Won't Start, I'm Stumped!!!
 

Hello Everyone,

This is another addition of the "rotary that won't start." The car is a stock '84 12A. I've solved the flooding problem. Now, when I crank it, it coughs, has combustion (I'm seeing smoke out the tailpipe), and it's turns over to a point where it should keep going on it's own. I feel like the starter is keeping the engine going, but it's not catching on it's own.

No vacuum leaks that I can find, the battery is fully charged, I'm getting a good spark, I just don't know what's wrong.

Anymore avenues that I can take? I'm stumped, don't know what else to try, and am getting really frustrated. Please help!

Thanks in advance,

Levent
legokcen@bellsouth.net

First thing is to not cook your starter!
Extended cranking WILL cook it.
Determine if the engine is flooding (flooded) or starved of fuel.
Remove and dry plugs.
Use a substantial vehical to jump-start your car. I've tried jumping a rex w/another rex, and then with my mini van. The difference was TREMENDOUS! (The rex could'nt supply the "umph" needed to deliver cranking charge.)
Turn the carburetor idle SPEED screw in 1/2-34 turn. This will up the idle, and get you running on partial main circuit.
Add a cap full...A Capfull! of oil in each primary. Don't add more untill you have gotten it to fire and burn it out.

Let us know how it works out and we'll go from there. The more details you supply us with, the better we can help you.

re-check your dizzy cap, rotor, wires, plugs, and the inside connections of your coils

make sure you battery is beyound fully charged and have something connected to it while your cranking to keep it charged

try only pulling the choke half way out and using the gas pedal to for the rest

Here's a little more detail on the starting saga. I replaced my engine about a month or two ago with a used rotary which had about 30K on it. It has good compression. I have everything stock except a racing beat header and presilencer. The first time I cranked the car after the engine replacement, it started right up. I unfortunately made the mistake of timing it wrong. Stupid me used the rear rotor to time it, so timing was way off. I drove it a day like this. I was getting a high idle I couldn't reduce without the engine running bad and was not getting full power from the car, so this made me realize it was timed incorrectly. Plus, I reread the workshop manual and realized that it said to use the front rotor. I'll chalk that one up to not following directions and now I've learned. Hopefully, I haven't destroyed anything. The battery was also not holding a charge.

So, I parked the car so I could work on getting it timed right and set the idle correctly. When I removed the plugs, they were very black and fouled (though they were only about a week old). When I went to work on it 2-3 days later (with the distributer set correctly), I couldn't get it started. It kept flooding and fouling the plugs. I'd dry them off, pull the engine fuse and crank the engine to clean it out. Then replace the plugs, put a capful of ATF in the primary barrells and try again. Repeatedly, I'd get flooding. Now, I think the flooding is not as bad, but I'm not getting it started. I'm trying not to kill the stater, but it's turning over fine. I've got the battery fully charged, the plugs clean, AFT in the carb, and I'm just getting coughing. It's trying to start. It's at the point where it should keep going on it's own, but when I let go of the key, it dies again. I've even dialed down on the idle screw.

I'm thinking of push starting it to see if that helps. Maybe that will drive the engine faster then the starter.

I don't know what else to try. All the standard methods of starting aren't working. Could I have done any damage to the engine with it timed incorrectly???

Thanks for the help,

Levent

May sound stupid but are you using full choke?

This is essential!
Pull out the choke knob all the way before cranking it.

Buy some new spark plugs and it will start right up. Try it. something happens to the plugs when the engine won't start and are pulled repeatly. I know when i brought my -SE back from the dead, i replaced everything like you did. had spark, fuel, compression, I ran out of options,,,,bought new plugs,just because, installed them and it started right up. BTW. i bought the cheap autolite plugs too.

I'm using full choke, and the plugs are 3 days old. I clean them after each flood and they still look new.

I can spend another $20 on plugs if it will start up, but these look really good.

Assuming your plugs are good and the timing is correct and you have good compression -
Look through the float level windows, front and back, to be sure the carb is not still flooding.
Use a small mirror to see the rear float chamber window.

This is an easy check. One of the needle valves could be sticking open. If it is the fuel will be above the top of the window. Just tap on the carb with a hammer to release the needle valve if it is stuck.

Good Luck

And of course....make sure theres fuel in it!!!! That can't be stressed enough!!!!!

Will it start on starting fluid? And stay running on it? Then we can seperate if its a fuel or other problem

yes definitely, try the starting fluid. it's how i found out my car needed a fuel pump. :D

Sometimes rotaries will get so flooded that NOTHING short of pulling them down the road will get them to start. My RX4 loaded up once and I spent three days doing EVERYTHING I could think of, even to the point of replacing the ignition system with an electronic distributor from an '81 RX7, replacing the wires with solid-conductor wires that I custom-made, new plugs, god it just went on and on. All that time I kept saying to my friend Klaus, "I think we should just pull it down the road", and he would start theorizing "well, if we have spark, and fuel, and the starter is turning the motor over fast enough... blah blah blah. Finally, I said "screw it, lets push it down the road with your REPU and see what happens."
That's right, it started right up with a belch of fuel out the exhaust. Klaus, in his typical German fervor, somehow felt it necessary to kick in the secondaries while he was pushing me, which tore up the rubber bumper guard on my RX4. Not good.
A few months later, Klaus calls me on the phone and says his REPU won't start. So I tell him I'll come pull him down the road with my Courier. Again with the theorizing...
Finally, he calls me back and says okay, let's pull it down the road. So I go pull it down the road at about 15-20 mph (Klaus suggested 35-40) and the thing starts right up.

The moral to this story is that sometimes you can theorize about WHY the thing won't start 'til you're blue in the face, and all it really needs is a tug down the road.

I have a 82 & 85 with a 12a motor. I set my timing by aligning the apex seal with the first spark plug hole in the front on top dead center the hole and then setting the rotor cap at one o'clock. Both start with no problem and then you can set your timing per the Hayes manual.