ThirdPedalNirvana

Hello eternally helpful people,

I am currently changing the oil on my 12a 1985 GSL. It has all emissions equipment intact because I live in California. It also has the stock beehive oil cooler.

I'm noticing the the oil has a greenish tinge to it. I don't see puddles of coolant in the oil but the oil is definitely greenish. My Coolant reservoir was also nearly empty, but the car was completely cold when I checked.

The Coolant system has absolutely no oil in it. It's clean and clear, and the Coolant is fresh as I've only put about 3000 miles on the car since I flushed it. Most of the forums I see on this subject are talking about oil in the Coolant, and one thread made a reference to lung butter? I'm having trouble understanding what that is. Could that be causing my problem?

​I don't want to hear that I need to pull my engine and replace my seals... Unless I actually need to pull my engine and replace my seals. The car runs great otherwise.

​​​Thoughts? Thank you for your input..

7aull

iTrader: (2)

Well, for engine coolant-failures, the Big Tell is cold starts. If there is a nice big plume of white-ish smoke on startup, with a distinct tinge of coolant-smell, then you have probably have a water-jacket-to-combustion-chamber leak.
You say the coolant reservoir is...empty? Meaning it has "been emptied thru driving"? and not back into the reservoir on cool-down? To your oil? possibly. How fresh was the oil?
Oil colored to the point of a green tinge is pretty...dramatic.
If your reservoir tank is being actively drained, with no recovery, like you seem to say, then you may be pretty well along in the Failure of the engine.
Cars with failing water seals can run just fine. For a while. (Don't ask me how I know...).
"lung butter" is a symptom, not a cause, and is a build up of a "buttery" goo around the oil filler pipe entrance by moisture mixing with the oil. Do you see this?
More folks will step in here I expect...

Stu Aull
80GS
Alaska

t_g_farrell

iTrader: (1)

How often do you change the oil?

ThirdPedalNirvana

There is white smoke on startup, but it's no more than what I understand is normal for 12a's, because they start out running very rich due to the poor compression when the engine is cold. The white exhaust smoke smells like unburnt gasoline, as is normal. I know from experience (in both my other cars) that a faulty fuel injector stuck open creates white smoke. I will check to see if I can detect a coolant smell but so far it just smells like its running rich.

(edit) A little bit of research online says that white smoke is burning coolant, black smoke is extra fuel, but this directly contradicts my experience. I've had faulty fuel injectors get stuck open in BOTH my 1991 300zx and my 2015 Golf TSI, and both times the cars generated plumes of white smoke. I know 12A's are supposed to make some smoke when they start because they start running so rich. Is this smoke supposed to be black?

The reservoir wasn't entirely empty, but it was very low. I don't know what you mean by "back into the reservoir on cool-down". The way a coolant system in a car works is when the engine cools down the coolant contracts and the reservoir level lowers. When the engine warms up the coolant expands and the reservoir fills. When I checked this my car had been sitting for a day and was completely cold, so the reservoir shouldn't be full... but it was below the "min" line on the reservoir so I added water to it. The last time I filled it is when I replaced my coolant, so my point is my coolant seems to be going somewhere, but not in any hurry.

I changed the oil and the coolant 3000 miles ago.

The green tinge was only visible with a flashlight shining directly at the oil draining into the black oil pan. It's primarily brown as you'd expect but there is a definite tinge of green. It's not neon green.

Like I said, its been 3000 miles and the system has lost only as much coolant as is between the max and min fill line on the reservoir, so it doesn't seem to be draining very fast (the engine consumes oil with the OMP at a faster rate).

I won't ask how you know that cars (rotary cars?) with failing water seals can run fine for a while. Can you tell me what to look for as symptoms of the problem worsening? Or what to expect after "a while"?

At this point I'm thinking I might just keep driving with regular oil changes and checking the coolant level and see how it goes. I have 2 other cars so it's not like this is my daily, but I don't want to run the car if I'm going to ruin the housings, rotors, etc somehow, you know, the parts that are hard to find replacements for. As long as I don't overheat the engine or run it out of oil should I be fine?

Has anyone ever used coolant stopleak in a 12a? My dad says it's great for small leaks. With the unique design of the rotary I would hesitate to put any product which says "works in all engines" into it without checking with other rotary owners first.

I haven't seen this, no.

If my oil cooler (beehive) is going bad, would it leak coolant into the oil? My understanding is it does the reverse. My coolant is beautiful and has no oil or other particles floating around in it.

Qingdao

iTrader: (3)

Don't use stop leak... Just don't. It is like putting a winter coat on your coolant jacket and on your radiator. It will reduce heat transfer from your engine to the coolant and will reduce the heat transfer from your coolant to the passing air through your radiator. Its just a bad idea IMPO.

I don't think you are seeing coolant in your oil. Oil and water don't mix. And when water is in your oil it gets all kinds of stirred up. It will come out like a milk shake; not like some at the bottom (unless you let the car sit for several days). The oil feed tube is pretty low and its going to suck up an water in the oil and make a good slushy when it passes through the engine.

Gasoline and oil do mix (to a degree). Gasoline does come into contact with oil in a rotary through the oil control rings in the rotors. How many miles are on the engine? Something to think about.

Ckforker

Have you thought about the intake o-rings leaking? Your issue sounds similar to mine and after taking the intake off the rubber was degraded and I could see where a small amount of coolant was getting by. Dirty oil often has a greenish hue.

7aull

iTrader: (2)

My Bad - you are correct as to coolant flow direction. Apologies.
The reservoir wasn't entirely empty, but it was very low. I don't know what you mean by "back into the reservoir on cool-down". The way a coolant system in a car works is when the engine cools down the coolant contracts and the reservoir level lowers. When the engine warms up the coolant expands and the reservoir fills. When I checked this my car had been sitting for a day and was completely cold, so the reservoir shouldn't be full... but it was below the "min" line on the reservoir so I added water to it. The last time I filled it is when I replaced my coolant, so my point is my coolant seems to be going somewhere, but not in any hurry.
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Like I said, its been 3000 miles and the system has lost only as much coolant as is between the max and min fill line on the reservoir, so it doesn't seem to be draining very fast (the engine consumes oil with the OMP at a faster rate).
That is loss at a pretty good clip, based on my SA experience. Not a "terminal" loss. Yet. But it would seem to point to coolant going "somewhere" and if there are no obvious external leaks, then that leaves the engine...?
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I won't ask how you know that cars (rotary cars?) with failing water seals can run fine for a while. Can you tell me what to look for as symptoms of the problem worsening? Or what to expect after "a while"?
My SA has been "smoking" for several years, but is getting progressively "smokier" on cold starts. Like yours, once started, mine runs beautifully. Eventually, as the amount of coolant in the combustion chamber increases with each drive/park cycle to the point it becomes harder and harder to start. In my case this has been 4 yrs of summers-only driving.
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At this point I'm thinking I might just keep driving with regular oil changes and checking the coolant level and see how it goes. I have 2 other cars so it's not like this is my daily, but I don't want to run the car if I'm going to ruin the housings, rotors, etc somehow, you know, the parts that are hard to find replacements for. As long as I don't overheat the engine or run it out of oil should I be fine?
Others may offer opinions, but I think if you watch the coolant and oil, just drive it. As long as nothing overheats, there is no damage to the housings.
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If my oil cooler (beehive) is going bad, would it leak coolant into the oil? My understanding is it does the reverse. My coolant is beautiful and has no oil or other particles floating around in it.[/QUOTE]
Can't say because I have a FMOC. Clear coolant is a good sign, since any failure eventually cross-contaminates BOTH oil and coolant...

I would suggest tracking down a gasket/rebuild kit ASAP since the 12A ones are getting hard to source. I think Atkins still sells them...

Stu Aull
80GS
AZ