help me pick my audio setup
 

i was looking to get infinity kappas but after hearing my friends polk momo's i think ive changed my mind. and i was looking at a jvc arsenal KD-AR400 as a head unit. ive already got two kenwood 10" subs. ive got about $600-700 to play with here. any opinions on this setup and could someone point me towards a good amp?

thanks,
russ

I dont know, but whatever you get make sure it plays MP3s....they are great!

i'm not an expert, but i personally don't like jvc units. i guess if you get a good one it should be all right, but deffinately don't get a cheap one. i am running mtx amps. i like them a lot and they are very affordable. look at ebay. you can get some good deals. $700 should be enough to get an amp for the subs, an amp for your component speakers (polk speakers are awesome) and some good speakers. just remember that good rca wires and good amp kits are pretty expensive. deffinately don't go the cheap way. you will regret it in the future.

thats what ive been hearing from friends about jvc units that they tend to skip somewhat...but all my friends that have jvc units have the cheap ones. im thinking i should look else were since i dont feel like getting a shitty headunit and have to replace it down the road. ill look into mtx amps thanks bro :) yea i dont plan on half assing anything wiring is too much of a bitch to have to redo

I'd opt to get the kappas over the polks. As for the amp to power the components, my top choices are zapco and mcintosh (or anything with a low THD%---I think zapco's lower models are as low as .03%). Expect to pay about $1 per watt for amps this clean.
For the subs, you could go with something less expensive since all you need is raw power. Remember to look mainly at the RMS power and not peak. My little brother just picked up a 1600W max / 900W RMS x 1 @ 2 ohms Sony amp for about $180 on ebay. From what I hear, amps are the only respectable things Sony makes for car audio.
Hope this helps.

thanks for the advice..why do you say kappas' over polks? the polks to me sounded really good.

I heard the Polk Momo pickup and it REALLY sounded like ass. If they can't make their own show car sound good, how are their speakers supposed to sound good?

The Kappas, if you put an amp on them, sound like speakers that cost twice as much.

Blake

Like what infinitebass said, if you run an amp through the kappas, it sounds so crisp and clear, when you really turn up the volume, it hurts your ears.

kappas are koo..but have u looked into alpine???

type r's??

or spx???

thats wut i have..and amplified by a mrvf540 4 ch from alpine also

wow its greats lots of highs and mids

i also have a type r sub (12')

hehe for more bass

mike

I got a set o Alpine type r's (5 1/4 components) they sound real good. No amp getting pushed from an alpine deck. A pair of cheap 5X7's in the real and 2 10's in the rear. I can't bitch about the type R's. But i still wish i had Infinity Kappas. My old 88 had kappas everywhere and u couldn't beat the clarity from them...

Carl

i ordered my infinity kappas' last nite. still havent desided on my headunit...but i dont think it'll be jvc anymore i like the alpine CDA-9820XM. im probably gunna get a mtx 250watt amp for my speakers and a some cheap sony amp for my subs

Good call, you'll like it!

Blake

Go with a PPI PC 650, this is a bad ass amp that will run your whole system. Oh i just remembered, I have one for sale.. https://www.rx7club.com/forum/showth...hreadid=280059

Sorry for the cheap advertising...

get pioneer, or eclipse. Get 1 W7 and crush all!

Right...you're gonna recommend some Xtant amps too, right? Cause JL Audio and Xtant, the audiophile's setup!

Bleh.

Blake

make sure you get something that plays mp3's. even if you can't burn mp3's yourself, surely you know someone who does. you will like it a lot.

Check out the sony color unit - on sale at crutchfield.

I also have a pioneer head unit (model number DEH -P8500M) for sale - asking 400.

Used it for about 2 months. Everything is MINT - includes original box and everything. Even comes w/ a 4 year replacement warranty from BestBuy. Comes w/ the RX7 adapter as well. Just plug it in and go!

Unbelievable unit - im going eclipse or color sony!

Check it out here!

http://www.circuitcity.com/detail.js...qp=0&oid=72450

You can see other pics of it closed at:

http://www.tweeter.com/product/index...entPage=family

Let me know!

Go Eclipse, it has the fastest mp3 load and read times of anything out there. If you like looks over performance I wouldn't reccomend eclipse but it will sound just as good as the Alpines and function easier and faster. Infinity Kappas= good choice. You should get a digital amp for them. I have the reference's hooked up to an Alpine digital amp and it's the smoothest thing you'll ever hear. By the way Eclipse has some nice subs too, but I personally like audiobahn or Visonik(same co.)

defied, have you ever tried audiobahn amps? you always have a lot of input in the sound system department. the subs seem cool and i have heard a lot of good things about them. their amps just look really fake. they also rate their amps weird. they will advertise a 600 watt 2 channel amp, but it will be 600 watts bridged at 1 ohm. that makes it seem a lot higher then it actually is. are there even 1 ohm speakers out there? maybe i just don't understand but i have never seen them. all the speakers in my system are 4 ohm. anyway, the amps look cheesy but the subs sound cool. i really like the component speakers. i have those in my car.

defied, have you ever tried audiobahn amps? you always have a lot of input in the sound system department. the subs seem cool and i have heard a lot of good things about them. their amps just look really fake. they also rate their amps weird. they will advertise a 600 watt 2 channel amp, but it will be 600 watts bridged at 1 ohm. that makes it seem a lot higher then it actually is. are there even 1 ohm speakers out there? maybe i just don't understand but i have never seen them. all the speakers in my system are 4 ohm. anyway, the amps look cheesy but the subs sound cool. i really like the component speakers. i have those in my car.

This is what I am talking about, a lot of amps make crazy claims of power. You can run subs at 1 ohm, but the amp probably isn't stable at 1 ohm. This will also increase the thermal distortion. Get a high quality amp, just remember, you get what you pay for.

i'm not saying at all that audiobahn doesn't have quality amps. i wuold rather have a high quality low watt amp than a low quality high watt amp. audiobahn amps' wattage is lower than advertised, but what about the quality?600 watts x1 at 1 ohm would actually be more like 100 watts x 2 at 4 ohms. that isn't that bad if it is good quality and you aren't looking for more than that. can anyone actually comment on the quality of audiobahn amps? i like the component speakers and subs. i would consider using them if anyone has anything good to say about them.

Um...its possible to make an amp run 600 watts at both 1 ohm and two ohms. Kind of like you can get competition amps that will put out < 10 watts at 4 ohms, but put out > 2500 watts at 1 ohm.

Generally speaking, you won't EVER see "wide" claims about wattage. Why? Because its illegal. Most amps you see are either rated at 12V or 14.4V. Makes a huge difference too. For example, my MTX amps came with a sheet signed by a tech saying exactly how much power was measure. The difference between the two voltages can be 1/3 of the 12V rating.

I usually don't comment much on audio, because it usually turns into a two page tutorial, but this is how I break it down:

Head Unit: Don't spend a lot. Get one with 4V preouts if you want a decent one, and make sure it has at least two sets (Sub and Main) preouts. If you want to spend a lot, spend A LOT. Ala Pioneer Premier's head unit, costing $1000+. 90% of the time you buy a more expensive headunit, you're paying for features, not quality. BTW, if you ARE looking for quality look for the best D/A converter. But I think the head unit matter much less than the rest where quality is concerned.

Speakers: You get what you pay for, except the Infinity sets are usually a better value. I.E., I was at Fry's, and was letting my g/f listen to the Sony Xplod's that her sister wanted to get her. Then, I pressed the button for the Infinity References. $10 more, and even she was astounded at how much better they sounded. The number one thing that makes speakers sound good is an amp. You are really wasting money on speakers if you don't have an amp.

Amp: Anything with a low THD is going to sound good. You won't be able to tell a huge difference between most major brands. Just get something you've heard of. MTX, Audiobahn, Sony, JBL, etc.

Subs: Get what you pay for, again. Look for one that has a lower sensitivity, and if you can get graphs of their frequency response, look for the flattest one for sound quality. And always remember, there is generally a trade off between how loud it is and its sound quality. The longer the excursion, generally the worse quality.

And please always remember, too MUCH power to a sub or set of speakers is better than too LITTLE!

And consider what you have to compare it to. Probably a stock system. Anything, even if its not expensive will sound better than what you're probably used to. You can be VERY happy with a pretty low cost system. Its kind of like the law of diminishing returns. Once you get that first upgrade out of the way, the next ones usually aren't nearly the same.

As I said though, Infinity makes some great stuff, and you can get them off eBay CHEAP. As in, about as cheap as you could get them if you bought them directly from Infinity (I.E. if you were an employee and buying them).

I don't know much about JBL's amps, but they are owned by Harmon, who also owns Infinity. I bet they're decent and pretty good price too.

Blake

thanks, that helped a lot! i can't wait to buy some more stuff.

Here is a quick tip; if your going to bridge make sure your amp wattage is significantly lower than your subs' wattage. This will create a cool effect (make sure you have high quality sub, 2-4 ohms depending on how much power your going to be putting out). With more watts going through 1-1.5 ohms it will punch alot more and can easily blow your sub. This is why you get a more powerful sub than your amp. You can create the sound that 1-1.5 ohms creates while having enough control over it to keep your equipment in fine shape.

ie. I have a pathfinder with 4-channel 1000w amp from Visonik. I was able to take 2, 1200w 12", 4 ohm subs bridge each of them between 2 channels. The Subs I have are dual voice coils for my subs, I'm not really sure why this effected my ohms but, I ended up running a 1000w amp over 1.5 ohms to a 12" 1200w sub....boom!

RX-7ames- I've never used the amps from Audiobahn but I think I know what your talking about (chrome flames). I think they just did it to keep the same look going with their subs. I've heard them and they sound fine, I guess. I just think you can spend less for the same results.

Um, like I said, you're more likely to blow a speaker by running less power than more. How were they wired up deified?

Blake

From what I understand:When changing your ohms you are increasing the current your using by a cetain percentage. The guy said something about bridging his amps channels. I was saying "IF" you are going to bridge you should use a less powerful amp because your changing that current to the speaker. If the amp is continually giving the sub more watts than it can handle it will eventually give out, or burn out. So, I guess I don't really understand, when you say give it more power. How do you blow a speaker with less power from an amp? I don't think I've heard that before. Isn't the speaker designed to take a certain amount of power (peak wattage) and has an ideal wattage to use? Like mine is 800w-1200w peak. so I have a 4-channel 1000w bridged 2 channels per sub. This would actually put my power below 800w. I haven't had any problems and I use the hell out of them. I may have missed something here so please explain it to me again. I don't mind taking critisism as long as someone can explain what I've done wrong. Thanks.

This is usually more noticeable when running mids and highs, and doesn't apply as much to subs, since they are more forgiving.

What happens, and this usually occurs when running speakers off of a head unit, is when you push the power of the source, whether its the head unit or an amp, it goes into clipping. I don't know how much you know about audio, but that means the signal goes from a nice smooth sine wave to a square wave (if you know this, I apologize). The square wave causes the speaker coil to leave the magnetic gap, which causes the the coil to heat up A LOT, much more than too much power causes it to. Why this happens, I forgot. I'll try and figure it out. But regardless, if your source has started to go into clipping, you're much more likely to blow your speakers.

And so, when you have more power, you get a much cleaner signal. Granted, you have a 1000w going to a 500w speaker, turn the power all the way up, it will blow the speaker.

What kind of subs do you have? On the one you blew, did you have both voicecoils wired in? And don't forget, peak power is not RMS. RMS wattage is much more important. If your sub has a 8-1200w peak power rating, the chances are its RMS rating is around 250w, maybe up to 350w. And if your amp isn't running full power, then you probably aren't getting nearly the full wattage out of it.

BTW, can you give me a link to info on the amp you were running? And how did you have the voicecoils wired? Did you have the voice coils of one sub wired in parallel to one channel, or were the voicecoils wired in series? I'm assuming the subs were dual 4 ohm voicecoils, correct?

Blake

I thought you were saying to get an amp that would push more watts than your speakers peak wattage. Nevermind, I'm dumb. Now I get what your saying. I had to bridge to get this amp to work my subs.

Yes, dual 4ohm voice coils. Both voice coils were bridged to one pos/neg terminal on the box(one for each sub). then I have that terminal bridged to two channels giving it around 500 (dispersed so a little less) per sub. less than peak, more than rms. My ohms tested at bout 1.5 I believe which really makes the 12"s kick hard. I really need like a 2000w amp then bridge to get better potential out of my subs.


I thought clipping just made the speaker sound funny, not blow it. Also, I thought it was just with cetain head units. Huh, thanks for the heads up.

Sorry if I miss led anyone, you should never have your amp power less than rms. But the ohm trick should still work, just make sure your not pushing more watts than your speaker at limited ohms. KABLOOEY!!

I'm still trying to figure out how it was running at 1.5 ohms.

You have one sub on two channels. That channel was bridged, which doesn't change the ohms. But you had to 4 ohm voicecoils run in parallel to each channel (two channels bridged to one), which would make it a 2 ohm load.

Is that right?

Blake

Yes, that is what was weird to me too. I came up with the same math you did but when I checked it with an electronic Ohm device it said 1.5. I checked and rechecked and just assumed that it must have been right, because everything was working properly the way I set it up. The sub seems like it has a different ohm set up than I thought. I'm gonna have to go back and check.

I forgot...you can't exactly measure the resistance of a speaker using a multimeter, I don't think. I assume you had it playing at the time, right? Because if you look at the graphs they should give you with decent speaker, the actual resistance varies in conjunction with load, power, etc.

Blake

Your measuring the speakers DC resistance with a multi-meter. Different speakers will vary but most 4Ohm speakers will have a DCR of around 3.8Ohms. 1.5Ohms for two in paralell sounds low but possible. Make sure your not measuring the speakers with them hooked to the amp. That will change the reading.

The Impedance of the speaker is what is different at different frequencies. The load that the speaker presents to the amplifier is more closely related to Impedance.