SP_Rocket

Hey guys Just wondering how difficult is it actually to swap to a LS engine? Here's my situation, I had a Silver 93 fd and sold it. I loved the car but ANYTHING I did to it then it wasn't CA smog legal and I didn't want to deal with that. After selling it come to find out I can go to a state reff and have everything legalized going to an LS! Soooo I found a shell that I should be getting here in a few weeks. A 94 fd montego blue with tan interior, everything is there except motor/tranny. So I was thinking of an LS2/t56 build, all motor, no turbo and I want at least 400rwhp. This will be my first ever build....I've never done anything like this. I can change brakes/oil little stuff like that but I want that proud feeling of "I built that" when I'm done. I may strip the car down and have it painted a blue or repainted montego blue, also adding in extra sound deadening material everywhere I can. I've read a bit of threads already and seen the Sticky detailed build and that looks tremendously hard to do...I know he fabbed up a lot but is every build like that?

stickmantijuana

iTrader: (1)

depends on who you ask. It's not a rocket science. It just takes money and lots of labor. If you're construction worker, you may think it's not that bad. If you sit on a desk and want to relax on the weekend, it probably won't be a good experience for you. If you have a set tight budget and breaking your bank to do it, it's not worth it. Just buy a used Z06. If you can't afford that, you most likely won't be able to afford the project.

SP_Rocket

Well Money isn't that much of an issue because I plan to have this as a project, no deadline of any sort. Ive been around cars my whole life (dad is a mechanic) but I thought I'd try and do this build myself without "much" help from my dad. Like I wouldn't know exactly where to start once getting the shell.

Littleguy

iTrader: (5)

There are a few good FD build threads out there, check them out and it will help you to determine your own process. My thoughts to easily handle this yourself is first and foremost, do you have all of the required tools and are they good tools? IMO not having things like a compressor and good tools to move heavy items around and into place will make it really difficult, while if you have all of the tools designed specifically to do jobs you will have to do it will make the swap as smooth, simple, and easy as possible.

valley

iTrader: (1)

The physical swap is almost never the issue (unless you do something dumb, like move the firewall). It's the wiring and in your case, keeping it commiefornia legal that will be the issue. Are you willing to live without PS or A/C? If not, enjoy spending more time and money. I cannot recommend enough extensively looking into EXACTLY what you need to keep is street legal where you live, making a list, and if you continue with the swap, making sure you hit every point on that list. Don't just go with, "oh, so-and-so said this", no, find the legal documents pertaining to what you're doing and read them. Call whatever inspection authority you have pertaining to these things and talk to them. If you can, record whatever conversations you have and take down the names of the people you talk to. Nothing is worse than finding out 2 years later you car isn't legal because someone misled you or an inspector simple wants to fail you for whatever reason.

This is going to be a lot of work. Maybe 10% of that work will be getting the engine and trans in the car itself.

SP_Rocket

As far as tools go I have it all to do the job including engine hoist and stand and all that. And yeah I want AC and PS it's about 108 degrees right now and gets down to about 90-95 degrees at night around 10-11 pm
The inspection part I'm going to have a shop help guide me with all that I need to do to get it legalized/ smog legal.

LargeOrangeFont

iTrader: (7)

Getting the car to pass a BAR test takes a TON more work than a regular swap. Head over to NoRotors and check out Daniel's build. He was trying to do the same thing. If you buy an LS3 E-rod it will be easy to get the car to pass the BAR in CA, it is just more expensive. But you also have a warranty on the engine, etc.

SP_Rocket

What is BAR?
And what's the big difference from the ls2 to ls3 other than a larger liter size?

LargeOrangeFont

iTrader: (7)

It sounds like you are in CA? If so you can't just swap the engine in your car and take it to a smog station to get smogged. If you swap an engine in CA the car must go through the BAR process and then it can be smogged as the car the engine came from. You need the evap and possibly even the gas tank from the donor car, OE manifolds and cats, EGR, air injection and anything else the car came with. It is easier to. It a wrecked car and transfer the parts needed over.

The LS3 is larger displacement and has rectangle port heads and intake. The older LS engines had cathedral port heads and intakes, including the LS2.

SP_Rocket

You mentioned earlier that a ls3-Erod (not sure what Erod is lol) is easier to get pass the BAR than a ls2 would be. So its easier because of how the motor is set up it makes it easier to install in the Fd or it makes it easier to maintain all the stock components?
What I've been reading is pretty much keep the motor and all accessories from the donor and into the fd (as stock as possible) then take it to the state reff and let them tell you what needs to be changed after that if anything.

LargeOrangeFont

iTrader: (7)

The LS3 ERod is a CARB approved engine swap. If you put in all the components it comes with, you will be fine at the BAR Referee. There is no gas tank to swap, no headers to make fit, you just have to run the cats it comes with.

But yes the way you described is one way to do it. That is the hard way.

SP_Rocket

Yeah I guess I'm going to have to wait to get the shell and see what kind of deal I can get on some of the LS engines, until then ill just keep reading up on who's done what. Also another question, being that the fd rx7 is pretty well balance front to back, in a road racing scenario is the rx7(ls2 or ls3) capable of being a better handler/traction than lets say an Evo that's all wheel drive?

MattGold

iTrader: (106)

MotoIQ did a good V8 RX-7 build... even a chapter dealing with passing Cali smog:
Project V8 RX-7: Part 13 - Goin' Legit

LargeOrangeFont

iTrader: (7)

Yes. You are basically asking if a c5 or c6 Z06 is faster around a roadcourse than an evo.

After the LS swap you basically have a car that drives like a lighter, smaller, more raw and direct feeling late model Corvette.

With a stock LS3 an FD will be about as fast as a c6 z06.

The cars that are around me on track now are 911 GT3s and GT3 RS, Vipers, z06/Zr1 Vettes, Ferraris etc... all with good tires and pretty good drivers. It is crazy how good the car is if you put some money into getting it dialed in. Oh and I have an FC.

stickmantijuana

iTrader: (1)

as for handling, if that's important to you, do yourself a favor and drive one. Pay a owner $100 if you have to before you plunge into it. I think LS swap RX7's drive like a pure unadulterated crap. I am not hating on the pistons. They bump steer like crazy and suffer from understeer. Most of these are due to moving the steering rack which messes up the steering geometry. We can argue all day about retaining 50/50 balance, center of gravity, torque, etc., but if you haven't actually driven one, I suggest you do before you commit to the project. If your definition of a nice handling is taking a single sweeping left hand turn at a bumpy 4 way intersection @ 40mph, you may think it handles just fine. so drive one before anything else. you may hate it despite the hype. I do think with single muffler, LS blocks sound amazing in an rx7.

SP_Rocket

Thanks MattGold for the link, I will be reading this on my lunch.

And awesome! You are right when I go to the track those vettes are movin! I'm excited to see what this car will be capable of after some time. My uncle has an evo putting down 400 to the wheels on e85 and all I want to do is top that faster around the track and in a 1/4 mile. My guess is this project will take me possibly a year to get it running and to pass the BAR.

LargeOrangeFont

iTrader: (7)

They have addressed bump steer issue with the bump steer corrected end links.

The new Sikky LS conversion leaves the rack in it original place and uses the original subframe. Pricing is not out on that yet however.

LargeOrangeFont

iTrader: (7)

That should not be any problem at all. Where in CA are you? There are plenty of guys with V8 swapped FDs around. I agree you should get a ride in one.

SP_Rocket

I just now saw stickmantijuanas post. Yeah the guy I'm suppose to get it from I believe has one or a buddy that has one, I should ask to drive it. I've driven v8s and I've driven a regular fd rx7 with the 13b rew but never a swapped fd rx7. Now I am curious about asking around and opinions on how they handle. I have a Evo X right now and the turning radius sucks as far as u turns go but driving through a canyon or anything else it's great.

jimbo03886

I have no issues with my LS6 RX7, drives great, handles great, and in my opinion it was a very easy swap. I didn't have to deal with smog or anything like that though, just a safety inspection from North Carolina. I am not sure about the LS2 but I know my LS6 comes factory without smog pumps, EGR, or anything like that, just a couple cats, may make a swap easier without having to deal without all that stuff. Right now I am putting down 355hp on a completely stock motor, just a tune. I am getting a cam shortly and should push me to 420 with ease. So your 400 hp goal is easily doable. I say go for the swap, you will love it. Oh and upgrade that rear end, I just did a 8.8 swap and its awesome