Originally Posted by montego (Post 7191553)

this is my take. I converted from sequential to FULL non sequential to see what the big deal was about. I had a perfectly working sequential system but I was looking for reliability.

Sequential truths that I experienced:
Instant boost at anything above 2.9K rpms. Can be very tempermental. About every 6 months (I drive my car a lot) I would have some kind of boost issue which really sucks. I did a full vacuum hose job at it kept my system trouble free for about 3 years but then the problems began again. At elevated boost levels (above 12 psi) I would get a spike at transition (no harmn done but it bugged the shit out of me).

non sequential truths:
I didn't get 10 psi until I hit 3800 RPMs and supposedly I had all the right mods (SMIC, DP, MP, CB, Streetport). Some people claim they hit full boost at 2.9K here on the forum but I have not met one single person that has been able to do it, and I live in So Cal so there are a lot of FD's runing around. The system also had lag as it wasn't instant boost past 3.8 K RPMs. On the plus side I never had any more boost problems after I went non-sequential :)

A miscontrued truth about nonsequential: Increase the parallel power band by 700 RPMs and thus make your car faster. (remember 4500 RPMS @ sequential Vs 3800 RPMS non-sequential). True you do increase your power band but you certainly are not faster unless you brake boost... IMO that's kinda gay if you using the same turbos. Another thing to note that those 700 RPMs are only usable during your initial WOT. Most people shift at redline, which brings back your RPMs to above 4500 RPMs WHERE either setup ALREADY HAS BOTH TURBOS RUNING IN PARALLEL ANYWAY! so those extra 700 RPMs are not being used after the initial shift.

My buddy has porsche boxter before I went non-sequential I dusted his ass in every gear at 10 psi. After I went non-sequential and upped the boost to 12 psi I always had to play catch up. Why? the damn lag that's why. By the time I hit boost he was already ahead of me. Don't get me wrong I would dust his ass but like I said I would have play catch up first.

IMO the best of both both worlds is simplified sequential. Only 20 hoses instead of 72 for full sequential, or 6 for full non-sequential. So you keep the responsive factor and yet eliminate the majority of the hoses so it keeps things simple.

Originally Posted by montego (Post 7191553)

A miscontrued truth about nonsequential: Increase the parallel power band by 700 RPMs and thus make your car faster. (remember 4500 RPMS @ sequential Vs 3800 RPMS non-sequential). True you do increase your power band but you certainly are not faster unless you brake boost... IMO that's kinda gay if you using the same turbos. Another thing to note that those 700 RPMs are only usable during your initial WOT. Most people shift at redline, which brings back your RPMs to above 4500 RPMs WHERE either setup ALREADY HAS BOTH TURBOS RUNING IN PARALLEL ANYWAY! so those extra 700 RPMs are not being used after the initial shift.

Originally Posted by rajeevx7 (Post 7194605)

I can't, not even once, remember making 15-16psi with out blowing off a vac line somewhere with seq.

Originally Posted by wb123 (Post 8110796)

What is the simplified sequential?
Does it require alot of mods and time to do this?

Is there any guides I can read to do this on my own, provided I have the right tools and time on my hands.?

Originally Posted by twomucboost4u (Post 8110813)

You can have the car tuned to have the second turbo come on at 4k :) just thought Id let you know. ;)

Chris

Originally Posted by wb123 (Post 8110796)

What is the simplified sequential?
Does it require alot of mods and time to do this?

Is there any guides I can read to do this on my own, provided I have the right tools and time on my hands.?

Originally Posted by dgeesaman (Post 8115610)

Simplified sequential basically leaves the turbo control stuff alone and deletes the emissions equipment. Diagram posted above. Aside from clearing out a little space, it does not simplify the sequential system itself.

Dave

Originally Posted by thewird (Post 8115662)

What are the advantages and disadvantages of running the simplified system? Besides it being more simple of course (less hoses).

thewird

Originally Posted by Mahjik (Post 8115700)

IMO, the simplified diagram is not a good option.

The advantage is that it removes a small amount of redundant vacuum lines (it also removes all the emissions components). The downside is that you "really" need to understand the sequential setup to understand the pressure and vacuum paths of the sequential system. This is definitely required to understand the new routing as well as be able to troubleshoot it later on should problems arise. 90% if of the troubleshooting guides and general help you will receive from others will be based on the stock vacuum/pressure lines routing.

Originally Posted by duwacker69 (Post 8111842)

I dont mean to butt in on your thread?? I wish I knew what the seq setup felt like and how the 4500rpm transition felt like also, but I am in the middle of my full non-seq mod and I cant seem to find the write up for the 13bre engine? I only find it for the rew. I know they are close but different. Can anyone help me out?Thanks

Originally Posted by cewrx7r1 (Post 7195485)

Most peolpes full non-seq is others starting point.
Here is just one of the improvements for full non-seq.

Originally Posted by RX7LINK (Post 7190399)

sequential is so much more fun to drive

Originally Posted by Mahjik (Post 8115700)

IMO, the simplified diagram is not a good option.

The advantage is that it removes a small amount of redundant vacuum lines (it also removes all the emissions components). The downside is that you "really" need to understand the sequential setup to understand the pressure and vacuum paths of the sequential system. This is definitely required to understand the new routing as well as be able to troubleshoot it later on should problems arise. 90% if of the troubleshooting guides and general help you will receive from others will be based on the stock vacuum/pressure lines routing.

Originally Posted by mdpalmer (Post 8117815)

I've never ridden in a sequential equipped car. I've studied a lot of their dyno graphs. It cracks me up, whenever I show a sequential car's dyno to my V8 friend... they're like "whoa" :) That transition in torque @ 4.5KRPM is pretty weird to most people. BUT: there's something to be said for the extra torque before the standard transition point. If you're on the street with your car alot, I think it would be a lot better to have the extra torque that comes with a proper sequential turbo car--just for the fun factor.

My car is full non sequential and I have 3" exhaust (high flow cat), open intake, set my boost controller to open the wastegate around 7 psi, and I get full boost about 4,000 RPM (13 psi). I can make 10#s a little bit sooner (depends on ambient air temp), probably 3,800 RPM. Before that, the car is pretty much running N/A. And yes, it's slow. Once boost hits, I'm gone, but before that... it's like driving an N/A rotary car and that's no fun.

I'll post up some videos when I get a chance (I just got a new camera mount for my car) to show you how a non-seq car behaves on the street and track (I'm going to the drag strip this Sat. and a road course event next May).

One last thing: don't forget, the term "lag" means how long it takes (seconds) to get a specified amount of boost after you've hit the go pedal. "boost threshold" is the term that describes @ what RPM you get a specified full boost. So below 4,000 RPM, lag is bad with non-seq turbos. My boost threshold for 10 psi is about 3,800 RPM, while it's 4,000 RPM for 13 psi. Lag is not an issue above 4,000 RPM.

But you know what, my car is still fun as hell. I love it :D

Originally Posted by SD93FD3S (Post 8117362)

+1 unless you r looking for more HP(single). there really isn't a real concrete reason other then the lack of understanding how the twins work or lazy ass people that just bitch about the twins.