fr7

As you may know , the euro FD FPR is not the same as the other ones : 2
vacuum hoses and 2 solenoids .
If someone has the euro FD workshop manual , i would like to know :
-why the euro FPR is different
- how it works
- how it is controlled by the ECU
- vacuum diagram
- ECU wiring diagram

Thanks .

hIGGI

iTrader: (7)

this is what i would like to know as well
i run into this on euro S5 TII , FPR with 2 hoses instead of one

fr7

If hIGGI doesn't know , who knows ?
Wim ? Can you get some infos about that ?

fr7

learn a little bit :

-two solenoids : prc2 connected to 4O ECU terminal(instead of EGR) and
prc1
-when fuel temp is above 50°C and below 80°C system works the same
as the US one during hot start : fuel pressure is raised to 2,5-2,6kg/cm2 . (only
prc1 is ON for 60seconds max )
-when fuel temp is above 80°C , fuel pressure is raised to 4kg/cm2 for the
first 30 seconds(prc2 and prc1 are ON) , and to 2,5-2,6kg/cm2 for the last
30 seconds(prc1 ON , prc2 OFF) .
-when fuel temp is below 50°C , fuel pressure is not raised(prc1 and prc2 OFF)

dznutzuk

iTrader: (1)

Just do it the easier way by just hooking it up straight to the intake manifold. If you run your car non sequential(for fd) which basically works like a single turbo you disconnect the solenoid which controls the fpr. Pressures for the euro fd I believe is 33psi, and the us version is 38psi. Remember that the us does run slightly higher pressure which churns out 255hp instead of the euro241hp. Or just do the safest thing and just buy an aftermarket fpr instead of trying to make the fd bolt onto the fc fuel rail and then figure out what pressure it will run, with a different pump an what not.

fr7

What are you talking about ?
I just wanted to know how the euro fpr works .
255bhp SAE , 241hp DIN , 240hp CEE...is there really such a big difference ?
Where did you see a so low euro fuel pressure ?
A Mazda mechanic (who has the euro FSM) told me that the regulated fuel
pressure is 250-260kPa(35,6-37psi) , so exactly the same as the US one...
And during hot start , when fuel temp is above 80°C , fuel presure is
raised to 392kPa ( 56psi ! ) for the first 30 seconds .

hIGGI

iTrader: (7)

just a question, where are u getting FUEL TEMP value???

and other question, would this rail with buildin FPR work if u cap one nipple and feed other one from manifold? which nipple use ?

fr7

fuel temp sensor connected to 1U ECU terminal
pression de carburant=fuel pressure
chambre de depression=vacuum chamber
collecteur d'admission=intake manifold
papillon=throttle
ralenti=idle
point mort=neutral
embrayage=clutch
pression atmospherique=ATM pressure
temps=time
t1=30s
t2=60s

hope this help

hIGGI

iTrader: (7)

FC does not have fuel temp for sure and uses same/similar FPR (EURO S5 TII).

I can`t read french, but isn`it AIR TEMP sensor? I don`t really think fuel gets up to 80C.

anyways, i guess i will test this FC fpr out (i have one at shop) with my fuel pressure gauge and let u know what it does. Wonder what it does when pressure (not vacuum) is applied to both nipples (if it gets higher than regular one nipple FPR)

fr7

No it is not AIR TEMP .
There is a fuel thermosensor on the FD fuel rail .
Maybe the FC uses another value...

In normal running condition , intake vacuum(or pressure) is applied to
both chamber A and B . I don't know how much is fuel pressure when
boost pressure is applied...
I think that if you apply ATM pressure to chamber B fuel pressure will be higher !

Rub20B

Hmm,

Now I see why european and us cars have different ecu's...

What will happen if I put a US ECU in an European car?

Rub

hIGGI

iTrader: (7)

With all stock crap it might be acting up, but if u run simple block with unnecessary stuff removed and blocked off, u will not notice it.

Back on topic. I just bought S5 TII which seems to be complete and stock, i will document how is dual vac. source for FPR routed there once i`ll have time to take it apart. Being busy by building engines on other cars last days.

rotary emotions

as far as I know it won't matter at all which ECU is in the car. Ask "multirotor" (Wim), I believe he actually did this. As for poweroutput, be carefull what you compare. SAE and DIN are NOT comparable. Even in Europe there's a diference: German FD's have 239PS, belgian (and most EU) have 241. BUT: all parts are 100% the same, and when you import a German FD to Belgium, it gets 241 on the paperwork. The only reason is a difference in MEASURING.
SAE reads higher because the look at PURE engine output (regardless of things like waterpump/alt/etc) where as DIN looks at REAL output (pure engine - power used by the engine itself to drive it's parts) So the same RWHP will have lower DIN hp than SAE hp.
Which is also why the german PS is aften used to refer to DIN, even PS of course is an exact translation of HP.
I wouldn't even wonder if a Euro FD and US FD would put down exactly the same numbers on a rolling road (in stock trim of course).
With SA/FB/early FC's (S4) it's a bit different, because of emission laws being different. (no cats in europe before S5 etc)

Rub20B

S4 TII's have 180hp here, S5 ones 200, but the S4 ones feel way more agressive than the S5 ones.. maybe due the twin scroll system..?

fr7

An euro ECU into an US FD will actuate the EGR valve only during
very hot start .

An US ECU into an euro FD will actuate the PRC2 solenoid instead of
the EGR one . So the fuel pressure will increase during medium
load and medium engine rpm if anything is modified .

No number 28 error code with the euro ECU(no EGR)
number 35 error code only with the euro ECU(PRC2)

Mireck 12A

offtopic, but in my opinion , yes

rotary emotions

Feeling, of course, doesn't have to mean they are faster/quicker/etc. To know the facts you'd have to line them up. It wouldn't be the first time that cars that feel less quick are faster.

Rub20B

Yes, if you line them up S5's will be faster, but S4's have greater response and low range power..

cruiser

And what is your conclusion why there are different ECUs ?

I'm running US M2 Stage3 ECU and also tried Pettit Unlimited from '94 car without any problems.

Nothing happens (problem wise).

rotary emotions

the question is: how different are they?

EFS.O

You are the man...I was looking to find the rats nets diffs between us and euro spec for a long time.

fr7

Euro FD rats nets .
Please correct me if you find something wrong .

http://img211.imageshack.us/img211/4...modifef3kw.jpg

hIGGI

iTrader: (7)

I would like to bump it up, i am just doing simplified sequential vac hose job and this is info i was looking for......

Big thanks to fr7 again!

whizzybang

I love to dig graves...

Higgi, i read you wanted to know how to hook your euro fpr when going simplified, can you tell me how please mate ?

Did you use both solenoids or none ? Dis you hook the fpr directly to the intake manifold ?

ThankS !

hIGGI

iTrader: (7)

Its very likely, that i probably used US/JDM spec rail instead (just one nipple, to keep it simple)