Wolfbeast

Hey guys,

I just got a 3rd gen and found that one of the rotors intermittently has poor compression. This car was a single turbo conversion. The shop I took it to is quoting me 1400 for the labor to take apart and rebuild the motor. This doesn't include any parts. Is this typical for this type of work? I don't have a garage so I can't do it myself.

Also I was looking up rebuild kits. It seems rotary aviation has a kit for $600. Are these parts better than stock? My shop wants to use stock parts.

Thanks for the help in advance

Neil

cptpain

iTrader: (1)

what do you mean intermittently?

RotaryEvolution

iTrader: (30)

probably a fractured seal that is still remaining in the seal slot, it causes erratic compression during cranking and low engine speeds.

as for the labor cost of the rebuild, if that includes engine removal and teardown/rebuild then i'm skeptical, because that is retarded cheap. for a S6 rebuild i charge at minimum $2400 for the stated work, but that includes parts and goes up from there depending on the cause of failure and additional parts cost. it doesn't get much cheaper than that for quality work.

cptpain

iTrader: (1)

you live in Jersey still?

if so give IRP a call, they arent to far away from you

RotoryDreamer

No need for a garage just lay down some plastic and rebuild it in your living room. Just need a friend to help lift the motor out of the car and put it back in.

rx71king

iTrader: (6)

why do you make it sound so easy....?

RotaryEvolution

iTrader: (30)

with all the sharp edges poking holes in the plastic, leaking black oil into the carpet that will never come out, washing rotors in the dishwasher, eating food that smells like gas...

Wolfbeast

Yeah. The price was for labor only. He said they usually charge near 2200 for labor but since mine is single turbo and lots of complicated vacuum lines are gone it's an easier job.

Wolfbeast

I wonder if the motor lift will fit in my buildings elevator.... Hmmm

RotoryDreamer

You make it sound like its a bad thing.

IRPerformance

iTrader: (41)

Call me at the shop and I would be more than happy set you up with a professionally built IRP motor. The first thing that needs to be done is a determinaion of why the motor failed and then an inspection of the internals. A $600 gasket kit WILL NOT include all the necessary parts to properly build a motor. We don't re-use any seals or gaskets and have stricter specs than Mazda. All our motors have a 1 year/12k mile warranty. If you follow our advice during the built and care of the car, you will not break the motor.

732-662-1794
irperformance@live.com

Wolfbeast

Bad news...

so they took apart the motor and found a bunch of problems. The major problem is the eccentric shaft and the rotor bearings are damaged. Basically the cost to repair the motor would be too much so the shop is recommending just replacing the motor. Basically the only things salvageable from the old motor are the housings.

Right now they are quoting me $4500 which includes the following:
1. all the work they have done so far (removing and breaking down the engine)
2. the cost of the new engine (which has mild street port and polish)
3. installation cost of the new engine
4. Tuning to have the car running well.

Is this a reasonable estimate? I am going to look at the damaged parts on Monday and decide about how to proceed but it seems like I have little choice here. I could take the motor to another shop but I don't know if i'll get a different story.

I have attached pictures of the damage. Let me know what you guys think!

Thanks

Wolfbeast

more pics... basically they found shavings of the front rotor bearing in the housing and damage to the front rotor.

G's 3rd Gen

iTrader: (11)

Hopefully it works out for you. IRP is the number 1 shop in your area. Good luck. G

potatochobit

iTrader: (1)

its fine, my engine cost over 6000 and I had a reman installed
I also had the fly wheel changed and a few other little things
keep in mind other things might need replacing as well, such as motor mounts, etc.

IRPerformance

iTrader: (41)

Looks like you had an oiling issue. The rotor face contacted the side plate. That entire motor is most likely trashed. The iron plates have severe wear. How are the rotor housings? There will most likely be metal in the oil pan, oil passages, and also the oil lines and coolers. You will need to flush everything. Did the bearing spin? Hard to tell from the pics. Damage like this doesn't just happen by itself and is most likely related to errors made during the previous build. Although everyone is eager to get a deal, I can assure you that for the prices you are being quoted you are not getting a new engine and nothing in the engine bay is being replaced.

MOBEONER

iTrader: (18)

What's the shops name?

IRPerformance

iTrader: (41)

I'm curous as well. The type of work I see come out of some places and that I have to keep fixing is disgusting

RotaryEvolution

iTrader: (30)

the rotors should be reusable unless the bearings were spun severely, a small amount of corner surface contact does not render a rotor unusable.

the irons may be able to be lapped, but that depends on the extent of the wear.

yes it does appear to be a lubrication issue, or lack thereof. something failed, such as a torn oil cooler line, punched oil pan which cut off circulation to the pickup, low oil level or blockage in the system somewhere.

$4500 is excessive considering you do still have a handful of good parts to work with.

Wolfbeast

Thanks for the input guys. The original work was done by Acosta. I have heard they do crap work. If i had known maybe i would have skipped this car. But anyway, I purchased the car from the PO and then found the compression issue. The car is being worked on by T and R racing in queens. I picked the shop because it is close by and I have seen some good feedback. So far my interactions with Tony have been good. The prices he has quoted have been resonable.

To answer your questions, the rotor housings are in reusable shape. The rotors themselves are salvageable but the bearings are spun and need replacement. They also said the Eccentric shaft is damaged. Tony thinks it would be more expensive and complicated to rebuild so he wants to just replace the engine. The engine they want to use has been built recently but has not been in a car yet.

Other than flushing all the oil lines and coolers is there anything else I should ask them to do? Also are there other things I should replace since the engine will be out of the car? Flywheel, clutch, motor mounts?

Thanks again for the input.

RotaryEvolution

iTrader: (30)

ask them for input, they should already know the condition of the parts since they have the motor out. replacing mounts, clutch, resurfacing flywheel etc is a waste if it was all just done.

IRPerformance

iTrader: (41)

The rotor is destroyed. Look at the side seal. Chances are you will not be able to get it out and if you do you won't be able to clearance the rotor properly. Do the job right or you will be in the same boat all over again.

IRPerformance

iTrader: (41)

Depends on what was done periously. Considering where the car was worked on previously, I guarantee the engine bay needs much attention.

RotaryEvolution

iTrader: (30)

if that's considered destroyed, i'll pay for shipping to take it off your hands. i'm sure the irons are pretty well destroyed though.

removing stuck side seals and re-clearancing isn't an issue if you know how.

IRPerformance

iTrader: (41)

Different people have different standards. We NEVER use subpar parts. I would rather turn the work away. Used rotors in good condition are easy enough to come by that its not worth the time. I would have to see the rotor in person but judging from the pics it looks pretty bad.