Nathan21.

Need some advice got a fd and doing a few upgrades and one happens to be to the omp, so I have heard story's about this lovely device and instead of removing it I want to attempt to make it better now I'm doing the 2 stroke mod where the omp has a container and takes clean oil from that but from what I have heard it doesn't solve the oil issue, knowing that if you mix 2stroke with the fuel oil goes everywhere inside the engine from the spray affect of the injectors now can the upper intake omp oil injector be changed to do the same fine mist spray to mix the oil with air instead, taking for the hole in the housing being deep don't think it can be done with that as even with the spray by the time it gets the the bottom of the hole it just be the same.

Zepticon

iTrader: (1)

You need a lot of pressure to mist the oil like fuel, since its thicker.

Sgtblue

iTrader: (16)

Personally I recommend to most owners that the OMP be kept too. Using an OMP adaptor to source two-cycle oil is a good option to sourcing it from the sump. If you're worried about good dispersal within the housing/across the seals, then I'd suggest pre-mixing WITH the OMP. Simply add something less than .5 ounce per gallon of fuel. It helps to cool hard seals and you get a bit more lubrication, but shouldn't see a noticeable increase in smoke.

OG BBF

The mikuni pump is meant to be more efficient and reliable than the Denso unit. It's worth the upgrade if you can get hold of one. Some good info on this on the forum m, just have a search.

Nathan21.

The point to this is that I could just get anyone to jump in and drive the car (in theory, just say keep this and that top up and don't turn off when cold) is there any way of trying to mist the oil anywhere or would it not make a differences, just trying new ideas while I'm doing this to see if it can help with lubrication

Sgtblue

iTrader: (16)

Not sure exactly what you're looking to do, but this is my understanding.....

There are three things that happen when oil is introduced into the chambers,... lubrication, cooling and increased dynamic compression. MAZDA designed the OMP system so that owners wouldn't have to worry about it. It was idiot proof and they didn't have to tell the new owner they had to add oil at every gas stop. But it wasn't ideal. It's introduced just before compression and at least with the S6 models, dispersal wasn't perfect. That and the 3 pc apex seals used back in the day led to housing wear. It also introduced oil with at least some contaminants that wasn't designed to burn. Options to the factory OMP system are:
*Remove OMP and premix at ~ 1 oz. per gallon.
*Keep OMP and pre-mix at ~ .5 oz. per gallon.
*Add a adaptor that allows the OMP to source 2 cycle.
*Change OMP to a Mikuni as mentioned above. (the injectors can also be changed but as I understand it, the later designs weren't perfect either)
*Keep OMP, pre-mix at a reduced rate, and add water or water/methanol injection.

All options have some downside. If you pre-mix only, you CAN NOT forget. If you run the adaptor, you can't let it run out. There are costs involved and in the case of changing to a Mikuni pump or adding the OMP adaptor, doing so with the engine in the car is definitely not a walk in the park with the stock twins. There are also packaging issues when locating the oil or WI/AI reservoirs.
I can tell you what I did to my own car, but it's not my intention to sell you. Sounds like you've already done some research and you can decide for yourself.

Nathan21.

I'd like to hear what you have done, I'm only trying ideas was thinking of changing the ac compressor for a external oil pump and pressurising a system using a pressure regulator and idea was to use a small 28 or 30cc injector to inject the right amount of oil somewhere it was going to make it to the chambers first idea was to put it after the butterfly valves but got told the oil would all burn up before it made it, I then thought of the housing plug but got told it was too deep and the spray affect wouldn't happen and it would still dribble out ( still liking this spot maybe design a plug so the injector sits in further) last place was the upper intake manifolds oil injector but not got a answer from this one, the injectors would fire on a separate small ecu that I would program with engine speed or just run off the fuel injector signals

Sgtblue

iTrader: (16)

Not a tuner or big-brain but personally I think you're over-thinking it. Lubrication must be introduced during the intake phase. With both the OMP and some premix I think dispersal is probably as good as it gets given the size and shapes we're dealing with. The premix is cleaner burning and without contaminants, but stops when injector duty goes to zero during deceleration. On the FD the OMP is rpm AND load dependent...which maintains at least some lubrication during decel. So IMO the two sort of compliment each other in that respect. Your proposed systems seem complicated. A failure, especially if unmonitored, could be catastrophic.

Since you asked, I do both. Again, I'm not a big-brain, but I have the stock OMP with stainless lines and also premix at ~ .5 oz. marine 2-cycle per gallon..guestimating at the pump. I also have a simple boost-activated water injection system. Green LED on my dash lights when the pump activates, Red LED lights up to let me know when water level is low. WI means I don't have to worry about carbon from the additional oil. Reducing carbon helps keep the seals free and allows better lubrication from the oil that is being delivered. Equally important, during it's phase change in the combustion chamber water carries out much more heat with the exhaust, cooling those hard seals and significantly reducing load on the rest of the cooling system. Since engine temps don't spike during periods of boost, stress on coolant seals is also reduced. Car is streeted and focus is on being simple and reliable at just over stock boost levels. All mods are in my sig.
There is a AI section with on the forum with a lot more info in the stickys.

Aaron Cake

iTrader: (1)

You are way over thinking this. If you premix, then distribution is about as good as it gets.

Turn that brain power into an Arduino powered automatic premix system that automatically blends the appropriate amount of oil into the fuel tank when the car is filled up.

Yep, that's on my list of things to do...

Syrup_710

If you have an Apexi pfc you can program the injectors to never fuel cut on decel, so lubrication is always maintained (even if you have premix only), the extra fuel cools everything down since it's mostly not being combusted in the housing, oh yeah and it doesn't lean out!! Definitely worth a purchase if you don't have one, I really think these 3 variables being neglected are the main cause for the well known 70k-110k mile blown engine.

Sgtblue

iTrader: (16)

Yeah well since we bumped this old thread yes…with a PFC and, I suspect, other stand-alones you can play with fuel during decel. But if done properly and if just premixing, fuel is still going to be reduced significantly. And that’s often while the engine is at high rpm. Probably what MAZDA was trying to avoid when they made the OMP output dependent on both load and rpm.
And imo what little unburned/unused fuel that’s vaporized during decel does comparatively very little to reduce load in the cooling system.

Also in my experience most rebuilds in that mileage bracket you posted on a FD are due to failed coolant seals. I guess it might technically qualify, but that’s not what I usually consider a “blown engine”. That’s almost certainly because the FD is force inducted which strains the seals. Something that I believe is helped by water injection I mentioned earlier in the thread.