extendedwarrantycorp.com won't cover warranty. HELP
 

My 93 FD apex seals are shot according to mazduh dealership. Now my warranty company says they won't cover apex seals. Anyone know of a lawyer who can assist?

WTF do they cover then?

What are the terms of the policy? Look at your contract and see what is covered and what is not. We can't help you w/o seeing the verbage on the contract.

Ask for a copy of you original contract with your signature on it. Try to scan it in so we can read it.

There isnt much we can help with if we cant read the contract

Any consumer fruad lawyer will talk with you about it. Go to a lawyer that works off commission and maybe you'll get a nice chunck of money

STEPHEN

also..remove ALL mods before they inspect the vehicle.

my warrantee company gave me hell but covered many things...til the inspected the vehicle and saw my suspension mods and intake (the degree of my mods at the time) and voided all warrantee. I had to shell out thousands of my own dough because they said I had EXCESSIVE modifications....a racing beat duct and suspension being excessive to them.

if you fight them you should win...id think.

they dont even know what apex seals are...probably...haha

good luck...talk to a lawyer if you have to.


j

All down to your contact... read it carefully. Apex seals are akin to piston rings in a reg. motor. See if those are covered in the language (i've seen some where they list "apex seals in rotary" where they list piston rings).

Its likely apex seals might not even be mentioned specifically, they don't really know what thet are, and they are treating them like a common seal (like a rubber gasket or something).

How are your seals bad? Did they blow? If so then they likely damaged the housings, which would be considered the "block" and that DEFINATELY should be covered. Worst case you get new housings and the labor to take the motor apart. If you have to chock off the $$ for apex seals it wouldn't be SO bad. The key is finding something damaged that will cover the labor to R&R and rebuild.

My warranty tried that same shit on me. I had the mechanic faxed in the diagnostic that said apex seal and explain that it's an internal seal. They hem and hawed so I said, fine, have an independent mechanic make an assessment of it. They finally agreed after the 2nd mechanic said it's the apex seal. This was at a Mazda dealer. Then they wanted to take apart the original motor. I told them the core is $900.00 and do they want to bet against the two experts and pay the core charge? They paid $4000 for the R&R.

BTW, I don't usually get extended warranty but when I bought the car used in 1995, I paid $900 for a 4 year 50K warranty. They paid out approx. $12K on the the warranty. Limit was the value of the car so I had another $5K to go when it ran out. Best deal I ever made.:D :D

i don't think you can get a warranty coverage that cheap any more because of all the claims like pomanferrari's above, they've finally wised up to the expensiveness of warranty claims on FD's. last time i checked it was something outrageous, like around $5K.

I'll try to scan the contract tonight. Thanks for all the advice. I'm just fed up with arguing with freakin idiots (warranty company) that don't understand rotaries.

I got my 12 month 12000 mile warranty for $1100 when I bought the car last december. That was with 85K on it, original motor.

I took it to a mechanic once, b/c my car was blowing white smoke and was hard to start (I thought it was a coolant seal). The mechanic seemed to think it was an apex seal (he knew nothing about rotaries). He called the warranty company and they said they won't cover an apex seal because it is a seal (like a gasket). But I think I could have fought them on that, b/c in my contract it says that the warranty will cover all 'internally lubricated parts'. I never persued the issue, because I know my apex seals are fine, and all I needed was new spark plugs.

inclusive of??
 

I could not scan the contract. Scanner problems. When it rains it pours!!! Here goes. They said, since it does not specifically say "apex seals" in the contract that it's not covered. Sorry it's so long.

• Engine: All internally lubricated parts inclusive of: pistons, and pins, crankshaft and main bearings, connecting rods and bearings, camshaft and bearings, timing chain, rocker arms, shafts and bushings, valves, valve springs, guides and seats, push rods, oil pump; externally: water pump, mechanical and/or electric fuel pump, flywheel, valve covers, engine mounts, intake and exhaust manifolds, distributor shaft, gear, and bushing. (The engine head(s), engine block, gaskets and seals if damaged as a result of failure of covered engine parts.)

• Transmission: All internally lubricated parts contained within an automatic transmission and transfer case inclusive of: clutches, bands, pumps, carrier assemblies, internal shafts, (main, intermediate, reaction), thrust washers and bearings, governor, valve body, servo and accumulator assemblies, torque converter, transmission mounts, case if damaged as a result of failure of covered automatic transmission parts. Internally lubricated parts contained within a manual transmission inclusive of: main shaft, coupler shaft, all gears, synchro hub assemblies, bearings, shift rails and internal shift forks, input shaft synchro rings and retainers, case if damaged as a result of failure of covered components. Internally lubricated parts within the trans-axle of a front wheel drive including ring and pinion gears, internal bearings, axle(s), and case if damaged by covered components.

• Rear wheel drive: Parts contained within the differential housing including ring gear and pinion gears, bearings, differential housing if damaged by failure of internally lubricated parts, axle, universal joints.

• Four-wheel drive: Parts contained within the transfer case; transfer case if damaged by failure of internally lubricated parts.

• Air conditioning, Cooling and Heating: Factory installed compressor, clutch, evaporator, condenser, heater core, blower motor, radiator, fan, and fan pulley.

• Electrical: Starter, starter solenoid, alternator or generator, voltage regulator, windshield washer pump, wiper motors, factory installed antenna motor, trunk lid motor, factory installed sun roof, ignition control module, power seat motor, door window motors, power mirror motors, power locks, speedometer, tachometer, oil pressure gauge, water temperature gauge, convertible top power motor, factory alarm, cruise control: control module, servo/transducer and amplifier.

• Sensors: Manifold pressure/temperature, throttle position, mass air flow, oxygen, coolant temperature, vehicles speed, camshaft/crankshaft angle, wheel speed (ABS), climate control sensors.

• Wear & tear of covered parts providing they exceed the tolerances as set out by the manufacturer.

• Steering: Steering gear, power steering pump, steering column shafts and coupling, rack and pinion.

• Brakes: Master cylinder, vacuum assist booster, ABS wheel sensors, brake calipers, wheel cylinders, compensating valve, brake line tubing and fittings.

• Front Suspension: Upper and lower control arms, control arm shafts, upper and lower ball joints, tie rod ends, constant velocity joints, axle(s), wheel bearings.

** Seals and Gaskets: Engine head(s), exhaust manifold gasket, intake manifold, (valve covers, oil pan, timing cover front and rear main seal and cam shaft if damaged as a result of failure of covered internally lubricated part).

• Labor: Required to repair or replace all parts covered under this warranty agreement, shall be at the industry-accepted flat rate.

• Rental: Extended Auto Warranty Corp. will pay up to $25.00 dollars per day, for a maximum of 4 days, only if the labor time exceeds eight hours on repairs that would be covered under this warranty agreement.

**24/7 Road Service: Towing, Trip Routing, Emergency Transportation, up to 150 miles. (When your car is disabled) Emergency tire, battery, gasoline and lockout service.

Two thoughts,

1. The apex seal is an internal lubricated part. This is a fact and since all internally lubricated parts are covered, this should be covered. It is lubricated by the OMP (whose primary function is to lubricate the apex seal) pumping oil into the intake for the apex seal to pick up and lubricate between the apex seal and the internal wall of the housing. Remember, this is metal on metal that needs lubrication to work properly. Chances are they won't buy this and you would have to fight in court to get this. If they say it is not an internal lubricated part, then the OMP should not be needed and should be removed. Tell them to remove it and see how long an engine runs after that.

2. Prove somehow that the OMP failed, causing the wear of the apex seal to the point of failure, then the components that failed due to that will be covered. Less honest people might find a used bad OMP to replace.

Also, remember the only reason it is called an apex "SEAL" is just because it's function is to seal the compression chamber. The same thing happens with a valve in a piston engine. The valve closes and seals for the compression stroke. They are not called valve seals because the valve seal is a different part. There is no analogous part for the apex seal.

In all reality, what is listed there does not specifically list apex or piston rings and technically should not be covered. Coverage would be based on a lawyer's interpretation.

If the OMP failed and caused the apex seal to fail, I don't think anything would be covered since the OMP is probably not covered. I didn't read the contract so I'm not sure, but thats usually the way it goes.

I'd fight about the apex seal being an internally lubricated part. It is DEFINITELY an internally lubricated part, no question about it.

Read above, the oil pump would be covered, even though this is a separate pump than the main oil pump, they are both oil pumps.


Tim

How about not using the work "apex seal". Dont tell them you have a apex seal crack.

Just tell them your mechanic says that you have low compression.

Fact of the matter is if they stick to what they are saying then they dont warranty rotary engines at all because none of the part listed are in a rotary. They knew you had a rotary engine based on the vehicle and yet they still sold the warranty.......I call that consumer fraud and also acting under false pretense. They knew spacifically what kind of motor you had, sold you a warranty for it they try to say they dont cover the motor that they knew you had in the first place.

In addition to that my interpretation of "• Engine: All internally lubricated parts inclusive of" means that it covers all internally lubricated parts.....including (list of parts). To me if they are including only the parts that are listed they dont need the "All internally lubricated parts" section there. They could have just listed the parts they cover and that be the end of it. This tells me that they are not limited to the parts listed but they are merely there to provide detail and reassurance.

Here is the best advice I can give you.......

STOP CALLING THEM AND GO SEE A CONSUMER FRAUD LAWYER MONDAY!!!!!! You need to find the slickest most greedy lawyer in town and turn him loose. They document everything you say and the more you talk the more you might say something wrong. Open up the yellow pages and find the biggest add then give him a call, make sure he works on commission. You might end up getting enough money to do a 3 rotor swap haha

Good Luck,
STEPHEN

By the way....

The definition of "inclusive of" according to Webster's is this..... including or taking into account.

This means that they warranty all internally lubercated parts INCLUDING xxx parts. NOT only xxx parts. Thier contract is just saying that it includes xxx parts in addition to all internally lubercated parts.

Here is what I would do. Tell them to send you a letter stating its not covered and why. Then head for the lawyer of you choice. The way I see it is they have to cover all internally lubercated parts and I'm sure a lawyer will as well.

*****IF YOU HAVE ANY MODS YOU BETTER TAKE THEM OFF NOW!!!!******
STEPHEN

Hey,

I work at a Car Dealership so I deal with this every day.. You need to go to the dealership you bought it from sit down with the FInance manager im guessing thats who sold it to you, and ask what it goes over and they should be able to tell you if your Shit out of luck or not

Clint

Nothing personal, but I myself do not find anything said by any dealership I've ever dealt with advice that is well informed. I believe there will be a confilct of interest in these matters. They exist to make money from customers and not to alienate any warranty companies they use.

I know it crazy but the only mod I have on this car is a k&n filter. I will go see a lawyer monday. This is crap that they are giving me so much hassle. I would like to get in touch with the sales person who sold me the contract. I heard he left the company. I wonder why? His name is Jim Misener from the Cleveland area Ohio if anyone from the Ohio area knows him please contact me.

Flood them with technical information on the topic. My extended warranty company (Ryan) refused to pay for my tach because they found a wire had been spliced into one of the harnesses under the hood (probably an alarm from the previous owner). I work for an electrical engineering firm, and we sat down with the schematics from the back of the service manual and proved that this spliced wire could not cause the tach to fail.

It would help if you had a letter from your mechanic explaining that the apex seal is the equivalent of a ring in a piston engine. They are also much more receptive to the opinion of a (gulp) dealership.

On a positive note, Ryan Warranty was quite generous with respect to replacing other items, including new turbos, new O2 sensor, the new tach, etc, etc.

These warrantys are very affordable
http://www.extendedautowarrantycorp.com



12 Months - 12,000 Mileage
$499.00
$599.00

24 Months - 24,000 Mileage
$599.00
$699.00

36 Months - 36,000 Mileage
$699.00
$799.00

†
48 Months - 48,000 Mileage
$799.00
$899.00

• †
60 Months - 100,000 Mileage
$899.00
$999.00

• †
72 Months - 125,000 Mileage
$999.00
$1,099.00

those rates seem very good...

Do NOT tell them your OMP failed and that resulted in your apex seals failing. ALL warranty companies have clauses that they will not cover items damaged by the failure of another part. Example, your radiator busts, it leaks coolant, your engine overheats. You now need a new engine but they will only cover the radiator.

Follow the advice of others, hire a lawyer who can send them a threatening letter, this is probably as far as it will go. An apex seal is an internal lubricated part and is an internal engine seal. It is covered under the Engine section you typed in.

Good luck.

I got my car back from a blown apex , and the warranty company covered it. however, the car is in shitty condition, appearance and performance. I am taking it back monday and hope that they will successful at fixing it.

Which company is it? How did you get your warranty company to cover it?