Need some advice, building a bullet proof 13B?
 

I am still a little unclear on what my options are when it comes to rebuilding. I have an 89 TurboII, and I would like to rebuild the engine. I know when it comes to rebuilding a piston engine, there are tons of upgrade parts I can use, rods, pistons, valve springs, etc. Using various upgraded parts, you can basically build a "bullet proof" engine. (I know tuning matters, and anything can blow, hence the quotation marks)

So my question is, do rotaries have similar options? It seems like every engine part I have come across for sale (rotors, housings), is basically an OE part, asides from other brand apex seals (and I have heard OE apex seals as considered better). What can you do to really strengthen a rotary to take more abuse (ie: higher boost), and be very reliable at the same time.

I apologize if this seems like a vague question, or if it may have been touched on before. I am just really fishing for ideas, I want to build this car up in a no compromise way, meaning boosting performance and maintaining equal if not greater comfort/amenities. (might be a bit ambitious)

I have looked at some of the guys here on this forum build some mild to wild setups, and each one will tell you how to build your motor differently, for power, reliabilty, and maxium proformance. WHat I'm trying to say is that it comes down to preferance (piece of mind) than anything else. Some will tell you that you need to dowel pin your motor if you want to handle over 500 hp, some will tell you that you should cryo treat your internal parts if you want your internals to live for long and then there is the big discussion about which seals to buy and what to stay clear of. I know some of the guys that have built "junk" motors and have been making big numbers and have not twisted, grenaded or jammed their motors yet to this day. I say junk, because they havent put as much "detail" in their engines as what most shops would tell you that you need.

Honestly though, I would not put bullet proof and 13B in one sentence. It just does not exist.(some may disagree)

From the little knowledge that I have aquired from reading, researching, talking to people on this forum and also building my own engine, Things that will help make your engine more durable to stress are proper clearances,good parts, proper assembly(torque specifications) and good break in proceedure(this will vary with new and used parts and also who's building the motor). Most importantly as what you said before, I will say it back to you. Tuning is the key to these motors.Without this you could have a million dollars in your motor, is gonna pop like the fourth of july.

If I were you, I would try and read some more stuff in here, there is a ton of knowledge in these forums, once you can filter the bullshit from the good stuff.
I don't expect everyone to agree with what I have told you, but thats something everyone will have to get use to in here.LOL.

Happy building dude.

There's no such thing as a bulletproof motor, unfortunately. If you want bulletproof, use the right octane fuel for the application. Then, and only then, will you see the potential of the 13B, even in stock form. :)

B

Balance everything, taper the main crank journals, clearance the rotor faces then after all that don't spin it passed 8500 rpm. You will have an engine that CAN spin to 10K rpm just don't do it.
As for turbo power levels, keep the right fuel in it and don't try to ring every last HP out of it all the time. Tune it for a wide power band not top end HP.


You will probably blow it up sometime anyway... :uhh:

It would certainly seem that way, that's why the thought came to mind. I knew everything around the engine would need to support it and be in excellent tune, I just wanted to see if there were ways to increase the strength of the engine itself. Thanks for the reply, I appreciate it.

BDC- Obviously there is nothing bulletproof, hence the quotation marks in my original post. However, I know you can build a fairly stout piston engine, that might allow you to make some small tuning mistakes...for a little while anyway. And at the very least, hold up under stress if properly tuned. And come on, just run 93 octane and you're all good? :) I wish it were that easy.

I am really just trying to get a feel for how likely the 13B is to pop when pushing higher than stock boost, with a bigger than stock turbo, even if you have it properly tuned. It will be a big part in how I decide to attack this thing.

Thanks guys for the replies, I really do appreciate it.

well, to me when you say stout then I'm tending to lean on , ceramic 3mm Seals, and dowel pinning. Now like I said before, many people try different things that work. Some people swear my the oem seals, while others with ceramic seals. Right now , I think the hype id Rotary aviation new "black" seals. According to "experts" The 3mm seals gives you a little more room to mistakes, not much but sometimes enough. Dowel pinning the motor, will cause it to not "twist" under high amounts of loads...again, people are not running this mod and still are living with 5-600 whp.
In my opinion, Once you tune right, you can make big power .
I don't think the rotary engine is a good platform for begining tuners, unless they own tons of them. But I do think that with proper knowledge and expierience, the rotory engine is a deadly sword by all means put in the right hands.

Thanks Indian, you have definitely helped me out. At least I have a little better idea of how to approach this project.

If anyone else wants to throw in their two cents, I'd be happy to hear it too.