SE injection to 12a
 

Done a lot of searching here trying to find some examples of this having been done, but never found anything detailed on the actual swap.

My question is, if I modify an RB LIM to accept the SE primary port injectors, it should be a plug and play match up correct?

I know things like that ECU and fuel pump relay will be a pita, but Im mainly concerned with the actual fitment of the manifold, how the fuel rail will be done for the primary injectors, and whether or not the stock SE tune would be okay to use for the 12a.

the LIM im talking about is the sidedraft lower from RB. it uses the same upper mounting flange as the gslse upper and sidedraft upper.

I think the SE upper will fit. Also you'll need to do a lot of wiring I would imagine for the ECU to
work. I doubt the stock tune will work, probably be rich.

Can I ask why you don't just swap in an SE 13B if thats what you want?

i can't think of a reason why it wouldn't work.

The injectors are in the center iron

i've thought about doing this, i think it would work really well, as the efi system would go from being a little small to a little big.

the only real hurdle is the injectors, it wasn't worth building a 12A with a GSL-SE center... if you can put the injectors in the intake, it should be ok

i can't imagine the wiring to be all that hard, its probably like 5-6 wires and a relay or two? if you have an 84-85 car all the holes are in the body for the airbox and wiring and stuff too

I didn't want to rebuild my 4-port 13b to include a gsl-se center iron when I went EFI, so i did this.

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Isaac

not trying to speak out of turn, but i think he already considered that ...

sweet! :nod:

Why not just use a Edelbrock's TBI and a holly intake manifold?

bc 2k dollars for craptacular TBI is a joke.



Also, I own one. Throttle response sucks, and 18 mpg.

and the reason I wont swap in an SE 6 port is its impossible where I am lol. I have no shop to do the swap in, and absolutely nobody will touch it in terms of the labor or even loaning me the space/time to do it.

Ive posted on the forums here a few times looking for people in my area to help me out with it, but I never seem to get any real support here on the forums.

The 12a car in question is currently the only car I have to drive to work, and it has a POS "holley defect" RB 465 on it getting a craptastic 11 mpg and running like shit every waking day I drive anywhere. Damn thing was delivered to me with a defective PVC, ruined throttle shafts, and a crack in the main body below the choke tower and STILL rb refuses to exchange it unless I send my carb (basically my ride to work) back to them so they can drool on their shitty workmanship for 2 weeks.

I have the SE in storage and very much want the reliability that car had. It seems like the best way for me to do that is try to get its injection on my car, and call it good.

Although I would be interested in ways to tune the stock ecu for the 12a. I dont want it running pig rich like the holley does...

also, shouldnt the SE injection being a flow meter type level itself off and not be exceedingly rich? I thought that was the major advantage of this type of injection.

Good enough reasoning for me. :D

I just saw that TBI in a jegs catalog... Never had any personal experience with it, but it looked coolish.

I get about 15-18 on my 600cfm... But the flame balls are to die for. LOL


In the mean time (this project looks hella interesting, however time consuming) have you thought about ripping a 465cfm quadrajet or holly/edelbrock off a junkyard car and using the body of it to fix/replace your existing carb?



EDIT: there is a local Chaztownian that is selling something you might be interested in..
http://charleston.craigslist.org/pts/3653706448.html
I can inquire for you if you want.
Its a 6 port for a 12a...

the idle is adjustable, 1100-3500ish is run from the 02 sensor, and after that it uses the AFM, so it should be fine?

it actually runs lean on the 13B if you have an exhaust...

thought so.


And no using a junkyard main body for the rb 465 wont work bc they modify that too. Id need ANOTHER complete rb 465 to fix mine. sad thing is most of my current one would just be thrown away.

Never seen such a heap of crap put over on a customer before. Besides that, I bought one from them in 2008, and it had issues too. I had to "fix" that one with one of the engineers help. Turned out to be a mishapen hole in the metering block that THEY drilled.

Further, no more carbs for me... tuning feedback is often misleading, and that dcoe doesnt even have a choke.. I DD this I dont need any worse mpgs or drivability

Just get a complete 465 from a small block in a junkyard it doesn't have to have RB stamped on it to work. There is bound to be one somewhere, and it shouldn't cost much more than 30-40 bucks.

Then get the box of jets & rods from Holly. I used my existing O2 bung to tune mine (however the po did tune it pretty good), or get an exhaust anylizer. Or go to a dyno shop; I belive they tune carbs, but I've never been to a dyno shop so I cannot say for sure*.


* I want to REAL bad, but I can't seem to find the dough. Or rationalize the expense. :(

Funny, I recently made an adapter to put a 4 port intake on my 6 port engine! The intake is for twin DCOEs.

Dont mean to sound like a dick, but this is misinformation. The RB 465 main body IS DIFFERENT. The venturi inlets and air bleeds are different diameters, and the vac. signal to the PV passage is larger. The pump squirter is different, and the actual bleeds leading to the throttle plate are drilled out. A standard holley main body will NOT be the same.

Further, there are no "rods" on a holley square flange carb.

Slowly learning more about the SE injection sys and im sort of building my own "kit" out of what I have to make the install simpler.

Im going to try to pull the harness from the SE computer all the way to the fuel pump relay back to the pump and run it separate from the GSL wire harness.

Everything else should be plug and play... I think.


Im seeing a possible problem with the alternator placement on mine though. The intake mani is about 9.5 in long, and I only have around 10" of space atop the motor behind the alt. Im hoping that the RB lower alignment backs the stock upper like the stock SE mani does so it can sit closer to the firewall and give me more room for the alt.

I REALLLLLLY dont wanna mount my alt lower bc I still want my AC :(

I'm saying throw away your COMPLETE carb and get another used COMPLETE carb from a junkyard.

I see the missconception. I'm saying to replace the whole carb not just the body.


It just seems like less of a pain in the ass than manufacturing an injection program.

Yes, let me spend money on another craptacular carb that will run even worse than what I have now.

You really think RB just slaps their name on a holley carb? Its totally different, fuel curve, emulsions, pump shot, pvc signal, jetting...

Buying an off the shelf or used holley "465 cfm" carb doesnt solve anything at all... it will still run like crap because its not tuned for the engine. Just jetting a holley to "run" on a rotary is far from making it run right, let alone to make power with it. Please dont suggest anything more on the topic, its misleading to those less educated on the carb set ups doing what little research the search function this site provides.

I made this thread about swapping the factory style GSL-SE long runner injection sys onto a 12a. Because that is what I want. This is not a thread I made about troubleshooting or solving a holley carb issue. I made 3 of those and nobody cared then either...

I guess to put it in perspective, if you made a thread tomorrow called "t2 swap" and then mentioned in your thread you were doing the swap because of a blown engine it would be like me suggesting you just rebuild your original repeatedly "because its not as much of a pain in the ass". If you have comments towards the topic, please comment. Or any info ive missed actually using the search function would be helpful.

When I went turbo on my 12a I ran all 13b injection using a custom made adapter plate like posted above.
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If you want to run the gsl-se injection it shouldn't be too hard,12a racing beat lower intake and gsl-se upper.you will have to modify the intake to accept two injectors,the closer you place them to the block the better your idle and throttle response would be.i have never wired up a gsl-se computer but I have done quite a few second gen efi swaps on old schools and wasn't complicated at all,first gen efi should be easier since its fuel only.

Not if you put them in the adapter plate like i did. IIRC the 12aT had a nice little intake manifold that used a throttle body almost the same as a -se throttle body.


Isaac

What intake set up did you run?the gsl-se being so low I don't think there's much room under there to fit a fuel rail and injectors.then if the racing beat intake is lower than stock it would be even harder,if its taller than stock then maybe possible but I'm not too sure on that

It will be very close, the SE injection is cery cramped in that area above the lower intake mani, but only because theres two oil injectors there as well. My 12a is premix, so I dont think ill have to worry about that. If nothing else I can put the injectors somewhere else, but where did you guys get your blank fuel rails?