus it would be another failure point to take out of the system. Any thoughts regarding keeping ABS or removing it?
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Originally Posted by Specter328
(Post 9636351)
Thanks I will. I am unsure if it is the ABS but its one of the last points in my brake system that may be the issue plus it would be another failure point to take out of the system. Any thoughts regarding keeping ABS or removing it?
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Is this on an FD? The FD system is pretty good, you should keep if if you can. If your pedal is soft you might not be getting all of the air out, especially if you didn't bench bleed the new master properly. Or does the pedal get soft? That could point to a cooling problem or a bad choice in brake fluid.
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Originally Posted by Specter328
(Post 9636310)
The issue is a soft pedal or lack of torque when braking.
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The pedal is soft all the time all the time, on track, off track, hot brakes, cold brakes, not matter what. The MC was properly bled. How about the proportioning valve? Could that be bad?
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I have a track FD that I run in SCCA ITE. It has the ABS removed and I haven't had any breaking issues that aren't pilot related errors.
I know another local FD racer who has kept his ABS but relocated it to the passenger footbox area to avoid the high temperature zone near the turbos. |
Originally Posted by Specter328
(Post 9637759)
The pedal is soft all the time all the time, on track, off track, hot brakes, cold brakes, not matter what. The MC was properly bled. How about the proportioning valve? Could that be bad?
When's the last time you bled the brakes? And did a full flush? What fluid? |
Originally Posted by gkmccready
(Post 9638509)
Soft pedal means something in the system is compressing. Typically it's air somewhere, potentially it's a flex line going bad or something leaking (could be a pin prick leak). Do a complete brake flush and pay close attention when you bleed the calipers for *any* bubbles -- use a clear tube so you can see them. Unless the prop valve or MC is leaking they shouldn't be causing you a soft pedal.
When's the last time you bled the brakes? And did a full flush? What fluid? |
I'd keep it as well. The point that Fritz was making above was just driven home by Finger Lock when he said the only issue they have had with ABS removal has been driver error... which is why when slowing from 150mph-50mph, ABS is a nice little something extra to have in your hip pocket just in case :). I have followed your numerous threads and know you have went through almost everything in your entire system. I know it has to be extremely frustrating. I do have a question, had you done any brake work when this issue first showed up? Can you tell us when and how it started? ie on the track or "just got in my car to drive one day and the pedal was spongy" etc, etc...
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Originally Posted by Specter328
(Post 9638682)
Could there be air trapped in the ABS unit that I have yet to get out or see any trace of?
Edit: Guys without the TechII for their Corvette have reported success with putting the car on jackstands or on a lift and cycling the ABS. Doing a bleed. And repeating. Doing it in the air really lets you cycle the valves whereas trying to do it on the street can be problematic. |
Originally Posted by memphisraines82
(Post 9638734)
I'd keep it as well. The point that Fritz was making above was just driven home by Finger Lock when he said the only issue they have had with ABS removal has been driver error... which is why when slowing from 150mph-50mph, ABS is a nice little something extra to have in your hip pocket just in case :). I have followed your numerous threads and know you have went through almost everything in your entire system. I know it has to be extremely frustrating. I do have a question, had you done any brake work when this issue first showed up? Can you tell us when and how it started? ie on the track or "just got in my car to drive one day and the pedal was spongy" etc, etc...
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Originally Posted by gkmccready
(Post 9638753)
Could be. My TII doesn't have ABS, but I had a friend with it and recall the bleed procedure for the ABS unit was unexpected. C5 and C6 Corvettes need to use a TechII to cycle the ABS valves to get a full bleed done. You might try using a Motive Pressure Bleeder to see if that's enough to force fluid through the valves. My shop manual is at the, well, shop, so I can't dig through it for you... sorry.
Edit: Guys without the TechII for their Corvette have reported success with putting the car on jackstands or on a lift and cycling the ABS. Doing a bleed. And repeating. Doing it in the air really lets you cycle the valves whereas trying to do it on the street can be problematic. |
Are you loosing any fluid?
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Originally Posted by Specter328
(Post 9638893)
I would like to keep it but I'm really getting to the end of my patience, braking just before brake markers even start is getting old.
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Originally Posted by memphisraines82
(Post 9638943)
Are you loosing any fluid?
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What kind of replacement parts did you use? new? used?
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The booster was a low mile used one as were the front calipers, the lines were new, and the master cylinder was a "new" rebuilt one I got from NAPA.
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I would try a different *new* MC before anything else (unless you already have).
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Originally Posted by Mahjik
(Post 9640591)
I would try a different *new* MC before anything else (unless you already have).
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The old MC was replaced with the remanufactured 929 MC after the problem had begun. It was not rebuilt, I should have said remanufactured.
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Booster shouldn't play a role in the pedal feel when the car is off, right?
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Nope, this is only when the car is running. When the car is off the booster does nothing.
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Replace it with a '99 spec ABS?
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