lt10s and 4x box starting issues
 

Hi guys, I’ve been struggling to start my 13bt fullbridge port. (Pineapple racing template)
ive had this issue for some time now and I always thought it was low compression.
ive now had the rotors lightened, Irons lapped, housing refinished, solid dowels, 10mm studs and the whole rotating assembly balanced up.
im super confident in the motor itself but I’m still getting the start up issue. The ecu is as described in the title and I’m using it with 4x 1000cc grams injectors and four stock trailing coils.
I bought the ecu second hand so I have started from scratch with the map.
Time for the actual issue.
the car will crank fine seeing 320rpm on the micro but never really catch and start. If I crank it for some time while taking fuel out of the crank map I can get it to finally start after 30mins of trying sometimes. Once she’s running she will idle at 12.5 aft and I’ve been out driving and messed with the map so she will run nice I will get back home turn her off leave the car five mins come back and she will fire up after a good few cranks but most of the time she will crank and flood. Most of my cranking map is in the minus settings and my mixtrm is 0.
when wiring up the microtech I used a lot of the factory wiring as it never came with a loom.
now I’m thinking of redoing the loom completely from scratch as I bought a second lt10s cheap and I’ve swapped the map Over and tried that ecu which is the one that was supplied with the x4 and it seemed a little better but I still ended up cranking for ages and eventually flooding the car. I’m going through plugs like mad too. She only really starts on fresh plugs.

part of me is thinking it’s just the map,
I’ve double checked injector wiring as I thought I may have mixed up a primary with a secondary but everything is correct.
now thinking I should just rewire the whole thing before I buy another new microtech.

hope I’ve given someone a clear enough picture to offer some ideas.

Can you post your startup and load maps? As well as temp maps?

Based on your description, you don't have enough fuel while cranking. What is your injector PW while cranking?

You could play with the crank map subtracting fuel to see if it helps, also have an eye on the output ms value to see how much fuel it is injecting when cranking, in my car it seems to like -30% when hot starting and at most +10% when cold in the crank map for it to start fast on 550cc stock primary injectors (Puerto Rico hot wheather)

I will write up all the figures this afternoon and post.
My crank map currently are all in the minus figures apart from 68 upward.
many of the base maps I found on here will flood it out in a heartbeat. It’s currently starting the best it ever has but it’s still 30second plus while pumping the throttle.

I have currently put a timing light on it with the timing check on. I’ve set the cas at TDC as I didn’t want to have to subtract 5 from my timing map.
I have a Gilmer pulley so no timing marks. So I fitted the pulley that was with the car when I bought it. Worked out tdc on the original pulley set it to the pin and swapped out my pulley for the gilmer.
then set the cas so the dot and the stalk on the cas line up make a note of the inside.
then stab the cas and adjust so it’s lined up to the were I made my note.

checked with a timing light and it seems about 40 degrees advanced. Could there be something a miss. I’ve double checked wiring and redone the whole engine loom as I had previously just spliced into the factory loom.

So I have now confirmed without doubt that my timing is set at tdc. Checked with a new timing light and got her bang on the marks.
car has been starting a lot better recently. First turn of the key she will crank for 3 seconds without a splutter then fire straight up and die. Then I will try again and she will cough and splitter into life sometimes sounds choked up untill the revs pick up and it clears up. But we are heading in the right direction now. Just about to write up the settings in the microtech.

Idle
30 hg = 0.86
24 hg = 1.00
18 hg = 1.10
12 hg = 1.71
6 hg = 1.71
0 hg = 2.05
2psi = 4.95
to
28psi =4.95


load
30 hg = 1.00
24 hg = 1.00
18 hg = 1.33
12 hg = 1.95
6 hg = 2.48
0 hg = 3.24
2psi = 4.29
4psi = 4.81
8psi = 5.43
10psi = 6.10


Pump Amt = +05%
pump pulse = +07
pump trig = + 14
pump 1 stop = 00hg
pump 2 start = 3000
pump 2 Amt = +30%
pump 2 time = +10
pump 2 trig = +16
pump 2 stop = 00hg
pump 1 adv = +05
pump 2 adv = +05
Pump dwell = 4.00
pump timers = no
pump sync = no
pump spare = + 08
pump cold = + 00%

mixtrm = 00%
tps cal = 43%
timtrm = +00
static = +00
timmax = +28
af_ste = +05%
rev stg = 3000
map stg = 02hg
%stage = 50%
dwell = 3.50
maps = matrix
config = 4 cyl
firing= sequential
load = map
Dwell = time base
input trig = +pos
spark trig = igbt
timing check= off

water map

124 = 0
99 = 0
82 = 0
68 = 0
60= +3%
46 = +5%
38 = +6%
31 = +7%
28 = +8%
18 = +12%
11 = +15%
5 = +36%
-01 = +41%
-09 = +48%
-17 = +48%
-25 = + 48%

crank where it gets weird.

124 = 0
99 = 0
82 = 0
68 = 0
60 = -07%
46 = -10%
38 = -12%
31 = -14%
28 = -16%
18 = -22%
11 = -25%
5 = -28%
-01 = 0
-09 = 0
-17 = 0
-25 = 0




air_temp = all zero

T_ Air = all zero

T_wat map = all zero

T_rpm = all +25


T_gap

500 = +15
1000 = +15
1500 = +15
2000 = +14
2500 = +12
3000 = +10
all = +10


T_map

30hg= 00
24hg= +03
18hg= +03
12hg= +03
6hg= +02
0hg = +00
2psi = -02
4psi = -04
8psi = -08
10psi = -12
14psi = -14
16psi = -16
18psi = -18
20psi = -20
24psi = -20
28psi = -20

T_inj map

500= 120
1000= 150
1500= 150
2000= 150
4000= 150
4500= 180
5000= 210
5500= 210
6000= 240
7000= 270
8000= 270
9000= 270

I noticed that your Microtech is currently set in 'matrix mode' - "maps = matrix"

Are you using a laptop or hand controller? If you're using a hand controller, it's likely the unit is missing most of the entries in the matrix table.

Trying switching "maps = matrix" to "maps = normal" to get it running well first. Other than that, your crank and water maps needs a bit of work.

Thanks. I’m using a laptop. After some tweeks and Stopping myself from giving any throttle input untill it had actually fired up. It’s starting better than it ever has. I’ve messed with the crank and water map and it’s getting there, wish this lockdown would be lifted slightly.

so the current situation is I prime my pump and turn the key the car turns over for aBout 5 seconds then it catches and fires straight up. It will die straight away I start it again and the same will happen normally the second or third try it will idle fine. It only does this when cold.

New crank and water maps.

crank
124= 00%
99= 00%
82 = 00%
68 = 00%
60= -06%
45 = -05%
38 = -02%
31= 00%
24= 02%
18= 05%
11= 07%
05 = 09%
-01 = 00%

water
124-68 all zero
60 = 03%
46 = 05%
38 = 06 %
31= 07 %
24 = 08%
18 = 12%
11= 15%
05 = 36%
-01 to -25 = 48%

You need more fuel. :) It takes a lot of fuel to start a bridgeport because it pulls almost no vacuum. Increase all crank and water numbers by 10% and see if it starts easier.

Will try it when I next start her up.

Added 10% to the water and crank, she keyed up and died then wouldn’t start again.
put everything back to how it was and just added 1% to the water map as it did respond better once I’d got it started. Will work slowly to see how it goes.

Well I’ve put everything back to how it was and it’s not starting again now. If I crank it over it just cranks only try’s to start right at the beginning after that it just cranks as if there’s no spark. I give it some gas and she then start to at least sound like it wants to start. May be flooded but I can get my head round why it would be if I have barely any % in the crank and water maps.