Ok so I got lost in this thread lol.

So if I were to hybrid my S5 turbo, using this online site: http://turbocharged.com/main.htm exactly what parts would I need to get say building a turbo to put me in the 300whp range?

 

anybody know a place to buy a p-trim wheel? Is it just a regular shaft size?

I took off my BNR stage 4 when the oil seal went and started to smoke. Took it apart for the first time and damn turbine wheel is chewed up like crazy from when I blew my engine last year. Since then I havent taken it apart until this week when I was going to rebuild it.



The turbo felt great on highway runs but I need a little bit more response so I am trying to go with an unclipped p-trim and a S5 turbine (have the S4 turbine).

I was thinking of going with a stock S5 turbine with the 60-1 wheel that comes with the BNR stage 4. Wanted some mid range power for a change lol, but I am wondering how much of a hinder it will be for top end.

 

^^^ Good question.
I'm contemplating something similar as I have a to4 w/ chewed up comp wheel (which I will replace w/ a 60-1) and a decent condition p trim turbine wheel. However the more I looked into it, that combo seems more laggy than what I'm looking for. So I was thinking of going for a stage 3 using a stock s5 turbine wheel (unsure on whether to clip or not). Can't seem to find too much info on how they spool though...

 

Question; I have a couple of spare s-5 turbos and a to4b with a 6.0 compressor that measures like an s trim. would this be worth the time? I have a s4 with the s5 manifold, a good street port going in a 1400lb "7" am planning on using the haltech e6x that i have. It looks to me like the s trim would be a mild upgrade and real cheap since all that i need is a balance.

 

that's some low buck baller status right there! love the internet!

 

OK.. anybody tried a new turbine wheel assembly ?
im running short on straight ht18s turbine wheels
closest i can find is a t3 turbonetics stage 2 wheel ( in parenthisis )
which i rather suspect is actually TA34 turbine shaft wheel 451311-0002

specs -
Inducer Diameter (mm): 65.0mm ( 64.98 )
Exducer Diameter (mm): 53.9mm ( 53.8 )
Tip Height (mm): 9.35mm
Journal Bearing Diameter (mm): 10.2
Comp Wheel Bore (mm): 6.3
Number of Blades: 11

compared to the ht18s-2s turbine wheel which is 54.2 mm exducer , 63.5 mm inducer and 9.35mm tips

looks like it may fit .. any takers ??

 

inducer might rub against the turbine housing wont it if it is a tad bit bigger.

I also tried looking for a replacement turbine to fit the stock turbine housing and came up with the same conclusion as you did with the stage 2 wheel or the Turbonetics F1 turbines, specifically the F1-54, which is 54 exducer and 68 inducer

 

Hold on to that thought Bumpstart. I may have an answer for you, as I bought a hybrid turbo a few years back with a turbine wheel that didn't quite match up to the stock HT18 turbine. As I recall, the specs came out to what appeared to be a TA34, and it fit in every exhaust housing I tried. I believe the TA34 inducer blade tips are a few mm longer at the ends though, but it fit. I'll take a look when I get back home today.

 

gpopshop will mill your turbine to fit whatever you want for $100 i believe.

my thoughts..

i think p-trim is too laggy for me, even though it gets 15 psi by 3500. a friend was running the factory wheel on a hybrid (not sure what comp wheel he was using), and he said he was hitting 15psi by 2800 rpm. he said he could light up the tires from a 2nd gear roll, which my p-trim could not do, but had more top end. I tried the same, with a 60-1 on a factory wheel and it wasnt hitting 15psi until 3300 rpm, but i was having exhaust leak problems at the time and it wasnt balanced perfectly either. my tune may have been off too, idk. I still have that turbo, i may get it balanced and give it another try.

but I really want to go with a T3 stage 3 wheel. The stage 3 seems like a good compromise between the stocker and a p-trim. as far as top end, i believe a good wastegate setup is necessary. i think you can go with a small turbine wheel, but you need to be able to bleed the boost off at higher rpm to maintain decent power up top and keep EGTs down.

If you look at most modern turbo setups, the turbines are tiny but have big wastegates. factory subaru TD04 turbine is only about 45 mm, but with a 25 mm wastegate. they peak at 15psi and taper it down several psi to redline. compare to FC, 63 mm wheel with a tiny 18mm wastegate, even though we flow about 40% more exhaust than the TD04. ours should be more closer to 35 mm at a minimum

 

unfortunatly gpop is a little too far for me ( perth WA is more remote than middle siberia )
else i would go like most and mill the turbine housing to fit as big as the P trim


i was considering the 60-1 ( 59/ 76 mm ) in 0.70 cover with the TA34 rear
expecting the TA34 turbine to fit and to behave a little like a back cut
to reduce backpressure slightly and push the envelope a little higher but longer in the rev range
-part way between stock and stage 3 turbonetics
also for sure will be a 360 thrust and dynamic front seal conversion

my current turbo ( 54.15/ 70 mm in 0.60 and with a steel 270 bearing ) runs a custom dump/ backing plate with a 3 inch exit
( s5 double wastegate and adjustable can )
and this will be going on the rear of the new one

 

I just got around to finally measuring up my hybrid turbine wheel that I had lying around. This wheel came in a turbo I got from someone on the forum that said it was a "panspeed" T04B hybrid.

Anyways, my caliper is digital, and it apparently no longer works. What I got from the shitty scale on the side was almost exactly the dimensions Bumpstart posted. It's really hard to say, but as of right now (until I get a new caliper) I'm pretty well convinced the TA34 wheel fits in both the S4 and S5 housings, without modification.

 

confirmed.. fits.. also a nice touch is its a reverse ( left hand ) threaded nut ,, much more open than the stock turbine wheel,, expecting some increase in lag but a big fix on the boost creep

i have put it together with another U trim compressor wheel so that i can quantify the changes more directly

stock and t34


t34 closeups





t34 ( also turbonetics stage 2 and panspeed ) , stock ht18s 2s, and knightsports rf 320 turbine comparisons




t34 and stock

rf 320 and stock

t34, stock and rf 320

 

nice surprise,, win . win .. wheel is more back cut and this has effected the pressure ratio and so on same wastegate settings with same compressor wheel i now have boost earlier and yet it is peaking 2 psi more

i was expecting to see the closed loop boost control overshoot on the old settings due to back-pressure reduction

earlier boost was not expected.. and is a very welcome surprise
i now have a U trim to4b .060 front and have response like a stock turbo ..
i can only surmise that the new ta34 turbine wheel is a fair bit lighter ,, it doesnt have the mass of the shrouded section against the heat shield like the ht18s and knightsports wheels

 

That's awesome. I thought that I had some sort of weird wheel, but I KNEW that my housing wasn't machined for anything else to fit.

Where did you source the turbine wheel?

 

so the ta34 has better response than the stock ht-18 wheel?
How much higher in the rpm can it hold full boost?

 

Garrett TA34 Turbine Shaft Wheel 451311 0002 | eBay

sorry , very busy atm , not had all that much time to test things , and think i might have already missed the window to get on the rollers before xmas to quantify it

i had same compressor before on a stock rear and the ta34 version spools much better,, cant test full boost as my fuel system is marginal to sustain above 350 BHP ( LPG gas carb , single model E convertor )

i am making 12-14 psi on previous closed loop settings that held around 10 psi
and that is also with an audible boost leak that is letting go above 10 psi , audible to redline in third gear

.. i have had various highflows for over a dozen years of daily use, i reckon the only combo i havent yet tried is the 60-1
they are all at least a little worse than stock in terms of spool...some worse than others
.. this one isnt radical on the front.. and is a more matched rear ,, and already is by far the best spooling highflow i have had in all that time

 

Nice work, bumpstart! So, it has been 6 months. Are you still happy with the TA34 turbine setup?

Do you think the wider turbine could create clearance problems if the turbo develops shaft play?

I'm seriously considering the TA34 for my build.

 

ive got a couple of these turbos out there working aok
.. mine works very well and has a consistent boost curve without the nasty bell shape the stock one gives
still with s5 internal gate and a 3 inch custom turbine backplate
.. recommended over all the other highflow turbine configs that are also prone to unspinning the front nut

 

So are you having the turbo assemblies balanced when you assemble? are you using new seals and bearings?

 

does a bear **** in the woods?

 

Ok i just thought that with all new parts you might have gotten away without balancing it if all new parts were balanced individually.

 

Thanks! I'm gonna order one of these.

 

Well, I'm very new to this turbo rebuild stuff, but from the looks of it, I should be able to use this cheap turbo for its compressor housing and wheel to make like a stage 2 hybrid.

Just wanted your guys' thoughts on this, help would be greatly appreciated

T4 T04B Turbo Charger AR.60 COLD AR1.0 HOT SUPRA MkIII 7MGTE 7MGTE

T4 T04B Turbo Charger AR 60 Cold AR1 0 Hot Supra mkiii 7MGTE 7M GTE | eBay

 

Looks like it's pretty close to a U trim T04B wheel.

(taken from RotaryRocket88)
Stock HT-18 compressor: 63.0 mm x 43.8 mm (exducer, inducer)

Common T04B Compressors

8 Blade T04B
Garrett PN, exducer x inducer, trim, flow
409179-0021, 70x48.36 mm, 48 trim, S trim (37 lbs/min)
409179-0022, 70x49.50 mm, 50 trim
409179-0023, 70x51.61 mm, 54 trim
409179-0024, 70x54.00 mm, 60 trim, U trim
409179-0025, 70x55.37 mm, 63 trim, V trim (48 lbs/min)
6 blade T04B
409826-0006, 70x48.35 mm, 48 trim
409826-0012, 70x52.85 mm, 57 trim
409826-0014, 70x55.30 mm, 62 trim, V trim (48 lbs/min)
409826-0015, 70x58.40 mm, 70 trim, H trim (49 lbs/min)

The one you posted has a compressor inducer/exducer size of 53.90mm/69.31mm respectively.

The ebay china-charger should be ok, but you'll want to get a good rebuild kit with a 360 degree bearing. Source out a place to have the wheels balanced, and it may be a good idea to have the place check everything out for you. I'm forever grateful to Evergreen Turbo in Ocala, FL. They took my turbo and worked it over for me. They had to machine the CHRA, machine the shaft, straighten the shaft, and balance it. They provided me with a set of oversized bearings as well. Everything was nicely media blasted and returned within a very reasonable time, for a VERY reasonable price considering all the machine work that was done.

 

Cool, thanks for the reply there. But yes, looks like it's basically a U trim. I would've liked a v trim but it'll have to do, plus for the price I can't complain.

I just wanted to make sure this will actually work, not holding you accountable or anything but mainly wanted a second opinion.

But as for the rest of the turbo, I'll be leaving my CHRA as is. Mine looks to be rebuilt so ill just look at thrustwasher and decide from that. And I'm actually going to using a TA34 turbine like Bumpstart did. Seems like the added response and the fact that you get rid of boost creep makes it worth the dough.

And since I live way out here in the LA area, I'm going to send my turbo to place here in Camarillo. They quoted me $85 which I think is a hit steep, buuuuuut its local.