E85 has higher octane than most think...
 

I work at a hotel that does convetions for large companys all the time. and from time to time i look through the folders, handouts, flyers when im bored. there usualy just boring business stuff. But this week ISE is here. They work in low emissions, improved fuel econemy, sustainable power, ect... and there are these really cool conversion charts they are handing out to people attending the convention. i snagged one and its stats this:

BTU/lb 13,894
BTU/GAL. 90,660
Kwh/GAL. 26.6
hph/GAL. 35.6
Energy Equivalent 0.65
Ocatane Rtaing 123

---and to compare---


BTU/lb 20,492
BTU/GAL. 125,000
Kwh/GAL. 36.6
hph/GAL. 49.1
Energy Equivalent 0.90
Ocatane Rtaing 87

i wish that i had filling stations all over the place so i could use this stuff it just seems like if used this on my 20b it could never be a street car. if it wasnt for me needing having to drive 20min to get e85. Im thinking that on avergage I will get about 180-150 miles per tank.

i have always read and seen E85 is around 105 octane. but this shows that its about 123!!! thats insane. no wonder people can run so much timing. but a huge thing for me is not the octane rating. its the cooling factor also that it gives. no need for AI when using AI. it seems to be better than C16 for less than half the price!!!

anyone have figures on C16 race gas?

I seen the graphs and everything for the people running E85 on boosted cars. but im wondering if this is better than C16 for all motor also...???

i was really thinking about getting an 8-10 gal tank in my fd.






that 180-150 miles you mean cruising or pushing the car while cruising?

ill be seeing you next month for the miami vs orlando street race

Just babying it, trying to get around town. My 20b isnt running but it looks like i would need 1600cc primaries and secondaries. so a total of at least 6, 1600cc injectors. To what ive been told that my 20b shouyd be getting 9mpg with 850cc primaries and 1600cc secondaries running on gasoline. so with ethanol loosing on average 30% gas mileage i should get 6mpg (OUCH!) with a 20 gallon tank that comes out to 120 miles per tank and thats if i dont get on it. great fuel but not an option for a true street car. unless you are lucky enough to have these stations on every corner.

i got a 4 gal tank and 4 1600cc injectors running e85..is great but damn my car is alcoholic and im planning on adding to 2 more injectors

but has anyone ran E85 on an all motor car yet? i cant find any real info on it. im trying to decide between C16, E85, and pure Meth for my all motor drag car. Meth would make the most power but is damn exspensive. E85 might be the magic ticket... but im unsure.

Oh and to darkphantom, i will not be racing in the orlando vs. miami thing. i just took apart my "race car" cause im going from turbo street car to all motor drag car. but hopefully i'll be there to watch!

how much are you paying for methanol? I was pretty sure C16 was a lot more expensive. also think about it how much fuel are you really going to buring once you get the car tuned being that it is a drag car (I'm assuming that the car is trailored everywhere)

I'll be running my setup on e85 fairly soon... I'll post after some tuning

all motor, or turbo...?

whats the motor set-up?

most people have seen the amazing results E85 has on turbo rotarys. but i havnt seen any results on E85.

Turbo setup, going to be hard pressed to find any NA guys running e85 unless they're running some insane compression, which is hard to find too...

e85 its pretty similar to meth its just 85% seems to work great for a lot of guys running big block chevy's and what not. hell id run it in my truck if i could but in cali theres no e85 stations only biodiesel and i dont have a diesel anything go looking for some people that run it. everyone ive talked to that uses it loves it causes it cheaper than meth but you get a lot of the benefits

thats my thoughts... and pure Meth on NA motors is already proven to be better (in most cases) than C16. maybe i'll just go for it and see what the out come is myself... it wouldnt be hard to switch back to C16 if it dosnt yield the numbers im looking for.

look on hot rods website they ahd a big string of articles on e85 cars that are putting out huge numbers and running very reliably. if cali had mroe of it i would do it in the next car i build or my truck but we dont have very many. you may want to go the local drag races and ask the guys there how they have it running and if they like it too.

I have never heard 123 octane rating that's wild. That has to be E99, I been using e85 for about a year now and loving it :bigthumb:

how much is your mileage affected and what benefits exactly are you seeing? whats your setup as well i wanna boost for my next build and i found a few places that are somewhat local so i can do this.

Not sure about mileage not a daily driver, but able to run more timing and better cooling properties. Cosmo engine streetported 4x1680cc injectors t66 turbo. I have a second gen im working on I want to run e85 and nitrous. Check out this forum pretty interesting
e85performance.net

thank you for that im personally not planning on dailing with e85 because its not that easy to get but i can get it and i figured id put some in some gas cans and use it for autocross and trackdays

I have it on this card that shows a lot of conversions. and its E85 not E99. i never seen it listed as 123 anywhere else either. but, i'll belive a billion dollar corporation who deals with fuels and oils over some tuning shop write up i read on the net... you know?

but my favorite part of E85, as you mentioned, is the cooling properties.

i think the reason you hear different octane ratings for E85 is because the mixture can differ from gas station to gas station...even though it's marked as e85, the mixture could be 80% or 75% ethanol. I know for a fact in CO, the formula changes in the winter, and the ethanol percentage is lowered a bit

E85 on low boost
E98 on high boost

E98 cools better and has a higher octane then MOST VP racing fuels. And costs next to nothing compared to leaded race fuel.

my race car will be e85 happy

I just read an article that some of the RX-8 guys are running it on the street. I think that there is some info on esmeril racing about it. Also, J.H.B. performance has some nice products for e85, though I am not sure that it is needed.

well crap. it would seem that the only place to get e85 near me is 75miles away. anyone know where to get drums of this stuff?

after a bit more research i found some info for everyone.

"There is no requirement to post octane on an E85 dispenser. If a retailer chooses to post octane, they should be aware that the often cited 105 octane is incorrect. This number was derived by using ethanol’s blending octane value in gasoline. This is not the proper way to calculate the octane of E85. Ethanol’s true octane value should be used to calculate E85’s octane value. This results in an octane range of 94-96 (R+M)/2. These calculations have been confirmed by actual octane engine tests."

and

"One complication is that use of gasoline in an engine with a high enough compression ratio to use E85 efficiently would likely result in catastrophic failure due to engine detonation, as the octane rating of gasoline is not high enough to withstand the greater compression ratios in use in an engine specifically designed to run on E85. Use of E85 in an engine designed specifically for gasoline would result in a loss of the potential efficiency that it is possible to gain with this fuel. Using E85 in a gasoline engine has the drawback of achieving lower fuel economy as more fuel is needed per unit air (stoichiometric fuel ratio) to run the engine in comparison with gasoline. This corresponds to a lower heating value (units of energy per unit mass) for E85 than gasoline."

while the octane rating is better the switch doesnt seem to make it worth while. also read that all bare aluminum and all rubber needs to be removed from the fuel system to withstand the alcohol. as well as a modified fuel pump to prevent arching as apparently alcohol is a decent conductor of electricity.

info pulled from wikipedia on e85 as well as seen the same info in a few other spots during a google search