Microtech Help with a map for a TII
05-05-14, 01:59 PM
#51
That would be awesome 3sum, if you could post up your map. I currently have silverrotors map installed and the car almost starts. I just stopped because I didn't have the constant yellow with the key switched on.
I will also check my settings on the other values that you list.
Thanks a bunch bro!
I will also check my settings on the other values that you list.
Thanks a bunch bro!
05-05-14, 06:32 PM
#52
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Concentrate on getting it starting first.
Calibrate the tps so yellow with ign on and yellow flashing while cranking.
Mine started straight up. the map is rich everywhere so safe and i will start leaning it out using the wideband.These figures are not 100% correct but will start the car.I am adjusting them daily so will give you the latest map once your car starts.
Idle map values should be 20hg .81 15hg 1.23 10hg 1.48
After all corrections ie water,crank etc i have final injection time of 9.9ms and it fires straight up.
Ensure your mixtrim is at 0%.
Calibrate the tps so yellow with ign on and yellow flashing while cranking.
Mine started straight up. the map is rich everywhere so safe and i will start leaning it out using the wideband.These figures are not 100% correct but will start the car.I am adjusting them daily so will give you the latest map once your car starts.
Idle map values should be 20hg .81 15hg 1.23 10hg 1.48
After all corrections ie water,crank etc i have final injection time of 9.9ms and it fires straight up.
Ensure your mixtrim is at 0%.
05-05-14, 08:36 PM
#53
The only other thing I know to do to the TPS is move it at the throttle body. The value in the MicroTech software is set as zero. Since the TPS load is showing 31% with the key on, doesn't that indicate that the position of the TPS is slightly off?
05-06-14, 04:49 AM
#54
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You can adjust it either manually on the throttle body or use the handset to adjust it.
Which ever way you do it it needs to show a * on the tps screen to show its set correctly.
usually you will get the * on 3 sequential numbers so set it to the middle one.
On screen 30 TPS Bottom line will read 00% PG*.
My tps drifts around a bit so good idea to check it regularly.
So screen 30 should look like
Opt TPScal +-xx(doesnt matter what this actual =-xx figure is)
+00% 30(or PG)* xxaS
Which ever way you do it it needs to show a * on the tps screen to show its set correctly.
usually you will get the * on 3 sequential numbers so set it to the middle one.
On screen 30 TPS Bottom line will read 00% PG*.
My tps drifts around a bit so good idea to check it regularly.
So screen 30 should look like
Opt TPScal +-xx(doesnt matter what this actual =-xx figure is)
+00% 30(or PG)* xxaS
06-07-14, 06:48 PM
#55
Well, we got back with it today. I checked the TPS and made sure everything was good and all readings on the voltmeter were within range/spec. My son was adjusting a few of the settings and getting the Microtech software to read as rx3sum stated, then we were going to switch over and take some of the mixtrim out. He was still in program mode and he says he starts pressing the arrow down key and all of sudden the injectors start firing all by themselves. I come over and see everything is in test mode all of a sudden. I've tried everything and every key on this laptop and it remains in test mode.
Any ideas?
JTB
Any ideas?
JTB
06-07-14, 07:20 PM
#56
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test mode is entered by setting number of cylinders to zero so this needs to be reset to 4.
After that you will need to recheck all the settings again in case some other values have accidentally been changed which could be fatal for your engine.Engines have been destroyed from your sons simple mistake.
Ive learnt with mine knowing im taking the risk.
Are you willing to do the same?
If not send it to a pro.Im happy to help get it going if you want to keep playing but you need to realise the risk you are taking.
You havent hurt anything yet but once its running and in boost any small mistake can end in tears.
After that you will need to recheck all the settings again in case some other values have accidentally been changed which could be fatal for your engine.Engines have been destroyed from your sons simple mistake.
Ive learnt with mine knowing im taking the risk.
Are you willing to do the same?
If not send it to a pro.Im happy to help get it going if you want to keep playing but you need to realise the risk you are taking.
You havent hurt anything yet but once its running and in boost any small mistake can end in tears.
06-07-14, 08:39 PM
#57
Completely understand. I am usually right on top of my son watching in case he slips. He is only 15, but he shares a similar passion that I have for these cars and the rotary and he won't learn unless he is taught and/or reads, reads, reads. I understand the risk and that's why I shut everything down when I heard the injectors firing.
Currently, I live in such a remote area that the nearest tuner would be 200 or more miles away. I am trying to learn this stuff so that I can understand it also. I'm a former network engineer so I am handy around a PC, but this mapping is kicking my booty. It appears in the near future, things will be changing for us logistically and should have a tuner close. I am just wanting to get this thing to fire up and idle and be able to move around on its own power. Before it hits the road, I will take it to a tuner for a professional to map this thing out.
I will confirm the full settings prior to trying to crank this thing again, after it is out of test mode. Thanks, as always, rx3sum. I really appreciate your kindness and willingness to help.
JTB
Currently, I live in such a remote area that the nearest tuner would be 200 or more miles away. I am trying to learn this stuff so that I can understand it also. I'm a former network engineer so I am handy around a PC, but this mapping is kicking my booty. It appears in the near future, things will be changing for us logistically and should have a tuner close. I am just wanting to get this thing to fire up and idle and be able to move around on its own power. Before it hits the road, I will take it to a tuner for a professional to map this thing out.
I will confirm the full settings prior to trying to crank this thing again, after it is out of test mode. Thanks, as always, rx3sum. I really appreciate your kindness and willingness to help.
JTB
08-31-14, 07:53 PM
#58
After all of this, life has been a whirl wind for the past 9 months. Moved across the country to South Dakota in November 2013, my dad dies two weeks after we get there. Then we face the coldest winter ever. Spring arrives and my son messes up the Microtech and we can't do anything other than send it back to Microtech. While the ecu is away, my only sibling dies, (speed up a little) and we move back across the country back to Alabama. to be close to my mom. New job, new home, new life, got the ecu back from Microtech and it is good to go.
I say all of this to say, with the help of a good friend, I am happy to report that.....
IT"S ALIVE!!!!!
There is still some tweaking to do, but the car has ran more this weekend than she ever has...and I have had this car since 2009. I will keep the thread posted as to what all we corrected once the car is fully running/running correctly.
Thanks to all that have helped thus far. The car wouldn't be where it is without your help.
JTB
I say all of this to say, with the help of a good friend, I am happy to report that.....
IT"S ALIVE!!!!!
There is still some tweaking to do, but the car has ran more this weekend than she ever has...and I have had this car since 2009. I will keep the thread posted as to what all we corrected once the car is fully running/running correctly.
Thanks to all that have helped thus far. The car wouldn't be where it is without your help.
JTB
good to here its running.
09-01-14, 08:10 PM
#60
After more tweaking today, the car now starts, idles and revs nicely enough that I can drive it to a tuner now.
Thanks to my old buddy Dave for the help.
EDIT: Forgot to mention that one of the main things that we did were pull a little timing out of the Microtech map that they loaded to my specs of the car, but what made the biggest difference and got the car to run right was to pull the 40 out of the mixtrim. Timing and everything was multiple times confirmed dead on where it was supposed to be and it still was dumping a ton of fuel and idling like crap....like it was trying to flood out. Pulled the 40 out of the mixtrim and she smoothed right out and began to rev freely. Thanks to those who suggested pulling the mixtrim back...I believe that was Aaron Cake.
Thanks to my old buddy Dave for the help.
EDIT: Forgot to mention that one of the main things that we did were pull a little timing out of the Microtech map that they loaded to my specs of the car, but what made the biggest difference and got the car to run right was to pull the 40 out of the mixtrim. Timing and everything was multiple times confirmed dead on where it was supposed to be and it still was dumping a ton of fuel and idling like crap....like it was trying to flood out. Pulled the 40 out of the mixtrim and she smoothed right out and began to rev freely. Thanks to those who suggested pulling the mixtrim back...I believe that was Aaron Cake.
09-07-14, 10:18 AM
#61
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Just remember to put the mixtrim back before tuning the car. Mixtrim is sort of a quick and dirty catch-all for situations like this but you don't want it at anything by zero when you start tuning otherwise you're tuning against already globally affecting settings.
12-03-14, 06:10 PM
#63
talking head
EDIT: Forgot to mention that one of the main things that we did were pull a little timing out of the Microtech map that they loaded to my specs of the car, but what made the biggest difference and got the car to run right was to pull the 40 out of the mixtrim. Timing and everything was multiple times confirmed dead on where it was supposed to be and it still was dumping a ton of fuel and idling like crap....like it was trying to flood out. Pulled the 40 out of the mixtrim and she smoothed right out and began to rev freely. Thanks to those who suggested pulling the mixtrim back...I believe that was Aaron Cake.
microtech doesnt spark the trailing coil pack while under the cranking threshold
..it will not spark there till there is more than 400 rpm on board
.. original map. set staging value to 50 % ...use 42 psi base pressure ( engine not running ) correct the timing calibration,, be sure TPS and water temp senders also happy ..then use a 550 map and pull 40% out of mix trim
with 1000 cc injectors.. its still not quite a 50% reduction in ms.. as there is latency times with a larger pintle to consider
you will find its closer to a real time 1.7-1.9 ms ( after corrections from the 50% staging value )
this would make look up table ( pre stage value ) be more like 1.2 ms ( + 50 % ) = 1.8 ms
..it will not spark there till there is more than 400 rpm on board
.. original map. set staging value to 50 % ...use 42 psi base pressure ( engine not running ) correct the timing calibration,, be sure TPS and water temp senders also happy ..then use a 550 map and pull 40% out of mix trim
with 1000 cc injectors.. its still not quite a 50% reduction in ms.. as there is latency times with a larger pintle to consider
you will find its closer to a real time 1.7-1.9 ms ( after corrections from the 50% staging value )
this would make look up table ( pre stage value ) be more like 1.2 ms ( + 50 % ) = 1.8 ms
12-03-14, 06:36 PM
#65
talking head
cool,, you can help yourself by taking a 550 map and applying 40 % time reduction across the board to it
( load and idle screen values )
before you enter it all in as the base numbers and return the mix trim to zero
( this will be the same as applying the 40 % mixture trim )
adjust your idle so that screens 15 in Hg and more vacuum all have a value the same, somewhere around 1.2 ms , and the staging value is 50 %
make double sure the vacuum point for the map sensor is not using a ported vacuum source
avoid especially the middle nipple on the front side of the phelonic spacer
( load and idle screen values )
before you enter it all in as the base numbers and return the mix trim to zero
( this will be the same as applying the 40 % mixture trim )
adjust your idle so that screens 15 in Hg and more vacuum all have a value the same, somewhere around 1.2 ms , and the staging value is 50 %
make double sure the vacuum point for the map sensor is not using a ported vacuum source
avoid especially the middle nipple on the front side of the phelonic spacer
12-03-14, 08:10 PM
#67
talking head
top or bottom of phelonic spacer , alt side
or the best spot is between the primary injectors on the LIM
( strongest vac point, from both primary runners, above injectors )
i put both the FPR signal and the MAP signal from there
careful to route the vac line higher than the reg before it goes into the cabin and or the map sensor
( this is so any fail in the reg drains to the motor )
or the best spot is between the primary injectors on the LIM
( strongest vac point, from both primary runners, above injectors )
i put both the FPR signal and the MAP signal from there
careful to route the vac line higher than the reg before it goes into the cabin and or the map sensor
( this is so any fail in the reg drains to the motor )
08-19-15, 08:57 AM
#70
Well, we are still at it and trying to finish tuning. The car has been on and off of the rollers for a few months now and it is still not correct. Now, we are having ignition breakup.
Last night, we, again, confirmed the CAS was stuck in the correct position. I am running a Gilmer drive and the main pulley/front cover timing pin was placed at 5 degrees ATDC. Once the car is running, from idle up to 4000 rpm, the car's leading timing is running approximately 15 degress BTDC. Continue to slowly rev past 4000 up to 4500 and 5000 and so on, the leading immediately switches to approximately 15 degrees ATDC. The trailing is rock solid and never moves no matter how you rev it (all of this being checked by a timing light). We discovered a ton on noise interference on the green wire out of the CAS, but everything looks good on the red wire out of the CAS.
Is there something in the LT8s that is causing the timing to jump nearly 30 degrees and the trailing not to move....meaning a tuning issue? Or is this a bad CAS (magnetic pickup)? Any ideas?
JTB
Last night, we, again, confirmed the CAS was stuck in the correct position. I am running a Gilmer drive and the main pulley/front cover timing pin was placed at 5 degrees ATDC. Once the car is running, from idle up to 4000 rpm, the car's leading timing is running approximately 15 degress BTDC. Continue to slowly rev past 4000 up to 4500 and 5000 and so on, the leading immediately switches to approximately 15 degrees ATDC. The trailing is rock solid and never moves no matter how you rev it (all of this being checked by a timing light). We discovered a ton on noise interference on the green wire out of the CAS, but everything looks good on the red wire out of the CAS.
Is there something in the LT8s that is causing the timing to jump nearly 30 degrees and the trailing not to move....meaning a tuning issue? Or is this a bad CAS (magnetic pickup)? Any ideas?
JTB
Last edited by jtbshaw; 08-19-15 at 09:52 AM.
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