Spring time tune-up
 

OK so I got a 90 RX7 Vert from the original owner last July and spent all fall and winter usin' and abusin' her.
I went through a set of brand new kumho solus' on the rear in about 10k miles and they are B A L D. I love my car and plan on keeping her for quite a while

It's time to show her some love though and start piecing her back together. I went to a shop here locally that gas a great reputation for working on Mazda's. The owner has been working on them for 35 years now. He's supposed to be the Rotary authority in the area and pretty much the best guy to go around. They have a reputation for being expensive though so I thought I might try and get a little feedback on the prices they shot me to see if I should go somewhere else or if they were givin' me a good deal.

I'll just list what they say the car needs and the prices they gave me.

1. Spark plugs - $118.50 installed
2. Fuel filter $83 installed
3. Front brake pads - $165 installed
4. Oil Pressure Sending switch is leaking - $145 installed
5. Replace the fuel dampener - approx $200
6. ?Rear transmission seal? - $185
7. Brake fluids flushed and replaced - $182
8. Clutch fluids " " - $58
9. Shifter bushing replacement (clamshell to eliminate play in shifter) - $95
10. Loose door handles - $70 to have them repaired

120 bucks to install spark plugs?! wow

run far far away

where is the "Do it my damn self and save butt loads of $$$" option? seriously $83 to replace the fuel filter? that's like a $10-15 part and takes at most 30mins to swap out. which mean this guy is charging around $140 an hour in labor?

EDIT: I don't see anything on this list you couldn't do in your own garage this weekend.

spark plugs are like a 25 dollar part...

I would buy you spark plugs and install them for a total of $80 :lol: Seriously, i would never go to this place your talking about.

Holy crap. Most of that stuff can be easily done by anyone in a day for literally hundreds of dollars less.

i say DIY. plugs are easy.. id never pay someone to do them for me.
and fuel filter, brake pads. all too easy..

i say run far away

Some of those numbers are close to average if you look up the book time and assume an industry standard labor rate and part markup. Others are a little high. For example, the spark plug quote isn't as bad as it sounds.

https://www.rx7club.com/attachment.p...1&d=1269043230

At .8 labor hours and an $80/hour shop rate, that's $64 in labor. Then each plug is $7 or $8 if a normal person bought it at a parts store. But there's going to be a shop markup of at least 20%. So let's say $9 a plug or $36. That puts you at $100 before tax. The pulsation dampener quote isn't bad at all, the tech will probably have to do a vac job. Some of the other jobs are a little high, but nothing outrageous.

half an hour of labor according to Alldata. Assuming an industry standard shop markup on the part that's only a little high.

I don't think you guys realize how much regular people pay every day to have their car worked on at a shop. The independent shops need to charge at least $70-$80 per hour just to keep the lights on and pay the technician. Whichever tech does that pulsation dampener for example could easily lose money on the job if the car is being difficult. And part mark-ups are normal. Do you have any idea how much mark-up is on products bought in retail electronics stores for example?

To the OP, if you want cheaper then find a trustworthy shadetree or a professional who is looking for side jobs.

go to auto zone and get the rx7 manual and a good set of tools and save thousands the rest of your life. and call a friend or someone who has done te work before to give you a hand if you get stuck.

Wow, thanks for all the responses guys!

I would really love to do the work myself, how ever. I have no tools....no experience working on cars, no garage, no idea where to get the parts, basically I have nothing but the car.
WHICH I LOVE!!!
I've grown up with racing, from my go-cart I've been driving since I was 8 to the dirt track my father an I used to go to every weekend and ESPECIALLY the Supra my Mom's old BF used to have. XD

My car (Roxy) has ignited my passion for driving. It makes me feel alive......I'm gonna stop now before I get to sappy though....LOL

So, after all this input, I was thinkin' maybe I just have the shop fix the tranny seals, flush the fluids and replace the shifter bushings?

How big of a task would it be to replace the OPS switch?

You can do the oil pressure switch, fuel filter, and spark plugs in about an hour...they're all in the same area.

Spark plug varies...some are 5/8", some are 3/4".
You need a 9/16" or 14mm wrench for the oil pressure sender. It's a PITA to get to and you have to take it out in like 1/8 turns, but it does come out easy enough.
You'll need a 10mm open end wrench for the fuel filter, as well as a pair of standard pliers and it would be a good idea of replace your fuel line to and from it.

The prices the shop quoted you aren't really bad...most of us here think they're horrible because we ourselves would not pay to have done what we could so simply do.

My suggestion to you is to go to Harbor Freight with $75 and buy these items (or something similar):

http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/cta...emnumber=36648
http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/cta...emnumber=40582
http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/cta...temnumber=1793

Also download the FSRM here:

https://www.rx7club.com/showthread.p...18#post5131218

That should cover all your needs. Also look at aaroncake's website (http://www.aaroncake.net/RX-7/) for a lot of good info.

If anyone knows of any other tools he should have, please post up.

not sure if you listed it but a torq wrench comes in handy and i saw one at harbor frieght yesterday for 25 bucks.

Shifter bushings are easy, 3 bolts and can be done sitting in the drivers seat.

http://www.mazdatrix.com/faq/ssinstal.htm

This should give you an idea of what needs to be done, even though it is a short shifter install.

Seriously, just spend about 1/4 of the labor charge they were going to rape you with on tools at harbor freight and you'll have everything you need.

There are plenty of threads (many w/ pictures) and forum members that can help (some might even come help you if you're close). Between that and a Haynes manual you can knock out everything on that list....the only thing i might let the shop do is the trans seal and door handles (and unless the bold is just loose, I'm interested to know how they plan on doing that)

Geez, $50 just for an inspection.....these guys certainly don't miss a chance to get paid. Hopefully going to get a straight pipe exhaust on today.

=D

Now what you need to do is download the factory service manual and make a little trip down to walmart and pick up a nice stanley Mechanic Set for less then 50 then go over to advace auto/napa/auto zone/car quest/what ever your local parts store is called and pick up plugs, wires, and filter and start learning the basic's since the 7 is a black hole to the normal man's wallet(really its worse then a GF/wife/kids at times) and learn to do most basic stuff on your on.

Decided to do a tune-up first. Ordered some plugs, brake pads, fuel filter and an OPS switch. Everything should be in on Thurs. by the latest hopefully.

I hope you're not too attached to your hearing, and you better hope that all the police are on vacation every time you go for a drive. :lol:

^Ditto. I want a louder car but it's so hard to find a compromise between "stock" and "747 on take off" with the rotary.

Ehh...I figure I'd rather be deaf than blind...you can't rightly drive blind and all but not being able to hear, well that's just one less distraction from the road
+
Everybody'll be able to hear me comin' so to know to get the hell outta mah way!

Seriously though...like without even mufflers, just chrome tip straight pipes, how loud we talkin' bout? :scratch:

...at idle.

Anybody wanna point me in the direction of where I might be able to learn how to put this stuff on Roxy?

Those prices are pretty much in line with typical dealership pricing. The pulsation damper price is too low, as the part alone retails more than $200.

I recommend the Haynes manual for noobs because it has pictures and is written for noobs. The FSM is a good companion.

I have been very happy with my Falken Ziex ZE-912 tires on my 88 convertible. They work well in the rain and have a good tread wear rating, and they even autocross fairly well for an H-rated tire (top rated cheapie tire by Grassroots Motorsports). I hear they don't work so great in the snow, but I keep my car in the garage when snow is on the ground and let my F-150 deal with the road salt. If you are really serious about autocrossing, then you would obviously want performance tires rather than touring tires like this. For me, I would rather eat a few seconds of time during an autocross rather than eat a set of tires every 10 months.
http://www.discounttire.com/dtcs/tir...%2FPerformance

Really bad idea.

Be sure to initially install them by hand, and just use tools for the final tightening.

This could be a problem if the rotor is corroded to the hub. If the rotors come off easily, then just take them down to your local brake shop and have them turn the rotors (usually under $10 each). You may want to write down the minimum thickness so the shop can let you know if you need rotors. If you do need new rotors, then I recommend the Brembo blanks from Tire Rack.

Before changing the pads, you may want to pick up some grease for the caliper bolts. Also check the condition of the W-springs, brake pin retaining springs, and backing plates, which you can buy from your local generic auto parts store.

You should have the shop perform these two.

I like using ATE Super Blue brake fluid because you know when you have flushed all the fluid because it turns from amber to blue. Plus, ATE makes excellent fluid that is good for both street and racing use. Once I need to replace the blue fluid after 2-3 years, I use the cheaper Castrol LMA which is amber and nearly as good as the ATE Typ 200.
http://www.tirerack.com/brakes/acces...tail.jsp?ID=21

You probably just have some loose backing nuts. If you take off the interior panel of the door, you can reach the nuts with a socket extension. There are two nuts per door handle, and if I remember correctly you need to have the window up to get to one of them, and the window down to get to the other. Be careful removing the triangle-shaped plastic piece by the mirror. You can buy an interior removal tool that will help with this and other interior parts. It looks like a screwdriver with a forked end. You only need one, and you can get it at your local auto parts store:
http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/cta...emnumber=66188

He can use cheaper regular chrome sockets as opposed to those impact sockets, although that isn't a bad price for impact sockets. I prefer to spend more money on good tools like Craftsman, Snap-on, or SK, but I have more money and less patience than most of the members of this forum.

Here are some good tools to have for an RX-7:
- 3/8" ratchet and metric sockets, including 8mm, 10mm, 12mm, 14mm
- 3/8" spark plug socket
- 3/8" extension, 6" long or so
- 1/2" ratchet and metric sockets, including 17mm, 21mm, 23mm, 24mm
- 1/2" 1 1/4" socket if you plan on removing the hub nuts
- 1/2" extension, 2 to 8"
- 1/2" drive to 3/8" socket adapter
- 1/2" breaker bar
- 1/2" click-type torque wrench, range 30-175 ft-lbs is good, 20-250 ft-lbs is better.
- Metric open-end or combo wrench set, 8mm, 10mm, 12mm, 14mm, 17mm
- Multi-bit screwdriver set
- Really big, stout, #3 Phillips screwdriver for the brake rotor assembly screws

I think that pretty much covers it. Does anybody recall if there are any 15mm or 19mm bolts? I can't think of any off hand.

I have both a 15mm and a 19mm socket in my RX-7 tool box...including a 24mm and a great big bastard...I think for the flywheel nut. I've used them on the seven but it's been 8 years or so, so I don't remember where.

I suggested the impact sockets because they're made better...the standard cheap chrome stuff from Hf tends to be a bit brittle. Snap-on would be better, and is my preference, but you can get the job done with cheaper tools.

Got my fuel filter replaced....it was a total bitch. I ended up having to remove the bracket just to tap the fuel filter out. Got my plugs installed too, already noticed a difference in performance. =D
Sooo...I cut off my remaining muffler.
Sounds pretty good....gonna get a single straight pipe 2" exhaust with a cherry bomb on Monday morning.
After that gonna get the fluids flsuhed and the rear tranny seal replaced and the loose shifter fixed.

Gonna tackle the door handles after that.

Then HOPEFULLY gonna get some Goodyear Eagle GT's wrapped around those BBS 15's

Racing beat springs and sway bars and the front suspension lowering mounts down the road hopefully

Any body got some turbo 16's they need to get rid of?

The cherry bomb isn't going to work. You need a muffler intended for use with rotary engines, which would include those from Racing Beat, Mazdatrix, Apexi, Rotary Performance, GReddy, and HKS. The rotary shop should have told you this.

You may want to check this forum about that tire choice. Granted it was some time ago when I used them, but Eagle GTs were the worst tires I have ever owned in the 26 years that I have driven cars. I am really happy with the Ziex ZE-912 tires that I have on my convertible, as they are excellent long-wear cheapie tires for autocrossing and wet/dry daily driving. If you are really concerned about performance, the guys in the Racing forum can help you choose some racing tires.

Everybody seems to like that setup pretty well.

It's not that you have to have a muffler made for a rotary...it's just that a "cherry bomb" will sound like ass. It sounds stupid but you need the biggest damned muffler you can find. Not biggest outlet or inlet...the muffler just has to be huge.

Also corksport has a very nice exhaust system, IMO.


I know its been said in like every post already but...$120 to install spark plugs... :jerkit:

Sounds like exactly what I'm looking for, would I have to order them online or do you know of a chain that carries them?

Why do I need such a big muffler for it to sound good?


The engine was replaced in the car around 65k miles according to the original owner and the car now has around 104k miles. He told me he had been running Mobil 1 full syn in the car ever since he had the engine replaced, I've heard that this is really bad for rotary engines . I've also heard horror stories from people who switched from using conventional oil to full syn and vice-versa SO I too have continued to put Mobil 1 in her. I don't want to continue to do this for multiple reasons, the main one being that Syn oil is so damned expensive. Any ideas on how I should go about switching over or what type of oil to switch too?

The nature of the rotary engine is loud. Very, very loud. The breathing of the engine is very simple and a lot of the noise other engines absorb goes straight into the exhaust. You need a voluminous muffler to contain that noise.

Just to give you an idea of what you need to keep noise down I'm looking at using a Flowmaster 44 series 2.25 in dual 2.25 out as a pre-silencer and two 40 series 2.25 mufflers at the ends.

I bought mine from http://www.discounttiredirect.com which I listed in my first post in this thread. ;)
I think they are a good match for a convertible that will mostly just cruise around town, but maybe take a few sharp turns here and there. I think they work fairly well for autocrossing, but the side wall isn't as stiff as a high-performance racing tire, and they do heat up pretty fast so 10-lap track events are definitely out. The tires held their grip extremely well on the tight mountain twists at Deals Gap last year.

It's not that you need a big muffler, it's that you need a GOOD muffler. Those little mufflers that only have an inch of gas expansion space and/or a thin layer of fiberglass packing aren't going to cut it. Also, the muffler case needs to be made out of thicker metal, otherwise the noise goes right through the case and makes a horrible "tinny" sound. Another problem is that the rotary engine's exhaust is very powerful and hot, which will blow apart or melt a low-quality muffler that may work OK on a V-8 engine.

Also, stay away from "turbo" mufflers if you have a non-turbo engine. Turbo mufflers are named as such because they do not need to work quite as well because the turbine soaks up a lot of noise, heat, and pressure. Turbo mufflers will tend to have larger piping, which really increases the noise on non-turbo engines. I wouldn't recommend any tips larger than 90mm (3.5") for a non-turbo street car.

The synthetic / petroleum-based oil switching problem existed 30 years ago, but now nearly every modern synthetic motor oil is fully compatible with petroleum-based oil. There isn't any reason to use expensive synthetic engine oil on a street car, although it does offer an advantage for race cars. If you are looking for a good petroleum-based engine oil, Castrol GTX works very well in rotary engines. The transmission and differential in our cars do tend to work better with synthetic oil, which is more cost-effective in these components since it has a much longer drain interval than the engine.

Yes, and Borla, and many others that I forgot to mention. The point is that it is better to stick with something that will work rather than trying to cheap-out and get something that will soon fail and need to be replaced at a higher cost than buying something good in the first place.

Flowmaster does not recommend their mufflers for rotary engines, and as such they will not honor their warranty. For those who have tried using Flowmasters anyway, they have lasted anywhere between a few minutes and a few weeks on high-output NA 13B engines which will blow the internal baffles off their spot welds. I would imagine that they would work OK on a turbocharged engine or a stock non-turbo engine that is in bad health, but there are so many good mufflers on the market that I don't see much point in bothering with the cheaply-made Flowmasters.

:)

I'm aware of Flowmaster's suggestions and I doubt I'll be looking for any warranty claims. On a straight exhaust from a high-output engine yeah it's a bad idea. I'm not after real performance with this car, plus I leave for work early in the morning and I really like my neighbors...I just want it to have a meaner growl. With both the pre-cats and stock porting I don't foresee any problems. Even if I do destroy the mufflers, though, I'm not out anything except some tubing (free mufflers).

My example was more about the size of the mufflers...because they have the volume needed to handle the rotary's noise and are made from heavy steel.

Holy Shit...all I read was spark plugs for $118.50 and voted lol. Your face must have shown complete desperation to get those prices thrown at you...and from a rotary expert?? Get yourself a decent tool set and make good friends with the search function.

Wow....sorry, didn't realize this thread was about a week old already lol. Good to know your doing your own work by the way.

I like loud...If it's too loud you're too old as they say.
Right now I'm runnin' the car with both tailpipes cut off...it's interesting to say the least.

Is it normal to hear the tranny whine in the cab while I'm driving? Cause it's cool


.....oh geez.....I just scrolled down the home page past 2nd Gen specific for the first time.....:uh:

well if you like loud you're in the right place :lol: I'm running open downpipe till I can get my Borla XR-1 welded in as a midpipe for my RB system.

Yes, FC tranny's like to ..."talk".
Mine has had a slight whine to it since day one and there are no grinds or problems shifting. I've changed the fluid twice and never noticed any metal shavings either. Kinda sounds like the race trans from Forza, but ya know what they say "if you can here your transmission, your turbo isn't spooling hard enough or your exhaust is too quite"...

I do work on my own car because it's so easy being a mechanic and having tools and knowledge, but most importantly I don't really trust my car with many other people. I'd have to at least know my mechanic well and see his work, but yea I think if you do your own work you can do a better job and do things right. gl.

Weelllll, it's been a while, but I still have my car,albeit it has since broken down. I am pretty sure I completely destroyed the manual transmission. I am betting it got really dry in there.

However, in the time since, I have gotten into an automotive school, job corps to be more specific and have spent the past 2 1/2 years training to be a technician. No experience with rotary vehicles unfortunately but I have had the chance to get my hands dirty enough to where I won't just be jumping in blind once I start working on my car. After nearly three years of heartbroken sitting and being started up occasionally I will be getting to work on restoring my 90 Vert. She still runs fine with no rust to be found but I plan to go through and replace just about everything else and ultimately doing a mild street port as the final modification.

106k on the frame
Engine swapped at 65k
Replacing the factory 5spd unit with one I got from a man on here that he pulled out of another vert he was doing a turbo swap on.
Only other mods currently are an aftermarket intake and a cat-delete exhaust with a 2 1/2 inch straight pipe going out to a single 12 inch Cherry Bomb.

The cherry bomb exhaust us a bit on the loud side. Outside the car its not bad but inside its annoying at cruising speed.

Yeah, it is loud, I like it that way though. I plan to use the car mostly just for cruises once I get it fixed up. I have a lot of plans for it all the way around the car, mostly subtle tweaks to make it more to my tastes.

I got used transmission for the car and I have purchased new front and rear seals, a new rear main engine seal, pilot and throwout bearing and seal, OEM clutch disc, tail shaft bushing, rubber shift boots and leather shift boot for the interior. Any pointers on install.

Do I need to get pads for four piston calipers or the single piston?

Would it be worthwhile to go with better fluids, i.e. engine oil, coolant, brake, trans. and gear oil, power steering fluid or just get the cheap napa brand stuff? This is going to be my daily driver.

Is seafoam okay to run through the engine?