Looking into an FC Project
 

I'm from south Mississippi and I'm thinking about buying a 1988-1990 FC NA. Some of them go for around $2000-$2500 but the nice looking ones that are low miles or freshly rebuilt are no less than $3500. I understand what I'm getting into with buying a 30 year old car and I'm going to encounter issues. If I buy one with higher miles I'm probably going to put fresh apex seals just for peace of mind. Just looking for a second opinion and looking for good places to get parts for FC's cause I cant seem to find any.

If the engine runs OK, I'd leave it alone and concentrate on the chassis (meaning everything but the drivetrain).
Suspension, brakes, cooling and electrical are higher priorities if the motor works..

Mazdatrix, Atkins...there are several places to source engine hard parts (and don't forget Rock Auto) but electrical- especially the switchgear- can be expensive and elusive.
Junkyards used to be fertile ground but at least in Denver, supply has dried up.

IMO, if you're buying a NA, just abandon from the beginning the idea that you'll eventually make it fast.
You will not.
You can make it more fun with stuff like a light flywheel and header, but if you want fast, just start with a turbo and be done.
The NA is a GT car and a great highway bomber but Civics will suck the headlights off a FC and there's no point in worrying about it.

With the term "Project" I have all intentions of turbocharging at some point but chassis and body mods are important to me to make it look nice if it doesn't look good its not worth the steel its made of. But I'm looking for stuff like exhaust kits. If I do buy one new performance rotors and calipers asap.And of course cooling always needs to stay in my mind because all engines are not exactly a cold thing.

As you've stated that you intend to go turbo, you should heed Clokker's words and buy a Turbo II right off the bat. There are no longer any commercially available turbo kits for our cars, and the ones that were made were in very short supply. You will have lots of trouble finding one. The most popular way to "turbocharge" the car is to just buy a Turbo Rx7 engine and swap it in.

Now turbocharging the N/A engine (as in, still using the N/A engine block) has been done before and in a variety of different ways, but they are all more expensive, more difficult, and the results may not be desirable to you due to differences in port area and power delivery. I suggest that you do some reading in the FAQ for the 2nd Gen section, and read up on the different options available to you. I only suggest taking this route if you are sure you want a project, and are willing to put in lots of time acquiring or making parts. And then depending on how much power you want to make, you need to buy some or all of the Turbo drivetrain to support it.

Thanks for the info this issue for me is the avalability of Turbo II's on the market. Everything for sale near me is NA which is awful. but there is some chick selling her husbands car which is a bright purple turbo charged FC For $8k

I recently answered the "Turbo an NA" question, and it seems like a post like this happens at least once a week.

Just buy a Turbo 2. Never expect to make an NA fast, as clokker has said. It's not worth the time, effort, money, etc. You are much better off starting as close to your end goal as possible. This answer will get parroted around, because we all have been there. I'm in the middle of a swap and I regret it entirely. It always becomes a game of "just one more thing". Eventually, I went from having a running, driving car, and now I'm into a full frame restoration. If you want an NA, fine. keep it that way and drive it and have fun. If you want a project, expect it to take years, not months. And if you hate money that much, go for a full turbo swap. Your wallet will hate you.

I noticed you said "performance rotors and calipers" too. The GXL, GTU, and Turbo all came with 4 piston calipers front and vented rear rotors. There really is not much better aside from spending big dollars on a Brembo setup (that you have to custom make mounts and adapters for). The stock brakes are fine and are adequate for anything up to track use. eage8 uses stock base brakes and locks up 315 Hoosiers on all four corners. Granted, he has high quality pads, but the point still remains.

Also, "putting in fresh apex seals" is about $1000 for just the gasket and seal kit alone. That's not counting, fluids, time, random broken parts, etc you will encounter. Do some more research. Seriously. Research the hell outta this, because too many thread are started up about wanting to turbo an NA and it usually doesn't work out. The most successful NA projects usually stay NA. NA LS1 V8, that is.

Thanks for the reply. I was fed some misinformation about the NA. Thanks for giving me some clarity.

Its worth noting that Turblown still do a manifold and turbo kit for the RX7 FC.

But to install you will need a comprehensive list of supporting mods including but not limited to Stand alone ECU, upgraded radiator, oil + water feeds and return for the turbo, exhaust to fit downpipe of turbo kit, sensors to suit ECU, Wideband, Turbo gearbox + driveshaft + diff + driveshafts, mapping for said ECU, that's just off the top of my head.

Look at Aaron Cakes blog, to see the work involved in doing it properly.

I'm with the buy a Turbo II people. Make sure it's a true Turbo II and not an NA that's been converted. Check VIN number and evidence of a swap (harness, etc.).

This coming from an NA owner. Yes, you can do many things, and some will tell you it's not that much work, but the general consensus is the above. Unless you love to fabricate and like things getting complicated.

For example: Did you know that the Turbo models use different (lower compression) rotors?

Tip of the iceberg there, too.

-Different transmission, trans mount, prop shaft.
-Different Diff and Axles (axles are shorter and thicker)
-Different cluster, wiring, ECU, etc
-Different sensors (MAP, MAF, TPS, etc)

Also, don't do what I did and buy an auto chassis. The mounts on the body are different from the manual bodies, so getting a mount to just bolt up is a pain. Xcessive Manufacturing saved the day for me there, but that's again, just the tip of the proverbial iceberg.


We are not trying to scare you, just inform you about the best course of action that will lead to years of satisfaction.

To be fair, it's also worth noting that you'll be doing all of the above as soon as you venture from the stock turbo setup, as well.

It's a forum cliche but I'll take one for the team...when you buy your "project FC", what do you think you're getting and what use will you put it to?

I know that it will be work and i know that it will be more than decent chunk of change,but that's where i have fun ,a challenge. As far as what i would do with it is depending on how things go and what package i can find locally. I would love to turn it it to a drag track/track car but i don't like the Idea of putting a LS V8 in there. If I can find a old Turbo II i would be happy because i would have to try and source as many parts but if i can't it will take a bit longer to reach my intended goal

Edit:When i say Drag track i don't mean a sub 10s beast i just mean something that's different and fun. I just want something that on Sundays i can go to the track and just have some fun without people trying to race for tons of money/cars. (our local track does stock/decent modification cars on Sundays)

Thanks for the tip about the auto chassis. And being as i know the effort it would take to convert my current car from SC To TC i kinda figured it would be about like that

Well that's fine but the V-8 engine swap is unquestionably the fastest, easiest and most efficient way to get power in a FC chassis.
Just sayin...

I know its the best way to make power I just like the idea of a half decent rotary too much.

Or any car to be fair.

Without question looking at my car history the cheapest way for more power has always been just to buy a more powerful car.

Very true also. And then there's the time invested. I don't know how much time you have free with school, but this hobby can be a terrible distraction from school. Well, that, and girls, and part time jobs LOL! Personal experience.

If it seems like we're trying to give you fatherly advice, and you already have enough of that, just skip this part. It's just that I for one have made a few mistakes in life, and don't like to see others heading the same way.

We all love the idea of a good rotary engine. That's why we are here, but experience eventually prevails and teaches us that stock NAs last forever. Swaps are a waste of money and time. And good running turbo cars seem to be a rare breed. You almost never, if ever, hear a V8 guy say "This was a bad idea and I want my 13B back"

you won't find any either. i'm in the autoparts business, and pretty much the entire business is focused on 1995 and newer car. secondly, and maybe more importantly, the FC basically doesn't share any other parts with any other cars, so the only source in the first place is Mazda only, they still have an amazing amount of stuff for these cars.

if you're a little resourceful there are all kinds of good bits sitting around and can be had inexpensively.

part two is that, just as a car the non turbo FC is really fun, its just that everything else is so fast now, its really been overshadowed.

if you must do a turbo swap, all the turbo stuff is a bolt in, although a lot of the car is different.

You can do turbo swaps fairly inexpensively still, driving it with the NA in the interim while you gather what you need.. but it can take a few years to get everything at a rockin deal that results in it being reasonably inexpensive. It really will come down to how patient you are. It also will come down to what you're willing to get yourself into to achieve an end goal. If you are certain a stock turbo setup will be enough for you, and don't plan to beat the car like a red headed step child all the time (burnouts, full throttle standing starts, clutch kicking, etc).. then contrary to what you will mostly read on this forum, the NA driveline can handle stock-ish turbo power levels just fine. I drive mine hard, but reasonably so.. it's not caused any failures. My car was originally an auto and converted before I bought it.. still has the auto LSD rear end.

However...

I can almost guarantee you that you will want more power.. at that point things will start getting very expensive because you will need the turbo driveline and other supporting mods that you didn't already apply when you were simply upgrading from NA to mildly modified turbo.

As has been said, the GRAS (generally recognized as safe) method is to start with a turbo chassis.

That being said, I do not have a single regret about my swap and would recommend it to anyone as crazy as myself given the proper understanding of reality. :hitit: