allignment rip off!?
 

well my girlfreinds 88 vert was tearing up tires so i had her go get an allignment at tuffy. i should have gone with her but i had to work so she went alone and they only adjusted half of the suspension and as you can see it was way out of spec. i want to go ask them some questions tomorrow but first i want to make sure i know what im talking about. can you guys look at this and give me any ideas on why they could not adjust some things. they explained why to her but she is car stupid so she didnt know what they were talking about. they charged like $70 so i was pretty pissed when i saw that they only touched the easy stuff. and if anyone knows, what is Included Angle and SAI??? because those are apparently WAY off. to me it looks like they charged $70 to adjust the toe on the front and then called it a day. well any input would be great, thanks

Really the only thing that can be adjusted is toe. It is "possible" to rotate the upper strut mount to alter caster and camber but it is a very course adjustement and requires more labor than you're going to get from a $70 alignment. On the rear toe is adjustable but camber is not. There is a ton of camber in the rear and that will lead to poor tire wear. That can't be adjusted out. Over time the springs sag (I'm assuming it's stock) and as they do the ride height falls and you get camber gain at all four corners. That equals bad tire wear.

SAI is Steering Inclination Angle. Basically the kingpin angle which again is not adjustable. The Included Angle relates to the kingpin angle versus camber and is not adjustable.

The rear camber can be made adjustable by purchasing and installing an adjustable camber link. It's less than $100 from Mazdatrix or the like and is very easy to install. The front camber will require either camber plates (expensive) or crash bolts (bad idea IMO).

Don't go off on the Tuffy guys. They didn't do anything wrong.

http://www.familycar.com/alignment.htm#Steering%20Axis%20Inclination%20(SAI )

well i dont have a problem with the rear camber, the tire wear is pretty even. i notice the toe on the left tire, it wears faster than the right. the outsides of the front tires are getting torn to shreds though, at first it looked like the camber was way off but i think its just because i was looking at the rear also with is fairly negative. so i guess that they are getting torn up while turning, thats where the included angle comes in right? i read the info on the link you gave but its a little hard to understand. is there anyway to adjust it???

Everything looks pretty normal except for that one rear toe.
On defense of the alignment shop, they don't know how to adjust it - most will tell you they can't.

The rear camber is excessive.
Is the car lowered?
Or the (rear) springs original and sagging?
You need a rear camber adjust bar or adjustable links to get rid of the rear camber.


-Ted

It does look like that they shop did all they can with the stock adjustment with the exception of the caster in the front. And i believe the out of spec front toe might have cause the uneven tire wear. Since caster is not a tire wearing angle. I would say that if the car doesn't pull to one side of the road the current ailgment angles would not cause further uneven tire wear.

ya stock springs and sagging. My 7 is the fast one, hers is stock and slow. she got it because she thinks they look cool and it was the first time she saw a convertible one. but like i said, im not worried about the rear that much. but on the front, they adjusted the toe but different on each side... and if anyone knows of a good way to explain what the Included Angle is, its realy bugging me not knowing what that is

http://www.familycar.com/alignment.h...ion%20(SAI%20)

I posted that link in my first thread. But it didn't come out as a link.

The toe gets adjusted differently on each side so that, theoretically, when the driver sits in the car the toe angles even out. There is also an offset to compensate for the crown of the road.

how much of your avrage alinment aplise to the FC being as we have the dtss (rear tires changing from toe out to toe or vice versa in in hard cornering / hard acceleration)

the only thing that they didnt do right is the L/R toe, they adjusted it but still not within spec, unless yours is so far out you cant adjust it back to spec.

kevin.

Front or rear?
It looks like the front was adjusted ok.
Most places will tell you rear toe cannot be adjusted.



-Ted

I remember when I had my old Caprice, it took them a couple hours toalign the car. A seasoned mechanic was teaching a newb how to align a fully adjustable car. It looks like they probably did the best they can do with worn suspension/steering components.

If you have a complaint against the facility you may file it with the State. On line complaint form @ www.michigan.gov/sos or call the complaint line 1-800 292-4204

note the : "L/R"

means left rear...at least thats the abbreviation we use in the shop i work at, sorry figured it was universal type of abbreviation.

and yea most places will sell you a two wheel alignment, btu if you notice the R/R wheel seems to have been adjusted, and the L/R was adjusted, just not enough.

unless im reading the chart wrong.

kevin.