Identity the metal thud/bang
11-17-17, 03:46 PM
#1
Identity the metal thud/bang
mostly. Min1 ~ min3. This is the worst road i have ever driven on and its basicly my testing ground
If my fd can go through the road smooth and not banging all over the place ill be a happy camper. Been at this issue foe the pass 10 months. Help me out
11-17-17, 05:26 PM
#2
Super Moderator
iTrader: (1)
kensin,
It could be the pillow ball bushings but I am no suspension expert. If the rear end doesn't seem firmly planted when you take off then that is another indication that the pillow ball bushings are worn. Had mine changed out and it made a BIG difference. It also got rid of any low speed rubbing/thud/creaking sounds.
Cheers,
George
It could be the pillow ball bushings but I am no suspension expert. If the rear end doesn't seem firmly planted when you take off then that is another indication that the pillow ball bushings are worn. Had mine changed out and it made a BIG difference. It also got rid of any low speed rubbing/thud/creaking sounds.
Cheers,
George
11-17-17, 10:12 PM
#3
Pillow bushings seemed to be the issue that was diagnosed in this thread:
https://www.rx7club.com/3rd-gen-arch...oo-hoo-227949/
Hopefully you can get it diagnosed and fixed!
https://www.rx7club.com/3rd-gen-arch...oo-hoo-227949/
Hopefully you can get it diagnosed and fixed!
11-18-17, 08:42 PM
#5
RX-7 Bad Ass
iTrader: (55)
Cracked power plant frame?
Dale
Dale
11-19-17, 12:54 AM
#6
I have check the ppf and it is solid. Ill throw it on the lift some time this week to have 1 more solid check on EVERYTHING
wish i know what to look for so no time is wasted.
if axles have in and out play would it produce sounds like that ?
to me it sounds like somthing is really loose on the chassis side but im running out of ideas of what it could be. Can front issue transmit/travel to the rear ? I do have a few busted balljoints in the front control arms
wish i know what to look for so no time is wasted.
if axles have in and out play would it produce sounds like that ?
to me it sounds like somthing is really loose on the chassis side but im running out of ideas of what it could be. Can front issue transmit/travel to the rear ? I do have a few busted balljoints in the front control arms
11-19-17, 07:19 AM
#7
RX-7 Bad Ass
iTrader: (55)
If you have access to a lift, that will be the best way to find it. Go through EVERYTHING, shake and pull everything, maybe get a pry bar to pry on things.
Make sure to check the exhaust, if it's banging into something that can cause a problem as well.
Dale
Make sure to check the exhaust, if it's banging into something that can cause a problem as well.
Dale
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11-19-17, 08:31 AM
#8
I'm not seeing anything to indicate the problem is in the rear. Fix what you know is wrong, and see if the problem goes away. Have you checked the rear compartment where jack is? Maybe something is loose in there?
What shocks/springs do you have? Sometimes a very stiff suspension cannot be smooth on a rough road.
Good luck
What shocks/springs do you have? Sometimes a very stiff suspension cannot be smooth on a rough road.
Good luck
Last edited by adam c; 11-19-17 at 08:33 AM.
11-19-17, 09:10 PM
#10
How does the rear end feel? That sounds very echo-y. Sounds like something big is loose. Honestly it sounds like the spare tire is in the well but is not bolted down (although I'm sure that's not it). But something along the lines of the whole rear subframe or gas tank being loose.
11-24-17, 08:14 PM
#11
#include <stdhdr.h>
It sounds a lot like either pillow ***** or bushings to me. Mine is in need of both and it sounds exactly the same. I was under the car a couple weeks ago and found that I could visibly shake the lower right control arm. Definitely shot. Parts were ordered from MazdaComp and arrived last week.
11-24-17, 11:45 PM
#13
This 2 days i been working on front and back again just to double check and with a extra helping hand. We notice the front makes alot of noise aswell.
I proceed to change out my front upper and lower control arm to a set of lower mileage ones with better ball joints. And then the front bearings/hub. To my absolute surprise. The front bearing was pretty shot. It makes clickclack noise and had ton of play when i insert my finger.(no pun inteended lol)
changed them out and immediately notice the front end is so much smoother and my noise has reduced in half. Litteraly. I never suspected the bearings could cause it to bang so hard on bumps and cracks.
If the fronts are this bad i can only imgaine the rears . But so far im not keeping my hopes up cause i dont want to jinx it. If only changing my rear bearings will make the noise/harshness go away.......
I proceed to change out my front upper and lower control arm to a set of lower mileage ones with better ball joints. And then the front bearings/hub. To my absolute surprise. The front bearing was pretty shot. It makes clickclack noise and had ton of play when i insert my finger.(no pun inteended lol)
changed them out and immediately notice the front end is so much smoother and my noise has reduced in half. Litteraly. I never suspected the bearings could cause it to bang so hard on bumps and cracks.
If the fronts are this bad i can only imgaine the rears . But so far im not keeping my hopes up cause i dont want to jinx it. If only changing my rear bearings will make the noise/harshness go away.......
11-25-17, 09:03 AM
#14
The rear bearings are a major PITA to replace. Rule out any other variable (like poly bushings) before you take that on
If you do take it on, I recommend popping out the axle shafts and taking the whole assembly to a machine shop and have them do it
If you do take it on, I recommend popping out the axle shafts and taking the whole assembly to a machine shop and have them do it
Last edited by TomU; 11-25-17 at 09:06 AM.
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kensin (12-01-17)
11-30-17, 11:56 PM
#15
So i have taking care of the exhaust issue. It appears the loud metalic banging that echos was the exhaust hitting on the rear brace and a hanger bolt hitting the diff. Modified both to have bigger clearance and now the metal bangs are gone. The wheel vibration is still present when going over bumpy roads. No clunk noise however. It never has been clunking. The ppf is solid. Tran is solid. Nothing really moves anymore in the back. Still aiming at the rear bearings. But everyone says it is impossible to be it. Ahhhhh
12-01-17, 08:04 AM
#16
RX-7 Bad Ass
iTrader: (55)
Good! I've worked on a few FD's with the exhaust hitting for whatever reason, that will drive you nuts for sure. One of the trans tunnel braces can be installed upside down and backwards and when installed as such it will hit the exhaust big time. That's why Mazda helpfully put an arrow on them showing which way they are supposed to go.
Wheel vibration when going over bumpy roads - are you talking about the wheels on the car or the steering wheel? That's most likely going to be the wheels or tires themselves. Or, if you have aftermarket wheels, if they aren't hub centric that can do some weird stuff. A hub ring can help that out. If you feel the vibration in the steering wheel it's normally something with the front wheels.
Dale
Wheel vibration when going over bumpy roads - are you talking about the wheels on the car or the steering wheel? That's most likely going to be the wheels or tires themselves. Or, if you have aftermarket wheels, if they aren't hub centric that can do some weird stuff. A hub ring can help that out. If you feel the vibration in the steering wheel it's normally something with the front wheels.
Dale
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kensin (12-01-17)
12-01-17, 08:11 AM
#17
Rotary Freak
iTrader: (15)
So i have taking care of the exhaust issue. It appears the loud metalic banging that echos was the exhaust hitting on the rear brace and a hanger bolt hitting the diff. Modified both to have bigger clearance and now the metal bangs are gone. The wheel vibration is still present when going over bumpy roads. No clunk noise however. It never has been clunking. The ppf is solid. Tran is solid. Nothing really moves anymore in the back. Still aiming at the rear bearings. But everyone says it is impossible to be it. Ahhhhh
The following users liked this post:
kensin (12-01-17)
12-01-17, 01:51 PM
#18
Good! I've worked on a few FD's with the exhaust hitting for whatever reason, that will drive you nuts for sure. One of the trans tunnel braces can be installed upside down and backwards and when installed as such it will hit the exhaust big time. That's why Mazda helpfully put an arrow on them showing which way they are supposed to go.
Wheel vibration when going over bumpy roads - are you talking about the wheels on the car or the steering wheel? That's most likely going to be the wheels or tires themselves. Or, if you have aftermarket wheels, if they aren't hub centric that can do some weird stuff. A hub ring can help that out. If you feel the vibration in the steering wheel it's normally something with the front wheels.
Dale
Wheel vibration when going over bumpy roads - are you talking about the wheels on the car or the steering wheel? That's most likely going to be the wheels or tires themselves. Or, if you have aftermarket wheels, if they aren't hub centric that can do some weird stuff. A hub ring can help that out. If you feel the vibration in the steering wheel it's normally something with the front wheels.
Dale
the wheel vibration that i have been experiencing is truly somthing out of this world. With words i cant fully describe it so you ubderstand. I really wish you guys can drive my FD and feel for your self . I have 4 people drive my FD so far and all have said they have never heard or felt somthing like it. 1 shop pionted out that my new J-auto toelink have tiny play when yanked on while on the lift. But its not making any clunking noise like it should be if that was the main culprit . However. Ill change it out to stock ones and retest. The pillow ***** after removing and inspecting. All turn out to be barely moveable and pretty solid. Practically still new. (They are new J-auto pillow).
And its not the steering vibrate. Its the rear wheel it self can be felt like floating/bouncing over peppled bumpy roads.
as for the wheel/tire. Im running new continental extreme contact dws on stock OEM wheels. So nothing out of the ordinary that could make the wheel vibrate. Like if it didnt fit properly. I searched around and came up with new things to check , like the pads floating or brake bracket loose ,even the ebrake locator. Etcetc
will report back
The pillow ***** are new from Jauto and have about 4k miles on them. After pulling the arms off for inspection. They barely move when applied force with my finger. And dosent produce any clunking sound
12-01-17, 01:54 PM
#19
And i might add. The ohlins DFV i have is not fualty. I have them shock dynoed and tested. The specs are exactly like factory and after multiple testing and tuning i had them revalved to a different spec to my liking and driving style. So far only thing left unchecked is bearings brakes.. rotors...and axles.
anyone know how much new oem axle are ? Just curious
anyone know how much new oem axle are ? Just curious
12-01-17, 02:27 PM
#20
RX-7 Bad Ass
iTrader: (55)
Dumb one, your tires aren't over or under inflated, are they? Should be 30-32 psi or so all the way around. Over inflated and it will ride like crap.
From what you are saying I'm leaning towards tires. Even if they are new tires, it could still be the issue. If air pressure is good may be worth finding someone you can swap rims/tires with or someone who has a spare set of rims/tires you can put on to try out.
Dale
From what you are saying I'm leaning towards tires. Even if they are new tires, it could still be the issue. If air pressure is good may be worth finding someone you can swap rims/tires with or someone who has a spare set of rims/tires you can put on to try out.
Dale
12-01-17, 02:40 PM
#21
Dumb one, your tires aren't over or under inflated, are they? Should be 30-32 psi or so all the way around. Over inflated and it will ride like crap.
From what you are saying I'm leaning towards tires. Even if they are new tires, it could still be the issue. If air pressure is good may be worth finding someone you can swap rims/tires with or someone who has a spare set of rims/tires you can put on to try out.
Dale
From what you are saying I'm leaning towards tires. Even if they are new tires, it could still be the issue. If air pressure is good may be worth finding someone you can swap rims/tires with or someone who has a spare set of rims/tires you can put on to try out.
Dale
12-01-17, 02:47 PM
#22
Racecar - Formula 2000
Dumb one, your tires aren't over or under inflated, are they? Should be 30-32 psi or so all the way around. Over inflated and it will ride like crap.
From what you are saying I'm leaning towards tires. Even if they are new tires, it could still be the issue. If air pressure is good may be worth finding someone you can swap rims/tires with or someone who has a spare set of rims/tires you can put on to try out.
Dale
From what you are saying I'm leaning towards tires. Even if they are new tires, it could still be the issue. If air pressure is good may be worth finding someone you can swap rims/tires with or someone who has a spare set of rims/tires you can put on to try out.
Dale
12-02-17, 09:19 AM
#23
Vibration
Have you checked your wheels for balance. You could have lost a weight. Do you need an alignment. I doubt it's tire pressure. How old are the tires? Have they been sitting any length of time? Try a different set of wheels/tires if you can get your hands on some to try (or at least rotate yours if the vibration seems to be coming from one wheel)
Again, it could be your bearings, but i wouldn't start there.
Edit: I see you tried different wheels/tires, so if you are experiencing the same conditions, that can be ruled out. But you may want to double check if the tires are directional and they are mounted correctly if they are. Also, is there any history of frame damage?
Again, it could be your bearings, but i wouldn't start there.
Edit: I see you tried different wheels/tires, so if you are experiencing the same conditions, that can be ruled out. But you may want to double check if the tires are directional and they are mounted correctly if they are. Also, is there any history of frame damage?
Last edited by TomU; 12-02-17 at 11:10 AM.
12-02-17, 09:40 AM
#24
Racecar - Formula 2000
IMO, symptoms do not sound like a balance issue
Most of the time, balance issues are much more noticeable on smooth roads, and at higher speeds. In my experience, bumpy/rough roads seem to drown-out most of the effects of wheel imbalance. Runout can be felt at low speeds. Imbalance is most noticeable at higher speeds, say 60 mph and up.
Vibration is an effect like a tuning fork where the fork's ears are vibrating in resonance. So I'm suspecting a "system" resonance which could be caused by a lack of damping. It could also be caused by spring rates, either in the tires or suspension, being too high for the existing damping to control. Anything weak or flexing where it shouldn't can also cause resonance.
The tire/spring stiffness effect is why I mentioned a pressure gauge error as a source of too-high inflation.
Vibration is an effect like a tuning fork where the fork's ears are vibrating in resonance. So I'm suspecting a "system" resonance which could be caused by a lack of damping. It could also be caused by spring rates, either in the tires or suspension, being too high for the existing damping to control. Anything weak or flexing where it shouldn't can also cause resonance.
The tire/spring stiffness effect is why I mentioned a pressure gauge error as a source of too-high inflation.
12-08-17, 04:14 PM
#25
Have you checked your wheels for balance. You could have lost a weight. Do you need an alignment. I doubt it's tire pressure. How old are the tires? Have they been sitting any length of time? Try a different set of wheels/tires if you can get your hands on some to try (or at least rotate yours if the vibration seems to be coming from one wheel)
Again, it could be your bearings, but i wouldn't start there.
Edit: I see you tried different wheels/tires, so if you are experiencing the same conditions, that can be ruled out. But you may want to double check if the tires are directional and they are mounted correctly if they are. Also, is there any history of frame damage?
Again, it could be your bearings, but i wouldn't start there.
Edit: I see you tried different wheels/tires, so if you are experiencing the same conditions, that can be ruled out. But you may want to double check if the tires are directional and they are mounted correctly if they are. Also, is there any history of frame damage?
Most of the time, balance issues are much more noticeable on smooth roads, and at higher speeds. In my experience, bumpy/rough roads seem to drown-out most of the effects of wheel imbalance. Runout can be felt at low speeds. Imbalance is most noticeable at higher speeds, say 60 mph and up.
Vibration is an effect like a tuning fork where the fork's ears are vibrating in resonance. So I'm suspecting a "system" resonance which could be caused by a lack of damping. It could also be caused by spring rates, either in the tires or suspension, being too high for the existing damping to control. Anything weak or flexing where it shouldn't can also cause resonance.
The tire/spring stiffness effect is why I mentioned a pressure gauge error as a source of too-high inflation.
Vibration is an effect like a tuning fork where the fork's ears are vibrating in resonance. So I'm suspecting a "system" resonance which could be caused by a lack of damping. It could also be caused by spring rates, either in the tires or suspension, being too high for the existing damping to control. Anything weak or flexing where it shouldn't can also cause resonance.
The tire/spring stiffness effect is why I mentioned a pressure gauge error as a source of too-high inflation.
i took a few more proclaimed suspension experts on road test and after i explained everything i have done and triple check , comes down to the very last few things that have not been touch since 94. and 183k miles . axles, bearings
at this point im gonna go ahead and get my hands on a set of axle and test it first.
thanks guy for the advice . i will continue to update this thread as i uncover the problem just for future reference.