If you know how to "pass" emissions in ontario
 

Send me a PM. It blows my mind that everyone doesn't just have a "shop" that everyone goes to. RX7's and emissions don't mix.

It's a tough thing to do for a shop. Especially when you start asking things like this on public forums. :)

Just like how people sell fake TTC metro passes on Kijiji

Seriously?!? They sell fake TTC passes????

What's the world coming too?

A stock Rx7 will pass emissions.
If it has a good operational exhaust system.
Mazdees should be able to make it pass.Other than that there are not too many shops that work on strictly rotary engines.

I don't think you are going to get guys posting up and Putting their shop,career and financial status at risk,..all because you want to get your Car "e-tested on the Sly".
That's like saying I know a bank that only has one security guard..wanna make a withdrawal with me?..Post up here.

Why bother unless you're selling the car? Just get a conditional pass.

-Geoff

Cops creep these forums. Just saying.

If I had time, I have an idea to legally pass the bad ones. But as usual no time for any special stuff :(

thewird

It's not a secret that cars are driving around that "passed emissions" hence the conditional pass. They know it's bullshit for OBD1 cars. It's a cash grab and a scam everyone and their mother knows that. If it was any other car I can go with a straight pipe and run the car a bit lean but with an RX-7 that's a no no.

Gimme a break with the "Bank" comment. Writing a fake safety that's another story I would personally never drive a car unfit for the road even thought most people do drive on tires showing the steel belts and brakes that come screeching to a stop but as long as it passed emissions it's ok right? They should worry about shit like that instead of emissions.

I didn't say to publically post it. Most people won't even give you an conditional anymore. Nothing i've said or asked can call for legal action.

1) Drive Clean is not allowed to turn a profit. It's revenue neutral. They currently are taking in more than they're spending, however the excess is not returned to the provincial coiffers.

2) I suspect you don't understand how a conditional pass is issued. Take your car for a test and fail. Take your test results to an accredited drive clean repair facility (often the shop that does the test is also a repair facility, however I would take your car elsewhere). If the repair facility finds a single defect that costs more than $450 to repair, you just decline the repairs and take the work order back to the test facility and they give you your conditional pass. If no single repair costs $450 or more you will be required to pay up to the $450 limit to get your conditional pass.

I don't know about you, but when I got into RX7's I knew it would be an expensive hobby and I'm more than willing to pay up to $450 every two years for a conditional pass. I just consider it an RX7 user fee.

-Geoff

Ouch! $450 user fee every 2 years?!?! Sweet Mother of God!

I hate Drive clean.. makes no sense... I'm hoping its ruled out before I have to take my Miata into emissions... I've got another 2-3yrs before it becomes an issue...

$0.62 a day. That's not that much. And that's only if your vehicle can be repaired into spec.

I'll be going for an "emissions analysis" later this summer. I'll be interested to see what they say. My completely unqualfied opinion is that I'll be told I need to replace either:

a) my cat (I have a bonez high-flow) with a factory cat (more than $450 from the dealer)

b) my computer (PFC) with a factory computer (more than $450 from the dealer)

c) my airpump (gone!) (more than $450 from the dealer)

So I'll end up paying $0.00 for my conditional pass (well I'll have to pay $17.50 for a retest)

But even if not, even if I have to pay $450 for my conditional pass, $0.62 a day to drive my car isn't a big deal.

-Geoff

It's bad enough we have to pay insurance. Let alone a "user" fee to drive my own car.. ;)

More importantly, I've got to get this done before Sept, since they're raising the price of the renewal sticker on the 1st of Sept! :mad:

Meh, I chalk it up to the cost of the hobby, if I wanted to avoid this potential cost, I could have left my car stock. I chose to modify it quite a bit, so I'll end up paying the cost of my actions.

-Geoff

Guys this is exactly why I bought an 85. Or go buy an 87! Sorry if your all FD guys but maybe you guys should find love for the older cars too :P

You'd be surprised how much you can do with $450. :)

I do understand though if you've modified the car heavily... living in Ontario has its ups and downs.

Just wish they would get rid of the Drive Clean scam.. never liked it to begin with.

Oh yeah, don't get me wrong, I'm not saying $450 is nothing or that I have money to burn... I just accept it as the cost of enjoying my hobby.

-Geoff

I thought you can only get one conditional pass and then you have to fix it. It's like they give you 2-yrs to fix it properly.

Nope lol that's the idea behind it but you can just keep getting them. It doesn't really make sense.

Hmm..I thought only One was allowed too.
POW Google!:
Drive Clean conditional passes are unlimited - Wheels.ca

SOO!! lets say i have a "broken"(missing) air pump, dead cat, and failed o2 sensor. The total will be $450+. Ill say no to the repairs, then get my conditional pass? or do i have to pay an extra $450 on top of the initial failed emission test to get the conditional pass?

You have to spend that.

thewird

The simple truth is that unless you have a radically ported engine, such as a massive street port, bridge or peripheral, then passing emissions with a good tune and a high flow cat is not difficult.

The key to that is "good tune". There are precious few good tunes out there. Sure, there are plenty of tunes which are drivable and make great power, but quite often I see:

-ridiculously rich cold start mapping (it's a myth engines need to run super rich on cold start)
-idle too rich (usually due to no idle valve)
-midrange too rich
-low RPM low vacuum not tuned
-low RPM high vacuum too rich, decel fuel cut not used or not set up properly
-high RPM low load way too rich

These issues can still exist but the driver quickly becomes used to them. Yet all are going to cause failures due to HCs. Realistically that's the only way a modified rotary is going to fail as the new tests aren't checking NOX and CO will be catalyzed.

The ECUs we have available now are easily capable of running a cleanly burning car under part throttle conditions. Most support AFR tables for observer based operation.

The black FD some of you may have seen in the background of my Cosmo videos is a steet port with a 60-1 and a Haltech P1000. With a 3" Vibrant race cat and a tune that doesn't suck, it just went through emissions easily. Scored cleaner than a stock FC/FD and that's without the air pump and associated controls.

You don't have to spend $450, you must receive an estimate of repairs of over $450 from a Certified Drive Clean mechanic to receive a conditional pass. You will have to pay the mechanic for an hour to perform the estimate. The mechanic will give you some paperwork, and you go back to where you had it tested to get the conditional pass.

I love the guys who whine about the program, would any of you guys take your used engine oil and dump it into the sewer, lake? If you car doesn't pass the emissions tests it means you're polluting. Sure the system has its flaws, nobody's perfect, you don't like it, move, or be more actively involved in politics to have your say heard.

Confirmed. Asked my drive clean tech and told me exactly this. 40 for the emissions and 100 for the hour of diagnostic. then away you go!

Hmm,this sounds good!..giving me ideas of putting a TII engine in an 88 now!

i went for an emissions test two days ago!! and PASSED since in ontario our FD's are OBD1 and under the new emissions standards it calls for an old fashion two speed idle. setup is a highflow cat with air pump on stock ECU . car passed with flying colours i was surprised

2500rpm Limit Reading
HC(ppm) -200- -77-
CO(%) -1- -0.02-

Idle Limit Reading
HC(ppm) -200- -81-
CO(%) -1- -0.03-

So much for all the key tuning points......

Well those aren't set prices it depends on the labour rate of the shop you go to. Its an hour labour for "Emission Failure Diagnosis" Could be between 70-120 per hour. But all you pay is that and the initial cost of the test and your good to go.

I've actually tested tuning on an emissions analyzer thanks to Daryl and it has no substantial effect on emissions. The biggest effect was standing on the throttle for 30 seconds at 5-6k RPM to warm up the cat and emissions dropped like a rock after that. Tune did not matter at all, rich, lean, timing advance/retard, almost identical numbers every time.

thewird