Lightest FD3 With A/C is begun
 

I am working on this car and have it started (if stripped to the bare shell is started) I have lots of plans and allready got some parts but I need help.
I need CARBON FIBER DOORS! Where can I get these in a full streetable door? I am willing to ship and wait if they are in Japan but so far no one seems to actually have a set.
I have most of the other parts and will make the doors if I have to (like I did the hatch) but if they are available I don't wanna go through the mold making hassle again.
I also need to find a lightweight solution to the Brace that runs from the tranny to the rear end. Does anyone make one or do I need to fire up my welder and make an aluminum one?


The plans and parts I have on hand are as follows:

M2 Roll bar with seat clips and harness attachments on crossbar
M2 brakes (full race kit)
T61 Single turbo and ported motor (wrapped in plastic awaiting a home)
Carbon fiber dash (under construction)
Carbon fiber hatch (done but need lexan)
Carbon doors (seeking these)
Carbon fenders (being made)
Carbon scoot hood (I'll buy it if I can get maker to build with carbon ONLY and no glass)
NOS adjustable shot from 50 to 100 HP (probably never use it)
Haltech E6K (all wires are on a bench in my shop being set up for this)
Removed All ABS and related wires, fuses, etc.
Removed power steering
Lawn battery relocated to rear
Carbon fiber interior (custom being made by me)
C Westin Headlights (got em)
DMS fully adjustable coilover suspension (got it)
Race seats (looking for light ones! Must be under 10lbs each)
Lexan winshield (M2 is looking into this for me)
Removed winshield wipers and associated bullshit
Hood (bought one on a GP in glass but it's shit)
Wheels (Have forgeline but might replace when road ready)
Unobtanium bushings (installing after the parts are done being polished)
5 point racing harnesses (got em)
Stereo delete option (done)
Custom 3.5" Titanium exhaust (later but have a source and a welder)

This is a start but I'm open to suggestions. If anyone can copy my unobtanium steel sleeves in Titanium or if Jim reads this I am interested. I have a lathe but no source for the Ti. If anyone can reccomend a good source I'm interested.


Steve

Hey Steve!
The brace or the PPF as it's known is already a weak link in the drivetrain. You should try and fabricate a stronger one than stock and if you can at the same time one that's lighter would be a plus too!:)
MMS have one that they claim is stronger.

crispeed
87TII
9.20@150mph

That PPF or Power Plant Frame is very important and if you replace it you should make it stronger than the stock. People have to replace it anyway when over 400rwhp since it tends to crack.

You might could fab a real light alum then send it off to be cryogenically (sp?) treated.

Anyway, I thought I'd throw that in. I'd love to see some pics of you custom pieces like the dash ect

What do you plan on doing with this car???

Later,
STEPHEN

RX Steve

For a good source on titainium, check online. Look for a supplier of sheet metal or piping. If they do not have it, they can probably give you a recommendation on another supplier.

For the PPF, I would fabricate it w/ titainium.

IIRC Mazdacomp has a lot of the body panels in either carbon fiber or fiberglass...

Check with them, it might save you the trouble of having to fabricate your own.

I see a Ti PPF in my future.

SPO- I am going to use this car for fun. I define fun as track days and an occasional blast down a deserted road at speeds a tad over the limit. My business partner has a 650 hp Hennessey Viper and the first thing I plan to do is kick it's ass. Which is kinda silly since I am planning on buying the Viper in the future.

I will post some pics as soon as I have some time. I have lots of pics in my digital camera but I need to find a place to host them.

My biggest concern is the carbon doors. If I don't find them soon I must get started making a set. I'll have molds at that point and will make them available. I really don't have time to make them so if some one else is interested in making them I'll buy a set.

Steve

For carbon doors, check Panspeed it is a japanese company, but they do make them, last time I heard they were like 2g's a set...

Go here to see them...

www.takakaira.co.jp then go to the aero kits section and look under mazda, and look for panspeed, they don't list them, but you can see them on the car, maybe you could email them and see if they could get them???

Also I have heard that www.corksport.com can get them too, and you also might want to see if www.rxecret7.com could get them. I am for sure that they are made by Panspeed and I have seen their cars on videos so I think the doors look pretty streetable , but you will have to inquire from one of the places listed to make sure that you can put the factory glass in them, and not lexan.

Also for the CF scoot hood, I don't know if you talked to rotaryextreme yet or not, but he is going to be making them, they are supposedly going to be great quality, but check out his site www.rotaryextreme.com for more details, or the group buy center here on the forum as there is a thread started already for this group buy...

If you're looking for something insanely strong, check out Airmet steel. I was planning on using it for a certain impact weapon on my battlebot (geek alert). This stuff is brutally strong. The idea is that you don't need as much, and thus you can save weight. But it's expensive as hell and you need good metalworking facilities.

Other than that it's not really hard to find Titanium, but it will cost ya. T6 aluminum is used on the landing gear of F-18 Hornets, and I have a feeling that they get a lot more stress on them that you will ever put on anything in your Rx-7. T6 is a lot cheaper and more readily available in convenient shapes than is Titanium.

Slinemodel: I do not know if I can use T6 thick enough to work to replace the steel and still have the clearence to fit past the other parts. I'll look into that for sure. Aluminum would be much lighter than Ti if I can make it work. I still need a source for good quality aluminum bolts and Ti bolts and nuts. I can find that online for sure. I just haven't had time to look.
The doors are turning out to be one of those parts everyone seems to know who made but no one can aquire. I think I may have to have these made or make the molds myself.
I woke up this morning to 40 degree weather outside and had to ask myself why I am going to all this trouble to hold on to the A/C. But I will remember why in August. I'm in South Florida.
The wiring is going well. I am eliminating miles of this stuff. The ABS and air bag take a huge amount of support systems! I am scrapping it all.
I am still debating on a color and the car is ready to be paintstripped inside and out. There is not on bolt left in the unibody. I am leaning towards YELLOW.
I have my motor together but am thinking of having a partial bridgeport done to it before I put it back in. I will probably just put it in the way it is now.
I am also looking for the race seats. I could purchase these now or later since the car color is no decided yet.

Thanks for all the responce (here and by e-mail) it has been helpfull. The best lead yet on the carbon doors came from this post.

Steve

DOOR/ROCKER - LEFT 1 RX-7 . 1993-95 $1,283.60

Notes: Carbon fiber. Originally designed for IMSA GT-2. Pricing is FOB Atlanta, GA. Freight arrangements will need to be made with Downing-Atlanta. Boxing not included.

DOOR/ROCKER - RIGHT 1 RX-7 . 1993-95 $1,283.60

Notes: Carbon fiber. Originally designed for IMSA GT-2. Pricing is FOB Atlanta, GA. Freight arrangements will need to be made with Downing-Atlanta. Boxing not included.

www.mazdamotorsports.com

Weaklink, Those doors were not made to work on a stock car. I called Jim on those allready. The search goes on!

Steve

Who makes the lightweight hatch? I think its out of FG, is it C-West, or does Mazdacomp make one?
Anyone know?

Glass man: C-West.

Steve: Could you give me the information on where your getting the Ti piping for the exhaust and the name of you fab? Give me a minute and I'll give you a link to a place that sells Ti/SS/etc. fasteners in all metric sizes...

Nick


*** EDIT *** Found the supplyer, http://www.mettec.com/fasteners.htm

P.S. Steve, what is your expected weight savings?

Nick

Steve, where in WPB are you? I'm in Boynton and would love to get a look at what you're doing.

Jason

Ihad put this on hold for work reasons but I am getting back to it soon. So far I have a 60K parts pile.

Steve

thats gonna be sick be sure to post specs as u go along

whats the deal on that PPF steve?

paul

You are crazy for doing all this work. Are you just trying to prove a point. After all this weight reduction your car is going to fly the fuck off the track/road. Whatever applies.

Good luck Evil.

Someone makes a carbon fiber drive shaft. Check into this

How much is all this going to cost? What's your biggest goal by making the car so light? (i.e. handling, acceleration, top speed, etc.)

Why not do a 20B?

RE Amemiya has the inside CF door panel. It will help you about 1.1kg
RE Amemiya also has the FiberGlass hatch, REAR Tail Acrylic Glass, side Acrylic door glass and WHOLE FiberGlass door.
http://www.re-amemiya.co.jp/shopping...w/photo018.jpg
http://www.re-amemiya.co.jp/shopping...s/photo030.jpg
http://www.re-amemiya.co.jp/shopping...w/photo054.jpg

You can get all those at http://www.jt-imports.com/U.S.Atop.htm

CF doors - no idea on quality/etc:

http://www.fc-datalogit.co.nz/carbon-door.html

;)

I am crazy!
The ppf might be a little more trick than just Titanium. We'll see. I am working with some one who says he can do some stuff I'm not too sure about with the T and honeycomb carbon. I think it will be aluminum and I'll weld it up myself but you never know.
So far the doors I have seen are not what I need. I have seen a few pcs. that look OK but I drove to central FL cause a guy said he had them and they were SHIT! My time is too important for me to ever do that again! I will buy the simple parts and make the rest.
I will say that I AM 100% sure I will be doing a full carbon interior. Sparce but fully functional. I have a few new plans too that I will have pictures of once done.

The idea of weight savings is pretty simple to me. Power to weight ratio increases in my favor with every single dropped ounce. Less weight also means less stress on most of the parts. Therefore the parts can be weeker, so less weight can be acheived by using lighter parts, meaning less stress etc. etc. etc.

Anyway this is where it is at. I will post pics as I go. I still work 12+ hours a day so the car gets about 5 hours a week tops. But I enjoy doing it. Mostly so I can "Fly off the fucking road" as a previous poster stated. By the way I am waving one finger at him now. Care to guess which finger?

Steve

If you do all of this to an "FD3" I'll be impressed seeing as how there's no such thing!

No such thing as what??? Did I miss something here????

Steve

yeah, you missed the S in FD3S when you posted the thread. he was just picking on you.

Sounds really cool. Can't wait for some pics!

how much does a carbon drive shaft run?? Im sure there kind of heavy.

Re: Lightest FD3 With A/C is begun
 

Steve, you might try McMaster-Carr (www.mcmaster.com) for the Ti stock. They have Grade 2 and Grade 5 Titanium rods in various diameters. 1 foot of 1" dia. Grade 5 rod is $89.21.

As for your carbon fiber... be aware that those who are producing "copies" of other vendor's parts are providing people with the carbon fiber look, but that their production process is probably the same as that for fiberglass (wet lay-up), so the weight is probably very similar also. For true lightweight carbon fiber components, you'll need to find someone who uses an autoclave to cure the components at high temperature and pressure, and uses "pre-preg" material.

Pre-preg carbon fiber is pre-impregnated with resin at a production facility, rolled onto spools, and then frozen to prevent it from curing. The resulting material has a precisely controlled resin volume (unlike wet lay-up, where fiber is layed into the mold and then resin is applied) and will be 20-30% stiffer and stronger than an equivalent thickness wet laminate. Panels made from pre-preg can be significantly thinner because of the increased strength, and are therefore lighter.

There's some good information on carbon fiber driveshafts here...

http://www.acpt.com/driveshaft/index.html

That's for sure. :)

In the upper left corner of the picture below, you can see the huge amount of wiring and parts that I eliminated from my engine bay harness alone. Compare the thickness of the remaining harness to a stock one, and you'll see where 20+ lbs. of my weight reduction came from. :)

https://www.rx7club.com/forum/attach...postid=1041449

Close-up of the "scrap" pile...

https://www.rx7club.com/forum/attach...postid=1041473

Thats a lot of work there Jim!. Can I send you my TII harness for a rebuild/refurb?

must be nice to have money to burn on a negative return investment

some people are apparently not suffering in this economy....

hey Jim,

you must have a VERY understanding wife who is ok with you filling the house with old RX-7 wiring harnesses :)

She has a room for her hobbies, and I have a room for mine. And the garage. :)

It was the crankshafts and cylinder heads sitting on the island in the kitchen that she eventually objected to, although she didn't yell at me for scrubbing the FD's rear subframe clean in the bathtub of her "Mickey" bathroom... :)

Jim,
Prepreg aint what it's cracked up to be. We have some resins that are Rom temp cure that work just as well or better than the prepreg. I have produced carbon parts before and know quite a lot about it. I have the ability and the facility to vacume bag every part. If done right it is just as efficiant as any carbon system can be. Mosler uses it on the MT-900 right next door to my wharehouse and they are very helpfull.
I will be using a couple of tricks these guys spent years learning. In return I have some for them as well. I have a system they say won't work and they want proof. So trading is working well.
The PPF seems to be well made with little excess weight. I think I have a solution for it too though.
The driveshaft is not a part I want to try myself. I will however be doing lots of other parts along the way. I am doing the titanium suspension parts as well.
I need lexan or something better if it is made. FAL was supposed to be doing a kit but all they did was the rear glass. If anyone can help here I would really apreciate it.
The car comes down (It's been stored in my loft) this week so that I can begin reassembly. I'll keep you all posted.

Steve

Anyone who thinks cars are investments are dilusional. It's a piece of machinery which loses value over time. Unless you've got a mint AC Cobra or 426 Hemi Superbird sitting in the garage... go have fun with it.

My point was that a traditional wet layup process (no bagging, no autoclave) usually produces thicker and heavier parts, and it sounded like you were planning on buying all pre-made parts, so I was just trying to help you get the lightest parts possible.