AdrianE

I have an 1995 FD and have question to ask about connecting up my Haltech E11v2 to an MSD CDI system. This is for Leading output only. I've tried searching on this forum but there is something wrong with the search facility, it can't even find "msd" or "MSD"!

I know other people have used Haltechs with MSD 6AL's, but I have a Digtal 7Plus. The theory should be the same, yes? I just want to check the wiring of the E11v2 to the Digtal 7Plus, and some of the settings from the 'Ignition Setup' screen.

The MSD manual says the white wire is used for breaker points or electronic ignition amplifier output. So what about the ECU's ignition output then? Is this the same deal? If it is, I should connect this wire to 'Leading' from the E11v2?

Also about the 'Ignition Setup' screen; what values should I use? With the stock FD ignition system I am using:-
Spark Mode = Waste Spark,
Ignition Spark Edge = FALLING,
Dwell Mode = 'Constant Charge' ON,
Constant Charge time = 3.5ms,
Spark Break time = 1200micro secs

Should I use the same settings with the MSD? Or is it better to use 'Constant Duty' settings? Any help on this would be most appreciated.

Thanks,

Adrian

Claudio RX-7

iTrader: (1)

MSD's are traditionally Rising Edge, Constant Duty, 50% period. But technically.

13B-RX3

iTrader: (2)

Try the MSD forum, there is some good info on there also.

C. Ludwig

iTrader: (27)

What Cladio said.

You'll also want to use an ignitor between the Haltech and the MSD. The MSD will draw enough current on the driver to burn it up. I torched an E6X twice running a DIS-2 directly off the driver. Would run fine for 8-10 months then no ignition. Haltech sent out a memo to the dealers a while back about using the ignitor and we haven't had any problems since.

crispeed

Since I've been using Haltech ecu's and that's over 15 years I've never lost an ignition driver due to a MSD. I also never use an igniter with a MSD. The e6x is prone to driver problems no matter what type of ignition setup you use. It's the only ecu from Haltech that is prone to driver problems from my experience.

Claudio RX-7

iTrader: (1)

Yeah, i wouldnt use igniters between the haltech and the MSD either. I have also never had an ignition driver go on me either.

Oh, and i never got that memo, did you get that memo cris?

C. Ludwig

iTrader: (27)

Sorry, guess I made that part up.

/sarcasm


Here's a copy of page two of three. Received in February.


http://www.ludwigmotorsports.com/rx7/haltech_memo.pdf


Make of it what you will....

crispeed

What memo!

We were actually the ones that informed them of the problem and that memo was to cover their mistake on the early 'X' boards.
A very simple mistake turned into a problem for die hard MSD/Haltech users when the 'X' came out. Even after they corrected it I still had problems with certain applications that did not even use a MSD and were based around the stock ignition and igniters. Ignition drivers would shut down before you made it to the next corner! At least those were corrected with a simple change/update.
I have always said it and will continue to say this because I see no reason to even have the 'X' ecu in Haltech's line up. The software is full of glitches. I still carry two laptops when I have to tune a 'X' so I can manipulate in dos and windows to get the job done properly.
I have to say this on Haltech's behalf though and that is at least they are quick to recognise and rectify problems with their products. Can't say the same for a popular plug-n-pray unit. My only beef with them and I know Claudio is going to agree with me on this one because I would honestly like to know what are they waiting on to write the code in to apply the RX-8 trigger pattern to a rotary motor. If they don't get the ball rolling on this one soon they will get left behind on a market that's very open presently especially with other ECU brands starting to recognise this allready and have jump to the opportunity to capture the profits available in that market..

Claudio RX-7

iTrader: (1)

AMEN BROTHER!!

j9fd3s

iTrader: (3)

we sent haltech the rx8 trigger info right out of the new model training book in late 2003...

AdrianE

OK, thanks for the interesting info. I also had a look on MSD's forum. But, is it OK to run standard FD leading coils with MSD Digital 6 or 7 units? Will they burn up eventually with the sort of current (amps) the MSD provides? Should I stick to 'low' duty cycle 20%, or even use the constant charge setting on the E11v2? Or is 50% duty OK for 2-3hrs use on the road?

thanks,

Adrian

crispeed

Adrian
How do you have the ignition system setup presently?
Are you going to be running only one MSD on the leading ignition only?
If that's the case then the simplest method woud be to just wire the MSD between the igniter and the factory coils and leave the ignition setup on the haltech alone.
The factory coils are compatible wit the MSD as long as they are not too old or weak and suffering from leaks. With the MSD a leaking coil with small cracks will show up quickly. As for the digital 7 using factory type coils eliminates the reason for using that amp anyway. You need low resistence coils with those amps to get the full output most of which are for short duration use anyway.

crispeed

The problem is not the trigger wheel because they allready have the pattern in the ecu because it's the same as the suburu. The problem is applying the pattern to a rotary motor.

13B-RX3

iTrader: (2)

That was exactly what happened with my setup at first. It took me almost a month to catch it doing it. Throw those FD coils in the trash right away! Sorry about the crappy pic, it is really hard to take a pic of a spark.






I also had problems with my setup when running constant duty. I did as MSD advised and set it up as constant charge and all issues went away. I realize that many people have run constant duty with no problems but i did not work on my setup.

crispeed

The FD coils do last a pretty long time considering the enviroment they operate in. On the other hand the coils on the RX-8 fail before they leave the dealer's showroom. I use to like the FC coils very much and got very good results with them but as of late their age are starting to show up with a lot of them leaking. You have to be carefull with the FC coils because sometimes they are very difficult to detect when they are leaking especially when mounted to the stock bracket/igniter assembly.
Constant duty is the method for the older analog boxes like the 6A's etc. The latest digital boxes seem to prefer a constant charge. One thing for sure is that they all must trigger from a 'rising' edge signal.

AdrianE

Yes, I'm using the MSD for leading only (I've heard there's not too much to gain by running MSD's on trailing!). I was thinking of upgrading the leading coil to twin MSD coils (probably HVC II coils - 8261) and asked one of MSD's tech people on the MSD Forum if this will work out OK. Apparently it will work, but the output from each coil will be less (halved?). I will probably get the MSD HT leads too, as mine are just 8mm Moroso ones from a V8 I ran previously. Are there any better alternatives?

ATM I will just use 'constant charge' to the Digital7+, to be safer. I don't see any leaks from my FD coils yet!

j9fd3s

iTrader: (3)

oh so its even simpler?